Biden/Harris Tax Credit

[Sully151]

I am looking for info about Biden and continuing the EV Tax Credit. My Dad says they want to do away with tax credits, of course, he supports the other guy.

Does anyone have any know links from reputable resources? All I can find is references to his Cash for Clunkers plans.

TIA!

 

[CyberGus]

Accelerating the deployment of electric vehicles. There are now one million electric vehicles on the road in the United States. But a key barrier to further deployment of these greenhouse-gas reducing vehicles is the lack of charging stations and coordination across all levels of government. As President, Biden will work with our nation’s governors and mayors to support the deployment of more than 500,000 new public charging outlets by the end of 2030. In addition, Biden will restore the full electric vehicle tax credit to incentivize the purchase of these vehicles. He will ensure the tax credit is designed to targeted middle class consumers and, to the greatest extent possible, to prioritize the purchase of vehicles made in America.
​

Plan for Climate Change and Environmental Justice | Joe Biden

 

[SSedan]

Tax credits for new EV purchase benefit the "wealthy" median household income is estimated at $68k this year, probably not buying a used 3 on that.
Maybe you don't consider yourself wealthy but median income probably suggests you are doing a good bit better than average......

 

[SageBrush]

Tax credits for new EV purchase benefit the "wealthy" median household income is estimated at $68k this year, probably not buying a used 3 on that.
Maybe you don't consider yourself wealthy but median income probably suggests you are doing a good bit better than average......

That is class propaganda.

If the EV credit is increasing adoption of EVs compared to what would happen without it is doing its job and it does not matter one wit which class is buying.

 

[CyberGus]

That is class propaganda.

If the EV credit is increasing adoption of EVs compared to what would happen without it is doing its job and it does not matter one wit which class is buying.

I understood the statement to mean that the credits would be weighted towards lower-priced cars. Offering credits on a $200,000 car will have little impact on overall adoption, since the target market is small (and buyers in this range are not price-sensitive anyway).

For instance, a credit based on a percentage of the sales price would get larger with cost, but a flat "$x per vehicle" has the biggest value for the cheapest cars.

I'm more fascinated by the proposed EV charging stations...which charging standard will be used? Will one be mandated, as in Europe? Choice fuels innovation, but standards ease adoption (remember when every cell phone model had it's own power plug? eeek).

 

[SageBrush]

For instance, a credit based on a percentage of the sales price would get larger with cost, but a flat "$x per vehicle" has the biggest value for the cheapest cars.

Yes, but that is not the full story. A poor person will not only be averse to any price difference, they will also be averse to any perceived risk of new tech, whether it be reliability, depreciation, repairs or maintenance.

As it stands, the EV tax credit is a push for a consumer to take a chance.

 

[miimura]

I'm more fascinated by the proposed EV charging stations...which charging standard will be used? Will one be mandated, as in Europe? Choice fuels innovation, but standards ease adoption (remember when every cell phone model had it's own power plug? eeek).

Charging stations earning government funding should support any electric vehicle. Therefore, I would not expect to see any Tesla-only stations getting government funding. One could hope that a station with multiple connectors for different standards could be funded. For example, the ChargePoint Express Plus system was designed to support 3 DC connectors.

 

[nwdiver]

Tax credits for new EV purchase benefit the "wealthy" median household income is estimated at $68k this year, probably not buying a used 3 on that.
Maybe you don't consider yourself wealthy but median income probably suggests you are doing a good bit better than average......

Agreed; I would prefer to add a ~$2/gal tax on every gallon of fools fuel then payout those funds to every family making <$68k/yr.... buuuut.... I'm guessing that people like you would then start whining about 'redistribution'... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

So.... since you're going to whine about literally any solution that's proposed I guess this is just as good as anything....

 

[CyberGus]

Charging stations earning government funding should support any electric vehicle.

I'd be happy if Congress would simply allow the USDOT to offer EV-charging stations at Interstate rest stops, which would cost the taxpayer $0.00. Private businesses at rest-stops are currently prohibited by statute.

 

[teasla]

EV credit is going to help the car manufacturer, not you. If the credit is restored, the car cost would simply be increased, so at the end it is the manufacturer who benefits.

 

[nwdiver]

EV credit is going to help the car manufacturer, not you. If the credit is restored, the car cost would simply be increased, so at the end it is the manufacturer who benefits.

???? How do you think Tesla was able to expand manufacturing to produce the more cost effective Model 3? Magic? I'm pretty sure it was profits partially funded by EV credits. Sure seems that those credits benefited a lot of people that were able to buy a model 3... but I'm just basing that on objective reality.

 

[David_Cary]

From a class standpoint, $7500 off a model Y would get me to sell my Model S. The price would be depressed since I would not be the only one. So a used S or $20k is likely as is a used 3. I imagine a Leaf would be $5k many times.

Of course, right now, almost every manufacturer has the full TC. So we are just talking about Tesla but that is the largest player. I do think Tesla would raise prices a bit but also commit to more volume buildout.

Yes please $2 a gallon tax with the money used to pay eliminate payroll taxes on anyone under $68k (or whatever number works). And perhaps graduated - no payroll tax on first $30k; 50% on $30-$60k. Of course, doesn't help the retired or disabled folk - but presumably they don't have to drive as much.

 

[imola.zhp]

I wonder, if all of this were to happen, if a retro-active credit would be possible.

Our order is on hold until 01/01/2021 but I'm itching to go ahead and get the car. I guess November 4th isn't very far away at this point.

 

[CyberGus]

I wonder, if all of this were to happen, if a retro-active credit would be possible...

The purpose of such a credit is to incentivize sales, making it pointless to apply retroactively. Fortunately my CT order is a year away lol

 

[ThomasD]

Why don't the democratic states raise their gas tax by 2 to three dollars a gallon then give the extra tax generated to lower income folks Show the Republican states how it's done.

 

[nwdiver]

Why don't the democratic states raise their gas tax by 2 to three dollars a gallon then give the extra tax generated to lower income folks Show the Republican states how it's done.

.... because the Republicans in those Democratic states would lose their EFFing sh*t if gubment makes the price of fools fuel go up by a cent. Only CA has purged enough morons to maybe make this work...

Plus you can't just give money to people that need money... that makes the problem worse because freedumb.

 

[David_Cary]

There is the whole argument of crossing borders to buy gas. It seems ridiculous unless you happen to live in a border area.

Much easier (politically) to say not charge payroll tax on the first $X of income - which can only be done at the federal level.

 

[cpa]

There is the whole argument of crossing borders to buy gas. It seems ridiculous unless you happen to live in a border area.

Much easier (politically) to say not charge payroll tax on the first $X of income - which can only be done at the federal level.

When a person changes jobs during the year, the worker might earn beneath the threshold for withholding Social Security and Medicare on each job, but exceed the threshold when the wages are combined.

If this is a credible suggestion (I’m not enthused) it would be more effective if the SS and Medicare were withheld at the source and then refunded when returns are filed.

And the Earned Income Credit (on the books since Tricky Dick’s Administration) effectively does this already.

 

[cpa]

From a class standpoint, $7500 off a model Y would get me to sell my Model S. The price would be depressed since I would not be the only one. So a used S or $20k is likely as is a used 3. I imagine a Leaf would be $5k many times.

Of course, right now, almost every manufacturer has the full TC. So we are just talking about Tesla but that is the largest player. I do think Tesla would raise prices a bit but also commit to more volume buildout.

Yes please $2 a gallon tax with the money used to pay eliminate payroll taxes on anyone under $68k (or whatever number works). And perhaps graduated - no payroll tax on first $30k; 50% on $30-$60k. Of course, doesn't help the retired or disabled folk - but presumably they don't have to drive as much.

Some retired folk are snowbirds. Others live in rural areas and still have to drive 50-100 miles per week for major shopping or medical appointments. While job commutes may be eliminated, other life’s choices increase.

 

[traxila]

Tesla is already primed to prosper with no tax credits whatsoever. Their economies of scale have reached the point where it is obviously cheaper to manufacture a BEV as opposed to an ICE in the same class. Their margins are great and continuously improving. Tesla's battery roadmap will only blow the disparity up.

Any tax credit issued by a new administration that applies to Tesla will just be unfair... but I will take it!

Never saw a demand problem to begin with, but take the M3 prices and knock off five to seven thousand on top if it and fuggedaboutit.