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Battery Degradation - How concerned should I be?!
- Thread starter EV-Rev
- Start date
I was concerned about a recent 10-12 mile drop in the rated range display on my MR Model 3 until I watched this video...
It makes a great case for leaving the display on battery percentage versus range. Essentially, if you can still charge to 100% you have virtually no degradation. Leaving the display on percentage and using the energy graph set on 15 miles and average range to project your realistic range has been working great for me. I've found the range display to be almost useless now as it really depends on what type of driving you're currently doing and how aggressive you are. I just completed a 27.3 mile test loop in the city where the speed ranged between 30 and 50 mph. I consumed 9% which equates to a range of 303 miles even though my car has an EPA-rated 264 mile range and currently shows 252 miles range at 100%. Additionally, for 12 of those miles, I used the navigation function and "Trip" tab of the energy display and consistently used less energy than the car thought I would along that entire route and arrived with 2% more battery than the car was initially projecting. Try the percent display and use the energy graph. You might end up liking it more than displaying range.
It makes a great case for leaving the display on battery percentage versus range. Essentially, if you can still charge to 100% you have virtually no degradation. Leaving the display on percentage and using the energy graph set on 15 miles and average range to project your realistic range has been working great for me. I've found the range display to be almost useless now as it really depends on what type of driving you're currently doing and how aggressive you are. I just completed a 27.3 mile test loop in the city where the speed ranged between 30 and 50 mph. I consumed 9% which equates to a range of 303 miles even though my car has an EPA-rated 264 mile range and currently shows 252 miles range at 100%. Additionally, for 12 of those miles, I used the navigation function and "Trip" tab of the energy display and consistently used less energy than the car thought I would along that entire route and arrived with 2% more battery than the car was initially projecting. Try the percent display and use the energy graph. You might end up liking it more than displaying range.
Third party apps should come with a warning label that it’s dangerous to your mental health as it causes battery obsession. What you’re seeing is perfectly normal. I would suggest you delete TeslaFi and just enjoy your car.
ratsbew
Active Member
Percentage makes no sense to me. If I see a road sign that says Albuquerque is 100 miles away and my car shows 150 miles of range remaining, then I have a pretty good sense that I'll make it. Combine that with the trip graph and all your worries will melt away.
We grew up with %age. Remember analog fuel gauges? Say you had ½ a tank, or 50% left to get to Albuquerque. No one complained back then, did they? Plus the trip graph is also in %age.
Your statement means nothing with EPA rated range as it's not indicative of your driving habits. I would suggest using percentage on the main screen and use the Energy app for remaining range.
ICE cars use percentage (fuel gauge) for the amount of fuel and then most cars supplement that with an option to show "expected" range till empty (based on driving habits). Teslas have this too and it's called the Energy App. If you want to know if you can make it that 100 miles to Albuquerque, then use the energy app to see if you can make it based on your car and your driving habits, same as an ICE.
Using the EPA rated range the Tesla uses on the main screen results in all these crazy posts we have of "I drove 15 actual miles but my range dropped 25" posts, should I take my car into the SC?" Further, the EPA rated range and displaying that as default has advanced the "range anxiety" phenomena we hear about in way more posts than is necessary.
darth_vad3r
Well-Known Sith
Yabut... we grew up with cars that could refuel almost anywhere, so range remaining wasn’t as important. If you ran low you could expect to refuel in short order, and quickly. If you ran out, someone could bring you a jerry can to get you going again.
As a quick glance, I agree with @ratsbew that distance on the battery gauge is much more useful than percentage. What good is percentage?
If you want a quick glance at the gauge to gauge if you have enough fuel to make a certain distance, then miles or km is infinitely more useful than percentage.
The energy app and all other estimators are equally useful and accessible to you regardless of if you have the gauge set to display %, mi, or km, right? So they are irrelevant to the argument as to whether %, mi, or km are more useful on their own on the battery gauge. Why use %?
I drive in km, I set it to km. I know that my dashboard km will tick down at a different rate than actual km based on driving better or worse than my car’s internal consumption constant, but at a glance I can easily tell how much range I can expect without charging ... without entering a trip into the nav or looking at the energy app charts. It’s right there all the time. At a glance.
darth_vad3r
Well-Known Sith
Percentage is completely not indicative of my driving habits though, so why use that?? LOL. At least EPA rated range is relatable. If I’m a hyper miler I know I can beat it, if I’m a lead foot I know I need a 50% buffer ... it’s relatable. Abstract % is useless.
Why?
I can use the energy app as a supplement in addition to the energy gauge. What’s the benefit to me of using percent?
This is an argument against Tesla offering the option, not against us informed users choosing to use distance over percentage display. Since the option IS available today, I’d like to hear a decent reason someone has for me to use the useless % number instead of the useful km number?
Let’s say there are two Model 3s parked in your driveway, and you need to make a 100 mi round trip, you check both cars quickly and one is at 50% while the other is at 60%. Which one should you take?
Oh, one is a SR+, the other is an LR. Wouldn’t the display in miles be more useful?
darth_vad3r
Well-Known Sith
That video was made by someone who admittedly didn’t know what he was talking about (read his responses to comments). He made several errors.
The EPA "310" or "240" miles is just an estimate based on their testing methodology. There is no way to drive like the EPA drive cycle (MCT procedure). Check out their procedure.
How the EPA determines an electric vehicle’s range - not as simple as it sounds | Torque News
How the EPA determines an electric vehicle’s range - not as simple as it sounds | Torque News
So what happened when you actually charged to 100% and let the battery balance? What did you see in the car / tesla app when you did that (NOT Teslafi?).
Wow--no. The % is just a fullness measurement. A battery can degrade and lose three fourths of its energy capacity, and the car will still report 100% when it has put in all the energy it is capable of, even if the actual energy storage has gotten pathetically small.
darth_vad3r
Well-Known Sith
This is outdated info. Not required any more. 90% is fine. Balancing occurs continuously. Recalibration works fine going a bit lower than usual and charging to 90%.
darth_vad3r
Well-Known Sith
darth_vad3r
Well-Known Sith
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