Battery Pack Failed in Less Than One Year (>13,000 miles)

[toulouse]

I have to say that I felt the Tesla Model 3 was one of my best purchases for as long as I can remember. However, these error messages began to prompt less than 15,000 miles:

• Electrical system power reduced: Vehicle may shut down unexpectedly
• Vehicle may not restart: Service is required

and suddenly, the car wouldn't budge (doesn't shift over to 'Drive' or 'Neutral').. Tesla ran some diagnostics and said I needed a new battery pack. I didn't mind much since I'm under warranty, but when I asked when they can replace with a new battery -- they clarified they'd be providing a "reconditioned" one... Usually, I know the Refurbs try to match similarly aged batteries, but I consider my car nearly brand new. It's unnerving because these reconditioned batteries are never as good as new batteries, and I hear complaints about folks experiencing higher maintenance costs with the never-ending charge issues stories.

On Tesla's warranty coverage, they state the following: (1) ... the replacement Battery will be in a condition appropriate to the age and mileage of the vehicle sufficient to achieve or exceed the minimum battery capacity for the remainder of the warranty period of the Original Battery.; (2) If your Battery or Drive Unit requires warranty repair, Tesla will repair the unit, or replace it with a new, reconditioned or remanufactured part at the sole discretion of Tesla.

With that, I've asked Tesla if it's within their discretion, to replace the battery pack with a new one. I haven't heard a response back yet on this... but in the meantime, I'd appreciate if I can get some inputs/advice here. Thx in advance.

 

[t00shay]

Tesla is cheap. They will go the least expensive route. Hopefully you will get a good reconditioned battery and won’t have any issue.

 

[1965Falcon]

You might make a request that they refurbish your battery. It's likely just one module that has gone bad, although that will require them to send it to Freemont and back again but since the plant is closed maybe that's not an option. You could offer to just wait if you can...

 

[Uncle Paul]

Most of the people posting about replacement batteries have indicated that their replacements were a bit better than the failed units.
Tesla tries to match their available reconditioned batteries to be an improvement over what has been taken out.

Of course, everyone wants a fresh new battery, but Tesla seems to be trying to do the right thing when they reinstall a replacement.

Same thing with ICE vehicles needing replacements. They try to source either a used or remanufactured motor that also will be at least slightly better than what is being replaced.

 

[Atari2600]

On Tesla's warranty coverage, they state the following: (1) ... the replacement Battery will be in a condition appropriate to the age and mileage of the vehicle sufficient to achieve or exceed the minimum battery capacity for the remainder of the warranty period of the Original Battery.; (2) If your Battery or Drive Unit requires warranty repair, Tesla will repair the unit, or replace it with a new, reconditioned or remanufactured part at the sole discretion of Tesla.

I don't like that language. Reads like they can give you a battery that only charges to 75% and they could say "hey it beats the 70% minimum limit please leave."

 

[APotatoGod]

I don't like that language. Reads like they can give you a battery that only charges to 75% and they could say "hey it beats the 70% minimum limit please leave."

As I'm reading it it would still need to last for the rest of the warranty period, and I'd assume a battery that's already down to 75% capacity would degrade down below that 70% threshold in the following years, so they can't really do that, unless they want to replace it again down the road (obviously not economically ideal). So I'd say that's not really a realistic concern, unless there's evidence to the contrary.

 

[Atari2600]

True, but legally that could happen. It would be nice if it had language stating your replacement pack would have the same or higher rated when it failed or just state a replacement pack will be minimum 95% capacity of new or something along those lines.

 

[MP3Mike]

It would be nice if it had language stating your replacement pack would have the same or higher rated when it failed

But it does:

 

[rawrguthlaf]

Labor and delivery costs add up for Tesla too. I don't think it is in their interest to give you the absolute bare minimum, as most batteries that have already degraded a good amount are not going to last. You should at least get a "decent" battery. I think the stories you are hearing are about older Model S, older battery tech, too. I'd hope for above 90%.

Also, remember most people experience some amount of degradation over the first 10k~ miles or so. Just my opinion, but getting something completely brand new may be above and beyond here, and honestly too much of an incentive for people to find ways to claim battery warranties.

 

[XLR82XS]

Same thing with ICE vehicles needing replacements. They try to source either a used or remanufactured motor that also will be at least slightly better than what is being replaced.

That is incorrect for warranty engine replacements for most manufacturers. I worked in auto dealers for 10 years.

 

[qdeathstar]

I don't like that language. Reads like they can give you a battery that only charges to 75% and they could say "hey it beats the 70% minimum limit please leave."

yeah, but that isn’t in there interests since there is only a 5 percent decline needed to trigger another under warantee battery replacement...

 

[acarney]

I’m curious where they get these reconditioned packs. I assume there aren’t a huge amount of scrapped Model 3’s returning to Tesla with 40k or less miles. I also would be surprised if they were buying these back from insurance companies that are writing off the vehicle and selling it for scrap.

“Reconditioned” may mean that they had a long range pack that didn’t pass QA inspection or had a failed brick in it and was rejected and reconfigured down to a standard range/midrange by removing that failed brick. These packs may essentially be new in the cycles on the cells but legally are not virgin new packs and instead remanufactured.

It could also be that they call any bare pack reconditioned to avoid customers bitching over getting a new battery warranty on that pack as if it has 0 miles on it, complaining about range in general (could not even be pack related issues), etc.

While I totally understand your frustration and feeling like you’re car now has a major part that’s “used”, assuming a standard range with 1,000 cycles cell life, you’ve used about 5% of the expected life. Even if someone abused the pack by charging to 100% a bunch, if they give you a “like to like” pack it’ll have only had ~50 100% cycles or supercharging sessions on it. I honestly think you’ll be happy with it once it’s all said and done. I wouldn’t be surprised if some owners supercharge once a week and these cars still show pretty dang good longevity out of them.

I would be more worried about all the trim they have to remove from the inside and if there will be extra creaks or rattles from vibrations and possibly slightly more loose fittings. I’m not sure if a lot of the plastic push clips and stuff are “one time use” and would be replaced, or are assumed to be fine and just as tight/secure after being pulled off and pushed back into their retainers...

 

[timk225]

Considering how nervous Tesla is about allowing any repaired Tesla vehicle to be able to supercharge, I can't imagine they are taking battery packs out of wrecked 3's and doing any amount of work to them before giving out that battery pack as a refurbished replacement.

 

[jpfive]

That is incorrect for warranty engine replacements for most manufacturers. I worked in auto dealers for 10 years.

This is true in my experience also. However, not necessarily so in the case of extended warranties, which are essentially insurance policies, especially the ones written by aftermarket companies.

 

[jpfive]

Given the language of the warranty you may actually receive a new and unused battery pack. That is at the discretion of Tesla after all. However, I doubt it will be described as anything other than refurbished. Look at it this way, you are going from a real problem to an imagined one. How soon will they be able to get your car back to you? Good luck, enjoy your car, and please report back on the experience. If you use Teslafi I know I would appreciate how it rates the replacement pack - I enjoy checking mine after every charge. Best to you, and grateful you are under warranty.

 

[MP3Mike]

“Reconditioned” may mean that they had a long range pack that didn’t pass QA inspection or had a failed brick in it and was rejected and reconfigured down to a standard range/midrange by removing that failed brick. These packs may essentially be new in the cycles on the cells but legally are not virgin new packs and instead remanufactured.

That isn't going to happen, you can't just remove a brick of cells. Everything is welded/glued into place in the modules. However, they could easily replace one of the 4 failed modules in a pack to recondition it. And for every pack they replace under warranty they get another pack to recondition. (Or use for parts to recondition another one.)

 

[GigaGrunt]

Reman tears down failed packs to understand failure points. This is fed back to Engineering and also Manufacturing to ensure its not a consistent issue, or something caused by the standard process of manufacturing. After tear down, parts that can be reused are reconditioned, cleaned, etc and turned into 'refurbished' packs. These are crated and ready to ship so that the customer or service center isn't waiting beyond the ship and service time. Reman also recycles parts not usable aka cells.

Modules are either good, or bad. Surface level components can be replaced (BMB board), but once the module is closed up and potted, no digging back into it. Penthouse issues are different. AC charger can fail, loose connections can arc out and take out various components. All depends on what happens. Vehicle software is designed to identify and isolate to least amount of damage. for the customers sake, and for warranty purposes.

 

[tomas]

I have to say that I felt the Tesla Model 3 was one of my best purchases for as long as I can remember. However, these error messages began to prompt less than 15,000 miles:

• Electrical system power reduced: Vehicle may shut down unexpectedly
• Vehicle may not restart: Service is required

and suddenly, the car wouldn't budge (doesn't shift over to 'Drive' or 'Neutral').. Tesla ran some diagnostics and said I needed a new battery pack. I didn't mind much since I'm under warranty, but when I asked when they can replace with a new battery -- they clarified they'd be providing a "reconditioned" one... Usually, I know the Refurbs try to match similarly aged batteries, but I consider my car nearly brand new. It's unnerving because these reconditioned batteries are never as good as new batteries, and I hear complaints about folks experiencing higher maintenance costs with the never-ending charge issues stories.

On Tesla's warranty coverage, they state the following: (1) ... the replacement Battery will be in a condition appropriate to the age and mileage of the vehicle sufficient to achieve or exceed the minimum battery capacity for the remainder of the warranty period of the Original Battery.; (2) If your Battery or Drive Unit requires warranty repair, Tesla will repair the unit, or replace it with a new, reconditioned or remanufactured part at the sole discretion of Tesla.

With that, I've asked Tesla if it's within their discretion, to replace the battery pack with a new one. I haven't heard a response back yet on this... but in the meantime, I'd appreciate if I can get some inputs/advice here. Thx in advance.

I suggest you curb your concern. I've had a Tesla for 8 years, and been pretty active following this forum since I placed my order almost 10 years ago. Most battery replacements have been S or X. While there are plenty of complaints about batteries going on out there - which you can easily find on this forum - I don't think I've ever read a report of someone getting a bum replacement. Often they are new. Sometimes re-manufactured. For a while, with the S, they would put on a temporary pack, repair yours, and return yours to the car. I don't believe they can do that on 3 and Y because it is more difficult to remove and replace. Since they've only been shipping 3s in volume for ~2 years, I suspect it is highly probable that you will get a new replacement. Not sure how many returned batteries they have available to re-manufacture. In any event, you are statistically extremely unlikely to get a battery that has a lot of miles/time on it. The vast majority of 3s have been delivered within the last year.

 

[acarney]

That isn't going to happen, you can't just remove a brick of cells. Everything is welded/glued into place in the modules. However, they could easily replace one of the 4 failed modules in a pack to recondition it. And for every pack they replace under warranty they get another pack to recondition. (Or use for parts to recondition another one.)

I guess I assumed they tested assemblies before glueing everything down and sealing it up. I didn’t mean that it would have been put in a car and then pulled out and repaired. Just figured it would be pulled off the line if it failed a QA step somewhere instead of being repaired right on the line and slowing other things down. As soon as it’s pulled off the line it might be classified as “reconditioned” even if it hasn’t left the battery factory since it probably would have its serial number flagged as not being used for a new vehicle and would get assigned a new one once fixed or configured down to a smaller pack or something.

 

[GigaGrunt]

I guess I assumed they tested assemblies before glueing everything down and sealing it up. I didn’t mean that it would have been put in a car and then pulled out and repaired. Just figured it would be pulled off the line if it failed a QA step somewhere instead of being repaired right on the line and slowing other things down. As soon as it’s pulled off the line it might be classified as “reconditioned” even if it hasn’t left the battery factory since it probably would have its serial number flagged as not being used for a new vehicle and would get assigned a new one once fixed or configured down to a smaller pack or something.

That’s not how any of it works....at Tesla or in mass manufacturing....