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Battery Drain Overnight.

init6

Member
Oct 16, 2020
741
441
Scotland
I wish I could tell you; but repeated tests show that the car goes “offline” with very limited battery loss with no logging apps, and does this “online/offline” pattern with excessive loss even with only TeslaMate turned on (I checked and am using the last version, I did this after revoking all the API keys as well). I am as dumbfounded as you are…
Is that an assumption that the car goes offline (it should really be asleep) because you see no battery drain or are you seeing it go offline via some other means?
You should raise an issue with Teslamate on their Github page. If Teslamate is causing your car to cycle between online/offline then there is something wrong. Not to rub salt in the wounds, but my car and lots of others sleep fine with Teslamate running, ditto Teslafi users. Worth getting it checked out as there may be something in the logs that can help you identify the root cause.
 

Durzel

Active Member
Jul 17, 2019
3,682
2,681
Bath, UK
Another simplistic way to tell if the car is asleep or not is by connecting it to a home wifi on which you can view the stats.

On my wifi setup here I can see what clients are connected and how long they've been connected for, so it makes it pretty easy to see if the car is awake or not (without using TeslaMate).

That way you can supervise awake/sleep states without any third party apps at all.
 
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VanillaAir_UK

Well-Known Member
Jun 17, 2019
8,719
6,286
Surrey, UK
There is an option in TeslaFi to get an email when the car goes offline.

I did do this (using Pushover notifications) earlier, and I got the offline notifications as expected; unfortunately in my case it has nothing to do with LTE signal (there is plenty where this happens) and the MCU hasn’t failed yet (and it has been doing this since I first did the upgrade back in may).

For clarity, I use the term offline when the car does indeed go offline - ie when it becomes inaccessible to outside communication, even by Tesla remote diagnostics, be it via LTE or wifi even after it is 'poked' (SMS text) to wake it up or it is indeed already awake. Nothing to do with being asleep, idle etc. Just incommunicado for whatever reason - in our case, the 'gateway' (part of the MCU2) had an intermittent problem (which was more of a problem than just the car not being remotely accessible as I understand that the problem was preventing the MCU from booting) but it could be just as simple as parking in an area with limited RF signals - we also get intermittent offline when parking in an underground car park as its a marginal signal.
 
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fetzu

Member
Oct 2, 2018
67
55
Switzerland
Is that an assumption that the car goes offline (it should really be asleep) because you see no battery drain or are you seeing it go offline via some other means?
You should raise an issue with Teslamate on their Github page. If Teslamate is causing your car to cycle between online/offline then there is something wrong. Not to rub salt in the wounds, but my car and lots of others sleep fine with Teslamate running, ditto Teslafi users. Worth getting it checked out as there may be something in the logs that can help you identify the root cause.
Not having access to the actual car logs, I have to admit that this is an assumption. But this assumption (that the car is really "offline") is backed by the fact that the car is actually disconnected from the internet (no LTE connection) when I get in after letting it sit for a while and that I am seeing less than half the drain under the same conditions with logging turned off vs logging turned on (be it TeslaMate or TeslaFi). I am very aware that the cars can sleep fine with TelsaMate and TeslaFi running, mine has for more than 3 years; I am not blaming this on them at all.. just trying to figure out what's wrong since Tesla doesn't seem very inclined to help.

Someone already raised an issue (moved to a discussion) very similar to mine which was closed because "TeslaMate just reports what the API provides". Which is true but does not help at all in my case. The main issue remains something that happened during the MCU2/AP3 upgrade, the fact that logging has some kind of impact on the car's behavior is just a side effect.

Another simplistic way to tell if the car is asleep or not is by connecting it to a home wifi on which you can view the stats.

On my wifi setup here I can see what clients are connected and how long they've been connected for, so it makes it pretty easy to see if the car is awake or not (without using TeslaMate).

That way you can supervise awake/sleep states without any third party apps at all.
That is a good point. Unfortunately, my usual WiFi setup will not reach into the garage. I'll try to set something up and monitor the car's behavior that way. Do you by any chance know if the car is pingable and if pinging it affects its sleeping patterns?

For clarity, I use the term offline when the car does indeed go offline - ie when it becomes inaccessible to outside communication, even by Tesla remote diagnostics, be it via LTE or wifi even after it is 'poked' (SMS text) to wake it up or it is indeed already awake. Nothing to do with being asleep, idle etc. Just incommunicado for whatever reason - in our case, the 'gateway' (part of the MCU2) had an intermittent problem (which was more of a problem than just the car not being remotely accessible as I understand that the problem was preventing the MCU from booting) but it could be just as simple as parking in an area with limited RF signals - we also get intermittent offline when parking in an underground car park as its a marginal signal.
I understand what you mean; the thing is my car is reported as "offline" to TeslaFi so I would get the notifications no matter what (that's what happened when I set it up with Pushover at least, i.e., a notification circa every hour). In some of these cases, the car is actually truly inaccessible to outside communication (AFAIK from the Tesla app not being able to wake it up).. in other cases it seems like the "poke SMS" does manage to "make it go online".
I am taking the signal accessibility into account and in this case it is not an issue: plenty of LTE/3G/EDGE at the usual locations.
EDIT: I am re-enabling this with e-mail notifications for situations when the car has been online for more than 90 minutes. My guess is I will not get many e-mails; then I'll turn it down to 60 minutes (and then 30) and should receive my hourly spam when the car is idling.
 
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init6

Member
Oct 16, 2020
741
441
Scotland
Not having access to the actual car logs, I have to admit that this is an assumption. But this assumption (that the car is really "offline") is backed by the fact that the car is actually disconnected from the internet (no LTE connection) when I get in after letting it sit for a while and that I am seeing less than half the drain under the same conditions with logging turned off vs logging turned on (be it TeslaMate or TeslaFi). I am very aware that the cars can sleep fine with TelsaMate and TeslaFi running, mine has for more than 3 years; I am not blaming this on them at all.. just trying to figure out what's wrong since Tesla doesn't seem very inclined to help.
Someone already raised an issue (moved to a discussion) very similar to mine which was closed because "TeslaMate just reports what the API provides". Which is true but does not help at all in my case. The main issue remains something that happened during the MCU2/AP3 upgrade, the fact that logging has some kind of impact on the car's behavior is just a side effect.
I know you're not trying to blame TM of TFi, but if they aren't working properly then there may be something in the logs that could point to an issue with your car. I find the logs pretty incomprehensible so worth posting on the TM pages for analysis. Always worth adding another data point to a discussion ;)

That is a good point. Unfortunately, my usual WiFi setup will not reach into the garage. I'll try to set something up and monitor the car's behavior that way. Do you by any chance know if the car is pingable and if pinging it affects its sleeping patterns?
I'm sure I tried pinging my car a while back and I think it did waken the car. My wife is away with the car just now, so can't try it.
 

fetzu

Member
Oct 2, 2018
67
55
Switzerland
Another quick update:

- I have added to the existing issue on TeslaMate's GitHub discussion with logs and all as you suggested @init6. I am hoping for a miracle ;).
- I have not yet received an "offline" e-mail from TeslaFi (with the setting at 90 minutes, I have now set it to 60 minutes, see what happens).
- I am still looking at some kind of solution to monitor the car's state over WiFi...

Sorry if I came as defensive in my last post, this whole situation is frustrating me and it kinda came out when it shouldn't have.
 
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init6

Member
Oct 16, 2020
741
441
Scotland
Another quick update:

- I have added to the existing issue on TeslaMate's GitHub discussion with logs and all as you suggested @init6. I am hoping for a miracle ;).
- I have not yet received an "offline" e-mail from TeslaFi (with the setting at 90 minutes, I have now set it to 60 minutes, see what happens).
- I am still looking at some kind of solution to monitor the car's state over WiFi...

Sorry if I came as defensive in my last post, this whole situation is frustrating me and it kinda came out when it shouldn't have.
Don't worry - we're just anonymous people on the internet. Just don't take it out on real people :)

IT can be extremely frustrating. My drain just disappeared, maybe due to a software update, but as always nothing from Tesla to say that was the case. Will hop over to Github shortly
 
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fetzu

Member
Oct 2, 2018
67
55
Switzerland
Another quick update: got an email from Tesla support, my LTE disconnects is a « known issue » that will be fixed « with a future firmware update » for which « engineering has not provided a date ». Yay. The last time I got that kind of response was relating to my MCU1 visual bugs and random reboots; which were fixed 2 years later when I paid for the MCU2 upgrade.

I am now trying to press them to give me the « Sleep Longest Duration » value (which I cannot access anymore), because my gut feeling is that it has not changed/got over the hour-ish yet despite turning off all logging/apps. We will see how they respond.
 
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fetzu

Member
Oct 2, 2018
67
55
Switzerland
Another quick update: got a response from Tesla stating that the “duration of my sleep is all-right as long as I don’t use any third party apps” (which is a lie since the value I got was still 3941 seconds after leaving my car idle with no apps for 8 days) and that they “are not allowed to share the information about the value” (probably because it shows that my car is not sleeping, or maybe the value is the key to their NN model for FSD).

They will not help me then; I have the choice between some nice drain (we are talking around 5’000 km of vampire drain a year) or finding my car offline (and unreachable by the app) more than half the time. But hey, at least I got Netflix (on a vertical screen), some stupid games and a MCU that does not reboot randomly out of this upgrade. Best money I spent this year.
 
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jun3280net

Member
Jul 29, 2019
20
8
Alberta
@fetzu thanks for documenting your steps to debug your issues. I found this from the Teslamate post you made. I just got the MCU2 upgrade, after a year of running a crippled configuration of MCU1/HW3. With MCU1/HW3, my 2017 S90D was sleeping perfectly - as noted in my Teslamate chart below. Since the upgrade starting on November 10, 2021, you can see it no longer sleeps, and is draining overnight. It's losing around 1km/hr of range now. When it was sleeping, it was losing around 0.17km/hr under similar temperatures. I can not for the life of me get my car to sleep.

Debugging steps I've taken :
  • Reset Tesla account password / refreshed token
  • Turned OFF Sentry
  • Turned OFF Standby (Summons)
  • Turned Off Dashcam
  • Unplugged all USB devices/Cigarette devices
  • Reboot MCU2 (Brake/Thumb Scrollwheel)
  • Using only Teslamate (disabled other 3rd party services)
1636831137417.png


This thread suggests it might be the 12V battery :
Model S 2017 75D wont sleep properly 1hr sleep, 15min awake repeat...

This thread shows stopping charging with APP can initiate stable sleeping :
Since my MC2/HW3 upgrade, the car will not sleep when plugged in

Any other suggestions on things to try would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

J
 
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gangzoom

Active Member
May 22, 2014
1,375
1,231
Uk
@jun3280net I persume the car is plugged in and/or set with a charge time.

Change the charge setting to 'Depart at' rather than 'Charge at'. You should than have no issues with the car sleeping.

Its a known software bug that has been reported to Tesla. Tesla presumably are too busy with FSD and v11 software to bother fixing this.
 
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jun3280net

Member
Jul 29, 2019
20
8
Alberta
@jun3280net I persume the car is plugged in and/or set with a charge time.

Change the charge setting to 'Depart at' rather than 'Charge at'. You should than have no issues with the car sleeping.

Its a known software bug that has been reported to Tesla. Tesla presumably are too busy with FSD and v11 software to bother fixing this.
Thanks for the tip @gangzoom! As of right now, I have not tried plugging the charger in the vehicle yet. To be honest, I've never played with charge settings before - but I'll give your suggestion a try when my range gets down to around 100km.

On that note, is your car able to sleep when it is NOT plugged in?

As an update to my previous post :
  • Connected via LTE (not WIFI - as WIFI connection when I was using MCU1 would result in my car not sleeping)
  • My WIFI is decent in the garage (can reconnect back to WIFI if that is better for inducing sleep)

Thanks

J
 
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fetzu

Member
Oct 2, 2018
67
55
Switzerland
@jun3280net I’m sorry to hear you are having the same issues.

In my case, I did test the 12v battery with a multimeter and it seemed to be perfectly healthy.

Another far-fetched theory I have seen (on TeslaFi’s support forums I think) was that a seat sensor was defective and keeping the car awake. I have had Tesla do remote diagnostics and they told me my car is behaving correctly (they say it is sleeping when I am not monitoring, I do not believe them because the drain does not change but since monitoring supposedly causes the issue I cannot prove it). As an added bonus, monitoring with TeslaMate only (streaming API) causes my car to be actually offline 50% of the times I get in.

I have pretty much given up at this point. The only think I can hope for is for that magical software update that fixes everything happens; or for my MCU and battery to slowly die…
 

jun3280net

Member
Jul 29, 2019
20
8
Alberta
@fetzu I'm sorry to hear you haven't gained any traction on this. You've done an incredible amount of troubleshooting. That said yours is sleeping at least. Since my upgrade, my car has yet to fall asleep at all whether plugged or unplugged from the home charger. I have Tesla mobile service coming to check on the vehicle in a couple days, so we'll see what they are able to determine.

That said, in Canada where I live, the weather has now dropped between -1C and -15C. I expect the car to lose range, overnight, just not show how much is reasonable anymore with these colder temperatures is not entirely clear to me.

On that note a couple of other items I came across that might be worth exploring :

Remove Active Tokens : Model S 2017 75D wont sleep properly 1hr sleep, 15min awake repeat...
Complete Cold Reboot : Car won’t sleep, hot rearview camera possibly causing 12 V battery failure
 

fetzu

Member
Oct 2, 2018
67
55
Switzerland
@jun3280net : thank you for both these links. I think the “e-mailing Tesla to make sure the tokens are invalidated” is more placebo (resetting the password does invalidate the tokens in my experience). But that Cold Reboot sounds very promising (and drastic, which I love). I’m trying this out and hoping I don’t brick the car !

I hope Tesla service is more competent in Canada than they are in Switzerland and that they manage to find a solution to your problem!
 
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