Brexit

[Buckminster]

Red rag to a bull. Another failure from the EU. This will ensure that the members vote in Truss who will most likely be tougher than Bozza with the EU.
EU launches new legal proceedings against UK over Northern Ireland protocol – UK politics live

 

[JupiterMan]

Red rag to a bull. Another failure from the EU. This will ensure that the members vote in Truss who will most likely be tougher than Bozza with the EU.
EU launches new legal proceedings against UK over Northern Ireland protocol – UK politics live

We've already seen Truss disowning her previous remainer stance, and Sunak still thanks that borders and trade barriers will somehow aid economic growth... so what have the EU to lose?

Doing this now will make sure it is at the top of the in pile for the next PM. Perhaps they have made the calculation that for all the bluster the next PM will ultimately once in power choose an alternative path to breaking the law?

 

[petit_bateau]

We've already seen Truss disowning her previous remainer stance, and Sunak still thanks that borders and trade barriers will somehow aid economic growth... so what have the EU to lose?

Doing this now will make sure it is at the top of the in pile for the next PM. Perhaps they have made the calculation that for all the bluster the next PM will ultimately once in power choose an alternative path to breaking the law?

The EU has long noted that the little-englander bigots bank any concessions as the new baseline. The EU has tired of this.

 

[Buckminster]

We've already seen Truss disowning her previous remainer stance, and Sunak still thanks that borders and trade barriers will somehow aid economic growth... so what have the EU to lose?

Doing this now will make sure it is at the top of the in pile for the next PM. Perhaps they have made the calculation that for all the bluster the next PM will ultimately once in power choose an alternative path to breaking the law?

EU have consistently misjudged UK stance - have they heard of reverse psychology? Clearly none of them are parents. Tell a child that he is naughty - what do you get? Tell a child what they have to do - what do you get?

I would rate 70% chance that Sunak would have moved to a legal position. His whole platform is built on being a safe pair of hands. He has to show some brexiteering attitude to have chance of making PM. Zero chance that Truss will.

Truss is gonna win and we are gonna get more fireworks. Not good for the EU.

 

[petit_bateau]

The EU has long noted that the little-englander bigots bank any concessions as the new baseline. The EU has tired of this.

"EU officials said this posed a risk to the single market and that the current arrangements and the failure to implement controls had already been a spur to smugglers."

EU launches four more legal cases against UK over Northern Ireland protocol

New cases come on top of three others already in motion heading to European court of justice

www.theguardian.com

 

[JupiterMan]

EU have consistently misjudged UK stance - have they heard of reverse psychology? Clearly none of them are parents. Tell a child that he is naughty - what do you get? Tell a child what they have to do - what do you get?

I would rate 70% chance that Sunak would have moved to a legal position. His whole platform is built on being a safe pair of hands. He has to show some brexiteering attitude to have chance of making PM. Zero chance that Truss will.

Truss is gonna win and we are gonna get more fireworks. Not good for the EU.

the only issue you illustrate here its that the UK is acting like a naughty child.

 

[Buckminster]

the only issue you illustrate here its that the UK is acting like a naughty child.

Exactly and if the EU continue we will end up in a lose lose situation. 10% chance UK manage to find a lose (EU) win (UK) scenario (US and UK enter TTP etc.). EU cannot win by being tough. At least until Starmer makes it into number 10 and rolls over to show them his soft furry belly. That will ensure we never make it back into the EU. The prospect of the the euro alone will put the voters off.

I said this all many times when May was PM. Had EU thrown us a bone then (which was the best and maybe only time) we would have been putty in their hands and would be moving towards the Norway solution or back into EU in a few years. Maybe EU banking on Murdoch dying...he has just changed wives or something.

EU will no doubt soon have more economic problems which won't help.

Elon says that the outcome will be the most entertaining... Truss could be more entertaining than Bozza. Less skilled and more bluster plus maybe she will come up with her own form of the maybot dance.

 

[petit_bateau]

Exactly and if the EU continue we will end up in a lose lose situation.

The EU's priority is the EU. Provided the EU can contain any UK efforts to create damage, then that is pretty much the only real interest the EU has in the UK at this point. And as far as the EU is concerned it is an entirely domestic UK matter if the UK chooses to move towards reintegration with the EU; complete poodling to the US; or fission into smaller states. The key point is that the EU's priority is the EU, and that means containing any attempts by the UK to inflict damage on the EU. The EU is well aware that the Cons have a lock on the UK electoral system, and that the Cons are in hock to ultra-right and the ultra-rich, and so in effect the EU is well aware these are a problem: these are not partnership material. Partners are friends who can be trusted, and the UK no longer justifies that term. In many respects the EU now views the UK as a potential threat in almost every respect.

If individuals in the UK wish for the UK to Rejoin, then it is up to them change the facts within the UK, or to split up the UK into manageable chunks. Not to wail about the EU.

De facto the vast majority of the people of Northern Ireland are EU citizens, and as such the EU is doing its best to protect their rights under the WA, and the interests of Eire. Again, if the UK doesn't like that, then that is the UK's problem. The EU will - and is - protecting them, and itself against the very real threat that is attacking it. The effect on the wider UK is not a real concern to the EU any more.

 

[Buckminster]

The EU's priority is the EU. Provided the EU can contain any UK efforts to create damage, then that is pretty much the only real interest the EU has in the UK at this point. And as far as the EU is concerned it is an entirely domestic UK matter if the UK chooses to move towards reintegration with the EU; complete poodling to the US; or fission into smaller states. The key point is that the EU's priority is the EU, and that means containing any attempts by the UK to inflict damage on the EU. The EU is well aware that the Cons have a lock on the UK electoral system, and that the Cons are in hock to ultra-right and the ultra-rich, and so in effect the EU is well aware these are a problem: these are not partnership material. Partners are friends who can be trusted, and the UK no longer justifies that term. In many respects the EU now views the UK as a potential threat in almost every respect.

If individuals in the UK wish for the UK to Rejoin, then it is up to them change the facts within the UK, or to split up the UK into manageable chunks. Not to wail about the EU.

De facto the vast majority of the people of Northern Ireland are EU citizens, and as such the EU is doing its best to protect their rights under the WA, and the interests of Eire. Again, if the UK doesn't like that, then that is the UK's problem. The EU will - and is - protecting them, and itself against the very real threat that is attacking it. The effect on the wider UK is not a real concern to the EU any more.

I think they care more than you think otherwise they would turn the other cheek. Reintegration could take 20 years or more and will only happen if the EU don't screw it up by continuing to piss off the UK public (the middle 60% included whether they voted remain or exit). Dover being the example du jour. Being the US poodle will feel luxurious after this treatment.

 

[Buckminster]

Rishi Sunak and Liz Truss vow dramatic expansion of Rwanda asylum scheme

Another example. EU don't help on the border - EU gets an increasingly right wing government and public. And they thought it couldn't get worse than Bozza.

 

[JupiterMan]

Rishi Sunak and Liz Truss vow dramatic expansion of Rwanda asylum scheme

Another example. EU don't help on the border - EU gets an increasingly right wing government and public. And they thought it couldn't get worse than Bozza.

people say all kinds of things in election campaigns.

whether Truss/Sunak will see it through after election, and perhaps more importantly, whether they have the charisma to take the country with them is another matter.

Dover being the example du jour.

What is happening at dover is not because of the EU, it is because of Brexit. some brexit meatheads will think otherwise, but facts are facts.

 

[petit_bateau]

Not much sunlit upland here

British exporters report stagnating trade as post-Brexit delays blamed

Customs checks and border queues cited as leading barriers, as only 29% of firms say sales increased in Q2

www.theguardian.com

UK car industry’s 1m vehicles a year target slips by two years to 2025

War in Ukraine, lockdowns in China and chip shortages among factors slowing recovery in sector already hit by Covid

www.theguardian.com

 

[petit_bateau]

I think they care more than you think otherwise they would turn the other cheek. Reintegration could take 20 years or more and will only happen if the EU don't screw it up by continuing to piss off the UK public (the middle 60% included whether they voted remain or exit). Dover being the example du jour. Being the US poodle will feel luxurious after this treatment.

The UK has created an existential crisis for itself. There is no dictat that says the UK will survive. The UK in its current form only dates from 1921, scarcely 100-years.

 

[Buckminster]

The UK has created an existential crisis for itself. There is no dictat that says the UK will survive. The UK in its current form only dates from 1921, scarcely 100-years.

I disagree but wish I saw things your way. I would love to go back to being in a "successful" EU.

 

[JupiterMan]

Jacob Rees-Mogg says he was wrong to insist there would be no delays in Dover​

in reality he was deceptive, ignorant and abused the democractic process.

He has also demonstrably not "taken back control".

 

[Buckminster]

Jacob Rees-Mogg says he was wrong to insist there would be no delays in Dover​

in reality he was deceptive, ignorant and abused the democractic process.

He has also demonstrably not "taken back control".

This is great news assuming France don't want to step up. Everyone will fly to Spain so that in a couple of years I will be able to hop across the channel in the middle of summer without having to endure the masses. Sorry for finding the silver lining...

 

[JupiterMan]

This is great news assuming France don't want to step up. Everyone will fly to Spain so that in a couple of years I will be able to hop across the channel in the middle of summer without having to endure the masses. Sorry for finding the silver lining...

"silver lining", quite how is this an attractive alternative?

not sure also quite how freight and cars will divert to Barcelona or Madrid......

meanwhile, in the real world, things will soon get even worse at all points of entry to EU with biometric tests coming soon, which will add further to delays.

You will only ever be able to "hop across" again on restoring the British people's freedom of movement.

 

[Zilla91]

You will only ever be able to "hop across" again on restoring the British people's freedom of movement.

Unfortunately the British people aren’t interested in restoring their freedom of movement

 

[JupiterMan]

Unfortunately the British people aren’t interested in restoring their freedom of movement

There may be a critical mass for this now, but we do not know - as at least 48% of the British were interested judging from the 2016 referendum result, and as younger people become eligible to vote this may be higher by now.

Also if you then consider the many who voted "leave" but were happy with a "norway" deal or a "switzerland" deal (even Farage was promoting that during the referendum campaign) , i.e. single market membership and free movement, then it is likely an actual majority of the British public would prefer this.

It was only after the referendum that the Tories decided to ditch the single market... Boris Johnson was still for it, and on the record as being so even after the referendum, but then turned as the right wing dinghy obsession and his lust for power took over from the realities of British trade out our rights.

for now, the positives of single market membership and free movement is suppressed by a minority, being the members of the Conservatives party (many of whom were UKIP) who choose the prime minister and the right wing client media who promote their interests and continually use immigration as a weapon to control the message and keep voters in line.

and then there's me. I am British and I am interested!

 

[petit_bateau]

10 reasons Brexit has been disastrous for Britain​

As small businesses crumble, shelves get emptier and the care-worker shortage intensifies, life outside the EU is having a dire effect on many of us. Why aren’t politicians talking about it?

Spiralling inflation, crops left in the field and travel chaos: 10 reasons Brexit has been disastrous for Britain

As small businesses crumble, shelves get emptier and the care-worker shortage intensifies, life outside the EU is having a dire effect on many of us. Why aren’t politicians talking about it?

www.theguardian.com