Buyer Beware: AP2 Extremely Dangerous

[_jal_]

Used the GoPro to record my drive home today. As luck would have it, never had to go over 45 so I was able to have it engaged the whole time. Had to override during a merge and a couple lane changes, but other than that it was all auto. I sped it up 5x

I know AP2 sucks and we should all be upset, but I'd have been pretty impressed if I saw that video 2 years ago.

 

[BestRadar]

I am not impressed look at this video and look at the date:

That video is from 2013. Its 2017 so I expect much better by now.

 

[josher32]

Here is a nice video of Nvidia's autonomous driving demo. I have to think Tesla maybe following similar strategy since they are using Nvidia supercomputer.

And this looks a lot like AP2 video:

 

[J1mbo]

My bet is that none of the extra cameras are in use at the moment, as they try to reach parity with AP1. Would be interesting to see what happened if someone covered the 4 side cams and reversing cam with masking tape - would the car error with AP "not available" or not?

 

[malcolm]

17.5.28 is out apparently

I notice that the OP is on 17.3.2

You're welcome.

 

[Saghost]

My bet is that none of the extra cameras are in use at the moment, as they try to reach parity with AP1. Would be interesting to see what happened if someone covered the 4 side cams and reversing cam with masking tape - would the car error with AP "not available" or not?

There's actually some evidence that the AP2 cars are using the rear/side cameras at least - AP2 cars are posting images of a blind spot warning that shows as narrower and more to the rear than I've ever seen on my AP1 car (which has always been a ninety degree arc on the rear corner, and continues to be.)

The most likely thing for that to be is the result of objection recognition off of the rear/side cameras, since they still get the 90 degree version too and there aren't any other new sensors...

 

[J1mbo]

This could just be the new ultrasonics as well...

 

[Chris Fox]

Droneflyer got a slap on the wrist with only one dislike!

I may consider the fastest M3 without autonomy features just to bring the cost down. We can't discount other peoples expectations though, especially if they slapped down 8k expecting something.

Good thing is Tesla I'm sure will make good on their promise -eventually-. My Volt 2017 "autonomy" was broken from day 1 and will remain forever broken.

The best thing for Tesla to do here is to offer discounts for those who buy in early and charge more for later adopters. They already do this in a way, but changing the message will make a lot of people happier and set expectations accordingly.

Agreed, we can't discount other peoples expectations, but when Tesla says "Features are very limited" and then someone buys it anyway, then why have disappointed expectations? You shouldn't have any expectations...

 

[Drone Flyer]

Autopilot 2! LOL!

 

[NerdUno]

Agreed, we can't discount other peoples expectations, but when Tesla says "Features are very limited" and then someone buys it anyway, then why have disappointed expectations? You shouldn't have any expectations...

The point is that Tesla made no such disclaimer to most of us that purchased cars during the last quarter of 2016.

 

[bonnie]

The point is that Tesla made no such disclaimer to most of us that purchased cars during the last quarter of 2016.

It's been on the order page from the beginning (I just checked using the Wayback Machine). When you were ordering & selected AP2, it's right there.

 

[Ohm it]

17.5.28 is out apparently

I notice that the OP is on 17.3.2

You're welcome.

Our S updated to 17.5.28 Friday night... increased autosteer to 50mph and TACC up to 80mph... No car images showing up in adjacent lanes just the radar image.
Still no mention of the rain sense wipers or auto dim high beams ??

 

[Deans]

View attachment 213453
It's been on the order page from the beginning (I just checked using the Wayback Machine). When you were ordering & selected AP2, it's right there.

Nope, that's what it said in January '17. In December and November '16 it said the software was expected to COMPLETE in December. It didn't say anything about a gradual rollout or months of beta testing or hundreds of millions of miles

 

[182RG]

It's been on the order page from the beginning

Um, no. As late as January 2, 2017, it said this:

 

[schonelucht]

It's been on the order page from the beginning (I just checked using the Wayback Machine). When you were ordering & selected AP2, it's right there.

Is there a trick to get the wayback machine to load the order configuration page? All the snapshots I try either fail to load or just load halfway through (not showing the options). Do I have the clear cookies? Anyone has better luck?

 

[bonnie]

Is there a trick to get the wayback machine to load the order configuration page? All the snapshots I try either fail to load or just load halfway through (not showing the options). Do I have the clear cookies? Anyone has better luck?

I'm not doing anything special other than patience. My first try I thought it wasn't there. Then Tesla's 'rotating wheel' started on the page and after several minutes, it loaded. It's slow. I didn't clear any cookies, didn't do anything special other than get distracted and left the page on my screen, which eventually loaded.

It might not be fully loading for every single date, only the dates that it changed. Or I just didn't wait long enough on some of the dates I tried.

 

[bonnie]

Um, no. As late as January 2, 2017, it said this:

View attachment 213470

s

I can't say what date I finally checked (as noted above, it took forever to load) - so I accept that I misspoke. Apologies.

However, when I see the word 'expect' I take that to mean just what it says. 'Expect' is usually tied to intentions, knowing there are variables. And I know this has been argued in other threads by other people, not looking to restart that particular discussion. I'm only stating that when I ordered my X in mid-Dec, I was well aware that 1) AP2 features were not active and 2) those features were going to roll out "soon-ish", subject to regulatory approval. So my only point is that some customers felt informed when they purchased (like me).

 

[182RG]

So my only point is that some customers felt informed when they purchased (like me).

Bonnie, no argument with this, since using the word "some" indicates that you realize that some people were mis-informed. Some were not accidentally mis-informed. Some demo'd AP1 cars, and were told by sales directly that parity would be achieved in December 2016. This was reported numerous times here, and in other forums. I agree, there is no need to re-argue semantics over 'expected', but me and others take it from a manufacturer of consumer products as an expectation, a commitment, that is based on inside knowledge.

Let's be honest, too. You are a Tesla alumni, an insider as it were, who has been around for a long time in the Tesla world. You understand EM's use of hedge words, his penchant to be deliberately abstruse, and some of the exaggerated promises that are passed of as "that's just Tesla". Sorry, I believe that EM and Tesla deliberately misled, and continue to mislead owners and prospective buyers. Thus far, they seemingly have gotten a pass on it. It's not right.

 

[bonnie]

Bonnie, no argument with this, since using the word "some" indicates that you realize that some people were mis-informed. Some were not accidentally mis-informed. Some demo'd AP1 cars, and were told by sales directly that parity would be achieved in December 2016. This was reported numerous times here, and in other forums. I agree, there is no need to re-argue semantics over 'expected', but me and others take it from a manufacturer of consumer products as an expectation, a commitment, that is based on inside knowledge.

Let's be honest, too. You are a Tesla alumni, an insider as it were, who has been around for a long time in the Tesla world. You understand EM's use of hedge words, his penchant to be deliberately abstruse, and some of the exaggerated promises that are passed of as "that's just Tesla". Sorry, I believe that EM and Tesla deliberately misled, and continue to mislead owners and prospective buyers. Thus far, they seemingly have gotten a pass on it. It's not right.

My use of the word 'some' was recognition I could not speak for every single person. Only myself. At least one customer. It was not trying to say, as you assume, that I realized some people were misinformed.

You can believe what you want - I've was silent on this site for several months, including the period you describe, because I've been busy moving, buying land, etc. I got my info from the website. I came back AFTER I placed my order to let forum friends know I'd finally ordered my X (thread is out there). All that to say I've been very very disconnected til recently.

 

[Deans]

I agree with 182RG above. Did Tesla really, truly expect to complete validation within December? At what time did they realize that this expectation was in no way reasonable? I ordered end of November. There is no way they really expected to be complete in a month when it's obvious now that it's not even close to being complete. They can't advertise "expect" when they absolutely did not expect that at the time they were advertising to make sales.
False and misleading advertising used to boost Q4 sales.

I would have definitely held off purchase had I known that AEB would not be available for an unknown time after my purchase. I consider that feature a "must have" and would not consider buying a car that doesn't have it.