Berlin made cars

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Not necessarily mentioning REEs, but Cobalt mining still used for Li-Ion packs (except for SR+ M3s which are LFP), is not particularly earth-friendly, don't you think?

Cobalt isn't a rare earth. Writing about rare earths just makes you look like an ignoramus repeating the old tropes from the early days of the Prius.
Cobalt's also used in petroleum refining.

Everything has impact. Its impact depends on where you source it from as it's a secondary.metal found with other metals like copper, nickel or gold.

It's also expensive, which is why cell manufacturers are working to reduce its use.

If I don't want to buy stuff from China my primary reason is because the regime is greedy and evil, which is leading to the destruction of ecosystems in the oceans and on land across the world. The mining of metals or burning of bunker fuel is a minor issue in comparison

 

[delta0]

They really should rename rare earths. They are not rare. When they were first discovered they were but not anymore.

 

[WllXM]

Cobalt isn't a rare earth. Writing about rare earths just makes you look like an ignoramus repeating the old tropes from the early days of the Prius.
Cobalt's also used in petroleum refining.

Everything has impact. Its impact depends on where you source it from as it's a secondary.metal found with other metals like copper, nickel or gold.

It's also expensive, which is why cell manufacturers are working to reduce its use.

If I don't want to buy stuff from China my primary reason is because the regime is greedy and evil, which is leading to the destruction of ecosystems in the oceans and on land across the world. The mining of metals or burning of bunker fuel is a minor issue in comparison

Thanks for the condescending and patronising comment. Maybe you should get your eyes checked though. I never said that Cobalt was a Rare Earth Element, actually quite the opposite, it's literally in my first sentence. What I said though is that it is an issue in Li-Ion batteries, hence manufacturers pledges to reduce it.
As you probably know, Cobalt is primarily mined in China and Africa, with questionable practices, and often child labour involved. But if you want to state again that this & shipping from Asia is a minor issue, sure..
Anyway thanks for the added value of your other points...

 

[roadcred]

Back on subject please. It seems to me that both Tesla Berlin and Tesla Texas are disasters. I guess there might be something fundamental needs sorting out. The production isn't really increasing....they are limiting to Black and White for the for see able future.
I think there is more likely hood that all RHD cars will in future come from China who currently build all RHD TEslas on the planet.
We should be happy with that as my two MiC's are much better build quality than anything yet made in the US. I think the negative comparisons made with ICE cars MiG relate to inferior quality design and materials specified on Teslas not on quality of build labour.

 

[Zakalwe]

Shipping from Asia or America is less than optimal. However, lots of makers do this. I bought a Peugeot 10 years ago and that was shipped from China.
Shipping an ICE car is not good. Shipping a BEV is not good, but better overall as it is a BEV.
Let's not let an unreasonable expectation of perfection be the enemy of progress.

 

[Jason71]

Back on subject please. It seems to me that both Tesla Berlin and Tesla Texas are disasters. I guess there might be something fundamental needs sorting out. The production isn't really increasing....they are limiting to Black and White for the for see able future.
I think there is more likely hood that all RHD cars will in future come from China who currently build all RHD TEslas on the planet.
We should be happy with that as my two MiC's are much better build quality than anything yet made in the US. I think the negative comparisons made with ICE cars MiG relate to inferior quality design and materials specified on Teslas not on quality of build labour.

I wonder if they are struggling with the Giga castings? That is the biggest difference between China and the other two factories?
Ramping up production and parts logistics is not easy though could just be that.

 

[Zakalwe]

Back on subject please. It seems to me that both Tesla Berlin and Tesla Texas are disasters. I guess there might be something fundamental needs sorting out. The production isn't really increasing....they are limiting to Black and White for the for see able future.

Arent they shutting down production in Berlin to re-jig the production lines. From memory this will mean that a car will spend 30 seconds at each production station compared to the current 90 seconds. They are also adding a third shift, as well as moving to the 4680 cell size. The bottleneck is hiring enough staff.
Texas recently had production bottlenecks on the 4680 cells, but apparently that has improved recently.

Tesla-Schock: Neues Werk in Brandenburg macht dicht

Gut drei Monate nach der Eröffnung muss Tesla sein Brandenburger Autowerk vorübergehend schließen.

www.bild.de

 

[Casss]

I wonder if they are struggling with the Giga castings? That is the biggest difference between China and the other two factories?
Ramping up production and parts logistics is not easy though could just be that.

It is an interesting decision. The model name is the same, but from a production standpoint they’re basically building an entirely different car.

“Prod. is hell”.

 

[ICON]

Anyone know what tires the Berlin MY cars have ?

 

[Toblerone]

Anyone know what tires the Berlin MY cars have ?

The MYP from Berlin has Pirelli p-zeros:

See 2m20s
Probably depends on wheel size also.

 

[tomcat]

Conscious of the last post dating back to May but wanting to avoid creating a new post - does anyone have any updates on possible shipment of Berlin MYs to the U.K. and/or of the new colours being available?

I have a LRY on order but placed it on hold until early next year in the hope of receiving a Berlin car.

 

[WllXM]

Conscious of the last post dating back to May but wanting to avoid creating a new post - does anyone have any updates on possible shipment of Berlin MYs to the U.K. and/or of the new colours being available?

I have a LRY on order but placed it on hold until early next year in the hope of receiving a Berlin car.

My non-educated guess is: as long as the online configurator doesn't display the new colours for the UK, our cars will still be coming from Shanghai for a while.
I am assuming that MSM/RMC paints are never gonna be deployed In Berlin as they are using Quicksilver/Cherry Red instead.

I don't know how complicated of a process it would be to switch the factory line from LHD to RHD for a batch run, and as Shanghai is already equipped they might want to favour this at the moment.

 

[Redbaron73]

All the RHD y and 3 come from China. What ever internet fantasists seem to suggest there are (as yet) no RHD cars coming out of Giga Berlin. It doesnt mean they cant. It is just that they have not.

 

[MrT3]

I have a LRY on order but placed it on hold until early next year in the hope of receiving a Berlin car.

No time soon would be my guess. They delayed and delayed the MYP in the UK but finally gave up and are now shipping them from China. Berlin needs to ramp up, be able to spray cars in all colours and satisfy LHD Europe orders before they start adding UK orders - and it will be two steps forwards and one step back shortly as they move to megacastings and structural batteries before the end of the year, with no doubt delays they will introduce.

 

[Toblerone]

No time soon would be my guess. They delayed and delayed the MYP in the UK but finally gave up and are now shipping them from China. Berlin needs to ramp up, be able to spray cars in all colours and satisfy LHD Europe orders before they start adding UK orders - and it will be two steps forwards and one step back shortly as they move to megacastings and structural batteries before the end of the year, with no doubt delays they will introduce.

I agree. Shanghai also has to make RHD for Australia, Japan, Singapore. Doing a run of RHD and sending a few RoRos for UK&I isn’t anything new for them and is still a win if the rest of LHD Europe demand is met from Berlin.

I personally think waiting for a Berlin car in the UK is pointless. When they start shipping to the UK I could sell my MiC car and buy one if I so wished (minus USS and indicator stalks no doubt).
There will always be something new to wait for, just like with computer parts.

 

[tomcat]

My non-educated guess is: as long as the online configurator doesn't display the new colours for the UK, our cars will still be coming from Shanghai for a while.
I am assuming that MSM/RMC paints are never gonna be deployed In Berlin as they are using Quicksilver/Cherry Red instead.

I don't know how complicated of a process it would be to switch the factory line from LHD to RHD for a batch run, and as Shanghai is already equipped they might want to favour this at the moment.

That’s interesting about the colours as I was confused by 2 YouTube videos which talked about different pairs of new colours (I assume MSM = Mercury Silver Metallic?).

It’s strange that they would introduce different colours in different continents when they’ve used the same colour options everywhere until now. I love both the quicksilver and cherry red which would be another reason to want a Berlin-made car, in that case.

Really don’t want a Chinese car if I can avoid it, even though components of Berlin made cars may be made there. I minimise the products I buy from them even though it costs more.

 

[Durzel]

Better make peace with not buying another Tesla then to be honest. Even the Berlin built cars would be filled with Chinese made parts. Virtually everything would be sourced from China, I'd wager.

The Berlin plant can produce these colours because they have an advanced paint workshop - apparently. Shanghai and the US plants do not (yet).

 

[Zakalwe]

That’s interesting about the colours as I was confused by 2 YouTube videos which talked about different pairs of new colours (I assume MSM = Mercury Silver Metallic?).

It’s strange that they would introduce different colours in different continents when they’ve used the same colour options everywhere until now. I love both the quicksilver and cherry red which would be another reason to want a Berlin-made car, in that case.

Not really. They've installed one of the world's most advanced paintshops in Berlin. The other running plants, AFAIK, do not have those capabilities.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

The YouTube videos are often predicated on randomly trying to find new paint codes on the Tesla website then turning it into hard news they’ve broken to the world that they’re imminent

When you play with the European configurator as mentioned above, the MY RWD looks to be China built and the new colours Berlin built. I wouldn’t be surprised if the classic colours are also China built. Either way, U.K. and Ireland are still on the old China colour palette

 

[Durzel]

It's been done to death already but Shanghai has all of the RHD markets around it. Berlin has all of the LHD markets around it, and is LHD itself. The UK and islands are an outlier either way. Demand exceeds supply in all cases.

So long as Shanghai has boats coming over to the UK for any reason at all - i.e. any model - then it makes sense for them to continue making RHD cars. The 10% import duty doesn't offset that. I'm not entirely sure why people are so fixated on the idea (dream?) of Berlin making RHD cars for us.