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BMW says they can't mass produce EVs until 2020

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by mspohr, Mar 22, 2018.

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  1. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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  2. slam

    slam Member

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    I think it's more that they have realized they cannot use a lot of their old ICE factory infrastructure to build EVs and that this will require a very high capital investment to retool their lines. Because of that, they're warning that their profit margins won't be huge until 2020 (which is really less than 2 years away).
     
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  3. Kandiru

    Kandiru Active Member

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    Yes they can, just give the anal retainers on The Board lithium enemas, LMFAO
     
  4. Spidy

    Spidy Active Member

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    You mean Tesla who are just selling long range Model 3 due to higher profit margins?
     
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  5. FlyF4

    FlyF4 Son of a MX

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    Hmmmm, even if they had one tomorrow, it is a car I have never liked and would never buy.... but that's just me. Clearly it is a popular brand.
     
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  6. metier

    metier Member

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  7. Phrixotrichus

    Phrixotrichus Member

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    Are you talking about the Tesla that`s surviving purely on investor goodwill and promises for the future or is there another Tesla I don`t know of?
     
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  8. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    Believe it or not there are still people who don't understand the difference between investment and operations.
     
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  9. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    Fortunately there are investors who understand current gross profit (25%) and investment for future growth.
     
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  10. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    And B M W couldn't make and sell such a car? Against their principles?
     
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  11. metier

    metier Member

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    But when your net profit is losing you 700 million a quarter how long are those investors going to stick around, specially when you can not hit any of your production numbers? How long are they going to believe the story?
     
  12. SabrToothSqrl

    SabrToothSqrl Active Member

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    2020 is when we will finally have turn-signal-free-BMW-branded electricity. Then and only then can we fill our cars with the premium electrons (at the premium pricing) BMW deserves ;)
     
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  13. Phrixotrichus

    Phrixotrichus Member

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    #13 Phrixotrichus, Mar 23, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2018
    Fortunately there are also enough investors who understand that this business approach doesn`t magically always work just because it worked for someone like Bezos.
    It´s high risk high reward, but enthusiasts tend to completely ignore the "risk" part ...
     
  14. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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  15. McRat

    McRat Well-Known Member

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    This is why Toyota is moving very slowly as are many other car companies. Some have not started selling any BEVs yet. BMW does sell BEVs, albeit at a loss.

    Nobody is making profits by selling electric cars yet. Any press releases to the contrary are misleading.

    The companies that can hold back longer will improve their profits the most.

    The fact that Mary Barra can keep the GM board happy while dumping billions into advanced propulsion and AV tech is a miracle. You'd think they would have replaced her already.
     
  16. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    The legacy automakers all seem to have adopted this slow strategy. Their risk is that they have ceded the market to Tesla.
     
  17. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    The risk of holding back is loss of market. (Kodak, Xerox, etc)
     
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  18. McRat

    McRat Well-Known Member

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    China will wipe out the US EV industry if permitted. They have cheap energy from their coal (for aluminum and steel production), the government allows dumping, and they are trying to corner the market on critical materials for EVs.

    Why haven't the Chinese done it? Not even the Chinese can endure the amount of losses necessary to wipe out all competition in the EV market. IIRC, the CODA was Chinese. It was the first EV I drove (pre-release). They could not do it.

    The Chinese now have all the technology required, mostly stolen. The financial aspect just isn't feasible yet.

    2020 will certainly be a challenge. That's about when the Chinese will make their move.
     
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  19. mspohr

    mspohr Well-Known Member

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    As long as Tesla keeps growing and producing, investors will stay. If it gets to the point where they can't raise more capital, I guess they will just have to stop investing in new stuff and milk their 25% profit margin on existing production.
     
  20. McRat

    McRat Well-Known Member

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    #20 McRat, Mar 23, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2018
    The risk of jumping the gun is also severe. Xerox invented the mouse before folk wanted it, and their 820's had built in networking. Too early. IIRC Kodak invented digital cameras when the tech was still too expensive for the market. Everybody says it was to protect the film division, but the camera was about $4000 in today's dollars. Kodak ended up producing digital camera under the Apple branding. Which were also a failure two decades later. Still too early.

    I purchased a Sony that took VGA (640x480) pictures onto a floppy in the late 1990's almost 25 years after Kodak invented the digital camera. It was $900 ($1,400 in 2018 dollars) and was still a failure.

    Whoever tries to attack the EV market at the right time with bloodlust will be the winner. This occurs again and again in industry. Timing is more important than innovation. Or Farnsworth TVs would be a household name, and Amana would be the microwave of choice.

    Facebook was not the first social networking app, and Google was a latecomer to search engines. AOL and Alta Vista are dead.
     
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