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Battery Swap revisited

Discussion in 'Battery Discussion' started by evmoto, Jan 12, 2009.

  1. evmoto

    evmoto New Member

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    #1 evmoto, Jan 12, 2009
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2009
    Ok, reading Clarksons review of the Tesla Roadster, despite his huge gaffes, does bring up the main bugbear for EVs - the recharge time. I mooted a solution yeaaars ago, and it is this:

    Make the batteries removable. Drive into garage, pull batteries out, plug in new set already charged up. You "lease" standard size batteries - think of lab gear, 4 butterfly nuts and handles each side, it slides in/out. Bigger cars take 2,3,4 units. Too heavy? Have automated swapping stations in garage. No 16-hour recharge - just swap in minutes, just like refueling.
    It would be possible to have half the batteries "built-in" to the frame, and half the capacity swappable like this. For instance the Roadster Mk-2 might have 100 miles of charge from the "built-in" batteries, and 3 swapable 30-mile packs. The size/electronics of the battery should be universal, patent-free - all EVs should be able to interchange packs. Depending on how much you pay for the "lease" you could swap NiMh, Lithium-ion, even lead-acid- the computers would sense the type automatically and act accordingly. You could even just carry a spare in the boot, if you really need. Garages can implement these recharge/swap stations alongside existing infrastructure, and still have a money making business leasing/charging the removable packs. Everyone is happy.
    If you are making short trips, you would probably just recharge at home/work - you only need the swap stations for those longer trips.

    Elon? Are you reading this? :)
     
  2. WarpedOne

    WarpedOne Supreme Premier

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    And you assume this would only cost up to a few bucks?
    Forget it and get used to charging over night.
     
  3. graham

    graham Active Member

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    Tesla has mentioned considering having a swappable battery as part of the Model S.

    Better Place is certainly going with this model - it has some drawbacks that have been mentioned (forcing early standards on a rapidly changing technology for one) but is certainly something to watch going forward
     
  4. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    Two worlds.

    I think on the road, battery swap will not work for the same reasons we chide hydrogen infrastructure. Too expensive to build swap station buildings that store, charge and replace batteries. Especially when investors can see that each year quick charging creeps up to the front.

    Where battery swap will be needed is on the race track. A battery swap in similar times as a fuel filling pit stop will be exciting.
     
  5. malcolm

    malcolm Active Member

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    While the range is still relatively modest, the obvious starting point for pure Battery EVs is as the second car for a two-car family. The EV can then run the errands within the domestic orbit, leaving the family ICE for longer trips/heavier cargo loads etc.

    Those who need a single car might want to stay with ICEs or change to some form of EREV or Hybrid.

    Battery Electric Vehicles don't have to solve every motoring problem, immediately. They just have to play a part in reducing the number of gas-miles driven
     
  6. graham

    graham Active Member

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    ... Who own a home with a garage...
     
  7. malcolm

    malcolm Active Member

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    Or have some other means to recharge at a speed which works for their lifestyle.

    According to wikipedia the first places that sold gasoline/petrol were pharmacies, as a side business. It took time for vehicle ownership to grow sufficiently to be able to support filling stations. Likewise, even assuming that the economics make them viable, ultra-fast recharging or battery swap stations are some way off. Early owners of EVs are going to have to come up with some work-arounds.

    They are going to have to be affluent enthusiasts. Like the very first motorists.
     
  8. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    That's the way I view BEVs too. With the price premium, it's going to take a while for people to adopt them. That's why I think stuff like the PHEVs and maybe the external range extenders will work as work-arounds for now. The first BEVs buyers will probably have them as second cars and have a garage. Then we probably expand by having street chargers. Eventually hopefully we get to the rapid charging or battery swap infrastructure and then we don't need the work-arounds anymore.
     
  9. evmoto

    evmoto New Member

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    #10 evmoto, Jan 14, 2009
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2009
    Depends on your usage patterns. If you only need to do this at weekends for long runs, and can use at-home charges for work-runs, then it may pay off. And why should it have to cost so much? Garages operate on microscopic profit margins for fuel, and still manage. Once a standard is agreed - and made cheaply/freely available like CD/DVD standard (important) then I bet there will be chains keen to try it out.
    Speed charging, while promising, is not yet a cert - and the same people supplying the swaps would be in pole position to supply charge-up stations as well.
    It also allows you to easily adopt the level in tech/price for the battery you chose - lith-ion, Metal Hydride, Lead Acid, or some new tech - you just lease the one you want.

    It should be much less hassle than Hydrogen, which is demanding NASA space age Liquid Hydrogen handling, or Hydrogen under incredible pressures - something which, you may notice, even Rocket builders are shying away from & using kerosene for some launchers. And thats after 40 years of NASA launching on Hydrogen. We already have a power network to distribute electricity, after all.

    Oh, and if you are doing a short run, and want to loose weight/gain perfomance, just leave the plug-in batteries out and run off the internal set!

    (As an experiment it would be interesting to see what the Roadster would do in terms of acceleration/top speed with half the battery weight, maybe some modder will do that one day.)
     

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