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BBC: Scientists create battery that refuels electric cars in seconds

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by tonybelding, Aug 14, 2018.

  1. tonybelding

    tonybelding Active Member

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    Found this → Could 'rust' hold key to electric travel?

    The article makes no mention of any capability to recharge the liquid in the car, or at home. It seems to imply that the only way to "recharge" your car is to visit the filling station. If that is the case, then it seems like this scheme would have many of the same drawbacks as a hydrogen fuel cell car.

    I have to admit, some of the text in the article is rather infuriating to me. Example:

    Expecting people to change their habits to something more convenient and efficient? Heaven forbid!

    Unstoppable barrier! And that's why companies like Tesla have been unable to sell any of their impractical battery-powered cars, because nobody wants a car that comes with an UNSTOPPABLE BARRIER. Thank goodness those boffins in the UK have a solution coming.

    uhh… Which side is he really arguing for now? :confused:
     
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  2. Asymmetry

    Asymmetry Member

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    Future is solid state, not liquid suspensions. Issue of contamination, degradation, all of which is already a none issue with batteries.

    Another pie in the sky research grant application.
     
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  3. Permag

    Permag Member

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    Gross, just gross. I see standing for 5 minutes in sub-freezing temperatures outside in freezing rain or sleet to put fuel in a car as an "unstoppable barrier" which are rediculous words put together in the first place.
     
  4. Kuro68k

    Kuro68k Member

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    Even if the battery could take it, what kind of power supply and cable could supply that much energy?

    "Seconds" - let's be generous and say 60.

    For the sake of argument we want to deliver 50kWh in 1 minute. That's 3000kW, assuming zero loss. That's two nuclear reactors to charge your car.
     
  5. ShockOnT

    ShockOnT ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️

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    You're off by 1000X.
    3000kW = 3 megawatt. Two reactors would be 3 gigawatt.
     
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  6. Johan

    Johan Funds for M3 secured. Contingent on wife aproval.

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    So two million nuclear reactors you say?! That's just crazy!
     
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  7. Kuro68k

    Kuro68k Member

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    Well spotted. It's too late to calculate, time for bed...

    But still, good luck getting 3MW DC into your car. Unless someone invents a room temperature superconductor you might have trouble lifting the cable.
     
  8. csanders90D

    csanders90D Supporting Member

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    The 3MW is irrelevant because this battery doesn't charge by plugging in, instead you're swapping out the electrolyte. With a pump, not a plug.

    So, instead of filling up at home every night, you can have the convenience of stopping by the gas station battery-electrolyte station every few days. No mention of the energy cost of making and distributing this stuff to the filling stations, just the silly claim: "Because it's a liquid it would just work as normal using the same infrastructure." Assuming that the owners of that gas station infrastructure feel like digging everything up to add a couple more tanks for the electrolyte, adding a couple more nozzles at each pump, arranging a supplier to deliver this stuff, etc. You'd have a much easier time getting the gas station owner to install a fast DC charger.
     
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  9. ItsNotAboutTheMoney

    ItsNotAboutTheMoney Well-Known Member

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    Over-egging, but a possible approach for edge cases.
     
  10. ShockOnT

    ShockOnT ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️

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    Miscalculation aside, it seems to be impossible to transfer energy that quickly.
    Pumping electrolyte sounds easy, but considering the incredibly high charge the electrolyte would have its hard to see how it could be done safely.
    And to run a cable at 3MW, that’s 30X the supercharger speed, so you’d need 30X the supercharger câble capacity, not to mention the same increase on the cars internal wiring.
     
  11. Johan

    Johan Funds for M3 secured. Contingent on wife aproval.

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    That's not how batteries work :)

    The electrolyte isn't some kind of magically charged fluid.
     
  12. ShockOnT

    ShockOnT ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️

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    Ah true, you're quite right.
    What I was thinking was wrong, that the whole liquid was held at a high electrostatic charge. But it's sort of close, in that each individual molecule is charged and can donate an electron as it enters the battery.

    At least you got me reading. Very interesting. It almost seems as though flow batteries are about to eclipse Li Ion batteries for stationery storage. That might free up some more gigafactory batteries for cars :)
     
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  13. Kuro68k

    Kuro68k Member

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    Anything liquid based is a non-starter, just like hydrogen. No one wants to go back to that inconvenience unless they really have to.
     
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  14. ShockOnT

    ShockOnT ⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️⚡️

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    Agreed. Even slow charging is far more convenient than needing to go to a shop to buy energy.
    Supercharging is fine for road trips. The time you wait is more than offset by the time you save every week not needing to go to service stations.
     
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