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CA DMV failing Tesla car for behind the wheel drive test
- Thread starter electric_cafe
- Start date
I am 16 years old, and I didn’t initially pass my driving test at the California DMV because I was driving a new Tesla. I received an automatic fail due to “relying on regenerative braking.” Regenerative braking simply means that the car slows down when you release the gas pedal quicker than when you do so with a gas car. It serves to boost energy efficiency. A 2021 Tesla cannot turn this off. This is the way the car drives. It was thus not possible to pass the driving test in a new Tesla.
For the last year, I spent considerable energy convincing my parents to go electric. My pleas eventually won them over, and they went fully electric in 2021. In this small way, I was making a difference. Vehicle emissions from burning gasoline and diesel fuels contain toxic pollutants and account for 80% of smog-causing air pollution in California.
California is supposed to lead the way to zero emissions and show the country and world how to get there faster. Governor Gavin Newsom signed an executive order in September 2020 to have all new passenger car and truck sales in the state be all-electric by 2035. Governor Newsom stated at the press conference that those who oppose the move will find themselves “on the wrong side of history.” Yet, the California Department of Motor Vehicles, a part of the California State Transportation Agency, is opposing the move.
When we pulled up to the DMV for the driving test with our Tesla, the examiner looked exasperated and asked if we could turn off the regenerative braking. This was apparently possible in older Teslas but is no longer an option. Although we said no, he allowed me to take the test. I drove the course, and when we arrived back at the DMV, I fully expected to receive my license. Instead, I was told I received an automatic fail because the car slowed down before my foot was on the brake. I was stunned and disappointed. There is no way to avoid this in a new Tesla.
My fail fell under the critical driving error category of “auxiliary equipment use.” The comments section read “Applicant relied on regenerative braking to slow vehicle.” In contrast to the DMV examiner’s claim, this is not even how the critical error “auxiliary equipment use” is meant to be used.
We spoke to the Supervisor at the DMV. She tried to claim that the DMV does not disallow electric cars for driving tests, while also acknowledging that this is effectively untrue for new Teslas. We told her that they were punishing drivers who had gone electric. Regenerative braking is a way of taking the wasted energy from the process of slowing down a car and using it to recharge the car’s batteries. On a gas car, braking wastes energy. With regenerative braking, some of the energy can be reused. The DMV is therefore failing electric drivers for the very aspect of the car that is conserving energy.
The DMV Supervisor said that we were not the first to complain about the unfairness of the situation. Online forums also suggest that mine is not an isolated incident. But she said that her instructions were coming from the state of California. At worst, the California DMV is failing all drivers with new electric cars; at best, it is evaluating them inconsistently. The Supervisor said she expected that the DMV would ultimately need to adjust its thinking, but it is not there yet. Just a few days ago, a story broke about another similar incident.
My family now has only electric cars. I had to borrow my grandfather’s car for my subsequent driving test, which I passed with no problem. I needed to take that test quickly because I also convinced my grandfather to order a new electric car.
My generation will live with the consequences of backward thinking. My generation wants change today. Slow adaptation of deep-rooted rules enforced by state agencies is failing us. We want change that is not riddled with hypocrisy or bottlenecked by bureaucracy.
Joshua Brand, 16
For the last year, I spent considerable energy convincing my parents to go electric. My pleas eventually won them over, and they went fully electric in 2021. In this small way, I was making a difference. Vehicle emissions from burning gasoline and diesel fuels contain toxic pollutants and account for 80% of smog-causing air pollution in California.
California is supposed to lead the way to zero emissions and show the country and world how to get there faster. Governor Gavin Newsom signed an executive order in September 2020 to have all new passenger car and truck sales in the state be all-electric by 2035. Governor Newsom stated at the press conference that those who oppose the move will find themselves “on the wrong side of history.” Yet, the California Department of Motor Vehicles, a part of the California State Transportation Agency, is opposing the move.
When we pulled up to the DMV for the driving test with our Tesla, the examiner looked exasperated and asked if we could turn off the regenerative braking. This was apparently possible in older Teslas but is no longer an option. Although we said no, he allowed me to take the test. I drove the course, and when we arrived back at the DMV, I fully expected to receive my license. Instead, I was told I received an automatic fail because the car slowed down before my foot was on the brake. I was stunned and disappointed. There is no way to avoid this in a new Tesla.
My fail fell under the critical driving error category of “auxiliary equipment use.” The comments section read “Applicant relied on regenerative braking to slow vehicle.” In contrast to the DMV examiner’s claim, this is not even how the critical error “auxiliary equipment use” is meant to be used.
We spoke to the Supervisor at the DMV. She tried to claim that the DMV does not disallow electric cars for driving tests, while also acknowledging that this is effectively untrue for new Teslas. We told her that they were punishing drivers who had gone electric. Regenerative braking is a way of taking the wasted energy from the process of slowing down a car and using it to recharge the car’s batteries. On a gas car, braking wastes energy. With regenerative braking, some of the energy can be reused. The DMV is therefore failing electric drivers for the very aspect of the car that is conserving energy.
The DMV Supervisor said that we were not the first to complain about the unfairness of the situation. Online forums also suggest that mine is not an isolated incident. But she said that her instructions were coming from the state of California. At worst, the California DMV is failing all drivers with new electric cars; at best, it is evaluating them inconsistently. The Supervisor said she expected that the DMV would ultimately need to adjust its thinking, but it is not there yet. Just a few days ago, a story broke about another similar incident.
My family now has only electric cars. I had to borrow my grandfather’s car for my subsequent driving test, which I passed with no problem. I needed to take that test quickly because I also convinced my grandfather to order a new electric car.
My generation will live with the consequences of backward thinking. My generation wants change today. Slow adaptation of deep-rooted rules enforced by state agencies is failing us. We want change that is not riddled with hypocrisy or bottlenecked by bureaucracy.
Joshua Brand, 16
Tam
Well-Known Member
Hi Joshua:
I agree with your assessment and it's unfortunate that you have to straighten out the system.
My suggestion is to ask for a repeat of the success story from your citation: Get publicity from CBS KPIX channel 5 Kiệt Đỗ that took only 1 hour to reverse the failing score into passing one. Try your local press outlets, tweeting, and Facebook with DMV.
Also, call your local California Representatives and Senators who can write up a law to straighten out the DMV.
Who knows? The new law might bear your name.
Don't give up! Others have done it, so can you!
Is it possible to take the test with a fully charged pack and use a two feet technique? One foot on brake pedal and one on accelerator. The fully charged pack should reduce the regen.
Tam
Well-Known Member
It may work if DMV has a charger for 100% charge. If you don't charge it at DMV and charge it at home, the low regen would wear off by the time you arrive at DMV.
Tam
Well-Known Member
Great idea. But if Joshua needs to travel almost 400 miles from Malibu to Oakland, it might be a better idea to take the test in Gilroy for almost the same distance where the failed Tesla score was reversed.
FlatSix911
Porsche 918 Hybrid
Charging to the maximum should not be required to pass the DMV test. The rules need to change and this could be a great case to make that happen.
thesmokingman
Active Member
Sorry to read that. I knew this would be an issue as our teen just passed the test this past September. Because of the way the drivers permit rules are now, I believe you're required to use a driver school and the school's do loan out cars for test. For us we have some ICE cars left so I made sure to not let our teen learn in the Tesla and only drive ICE because I just knew we'd be screwed if we showed up in a Tesla. And btw great jopb pushing everyone to EV!
israndy
Supercharger Hunter
FlatSix911
Porsche 918 Hybrid
AFAIK, just the F150 lightning is on the product roadmap along with the MachE and Transist Van.
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electrek.co
bo3bdar
Member
Unpopular opinion- the DMV instructors are right to fail people who are using one-pedal driving.
The point of the DMV test is demonstrate ability to safely drive any normal car. That would include other family cars, and also rental cars. If you are using one-pedal driving you are not demonstrating use of the brake, and for novice drivers this is not a particularly great idea. I've driven for over 30 years, and I found that one-pedal driving was making me sloppy and not defensive enough. It's not about the high regen, it's about not setting Stopping Mode to Hold.
Set the Tesla Stopping Mode to Creep mode, and the driver has to use the brake like regular cars. The DMV instructor won't fail you.
The point of the DMV test is demonstrate ability to safely drive any normal car. That would include other family cars, and also rental cars. If you are using one-pedal driving you are not demonstrating use of the brake, and for novice drivers this is not a particularly great idea. I've driven for over 30 years, and I found that one-pedal driving was making me sloppy and not defensive enough. It's not about the high regen, it's about not setting Stopping Mode to Hold.
Set the Tesla Stopping Mode to Creep mode, and the driver has to use the brake like regular cars. The DMV instructor won't fail you.
Tam
Well-Known Member
Stopping/hold/creep is about starting your brakes off and the car would creep or not despite the status of accelerator. The accelerator can be completely off, untouched and the car still can creep forward.
The examiner is not citing that automatic creep issue.
The examiner fails cars with regen.
Creep mode doesn't disable regen.
What is a "normal car"? Is it an automatic transmission? And if so, should I not be allowed to take my test with a stick shift? Some European countries require a stick shift car for the driving test. And some of us still drive manual transmissions.
My 2 cents is the future is electric, especially in California where this incident occurred. It's better to have a 16-year-old demonstrate knowledge of how regen braking works and be able to drive smoothly and safely with such as system. We all remember how when we first used regen we ended up stopping 10 feet back from the limit line. And were freaked out when the weather got cold and the regen did not work as well as we expected.
Tam
Well-Known Member
There are still about 36 car models in 2021 that have manual transmissions.
I agree with your assessment. When a car's setting is road legal AND there's no other setting to alter it (you cannot disable regen with 2021 Model S and X), DMV should not challenge that legality with students. They need to bring their challenge to regulators to ban those cars that they deem should not be passed for their DMV tests.
Regen is very similar to a manual transmission. If I drive on 1st or 2nd gear, when I take off my brakes, the car engine would just drastically slow the car down as if it's equipped with Regen.
Good analogy. I remember when I took my motorcycle driving test they made me upshift and downshift several gears in the parking lot of the DMV to demonstrate using usage of the engine's compression to slow the motorcycle.
Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
@brandfamily I'm sorry for your test drive failure that you certainly didn't deserve, and thank you for your elaborate posting.
Since more and more drivers will show up to the DMV with electric vehicles, the DMV inspector should
use an additional test, such as 'emergency braking situation' for which the driver should have to slam on the brake pedal.
What is not coherent with the DMV failure due to “relying on regenerative braking” was that I passed my DMV
with a manual car, and I often downshift to slow down the car using 'engine motor braking' to release some of the
braking energy, and also to have the correct gear engaged when re-accelerating after slowing down.
In some countries, like in Europe, a driver must know how to drive a manual car, and using a car with automatic gear box
is only allowed for drivers with some disabilities, and a special license would be given.
If the DMV disallows using 'regenerating brake' in the case of an electric car,
then the DMV should also disallow using 'engine motor brake' for cars with manual transmission.
I am not a lawyer, but it should be easy to find arguments to challenge what and how the DMV check a driver
during a the test drive in the case of cars with automatic gear box, as many drivers might not know the 'Low Gear' feature,
which could be life saving, as I know someone in family who was not able to stop at a stop sign because of overheating brake.
Since more and more drivers will show up to the DMV with electric vehicles, the DMV inspector should
use an additional test, such as 'emergency braking situation' for which the driver should have to slam on the brake pedal.
For example, the inspector should describe this situation, whereafter checking that there is no car immediately behind,
the inspector should yell at the driver 'Stop! There is a pedestrian crossing the street without looking.'
(In fact something very common with people glued to their phone while walking.)
What is not coherent with the DMV failure due to “relying on regenerative braking” was that I passed my DMV
with a manual car, and I often downshift to slow down the car using 'engine motor braking' to release some of the
braking energy, and also to have the correct gear engaged when re-accelerating after slowing down.
In the case of an automatic gear box, in contrast, the inspector should check if the driver knows the usage of using the 'Low Gear'
often marked with a '2' or a 'L', to control the speed while driving down very steep and long slopes, to avoid overheating the brakes
so the brakes will still be able to stop the car in case of emergency.
I often experienced following cars when driving back from the Yosemite National Park, and the car in front of me was constantly
using the brakes, while I was on 3rd or 2nd gear and never had to use my brake pedal. I doubt that the brakes on an heavy SUV
full of passengers and luggage will last very long, and also could stop a loaded car in an emergency situation.
I wonder if the DMV inspector should told me to use my brake pedal instead of the engine brake in this situation?
The recent accident where Tiger Wood was involved was located in a Los Angeles residential area, and the road had
several 'Use low gear' signs because of the slope of the road, there was even an emergency braking ramp for runaway trucks.
Using a 'Low' gear would have certainly prevented such accident.
In some countries, like in Europe, a driver must know how to drive a manual car, and using a car with automatic gear box
is only allowed for drivers with some disabilities, and a special license would be given.
If the DMV disallows using 'regenerating brake' in the case of an electric car,
then the DMV should also disallow using 'engine motor brake' for cars with manual transmission.
I am not a lawyer, but it should be easy to find arguments to challenge what and how the DMV check a driver
during a the test drive in the case of cars with automatic gear box, as many drivers might not know the 'Low Gear' feature,
which could be life saving, as I know someone in family who was not able to stop at a stop sign because of overheating brake.
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