Can I set up a Wall Connector and Nema 14-50 using the same line?

[ajdelange]

There are ways to potentially get extra circuits on an existing panel. There doesn't seem to be a hard and fast limit on how many phase-amps you can put on a panel with a given main breaker size. Four times seems to be sort of nominal (800 A with a 200 A main) but I have lots more than that and can demonstrate from historical records that draw never approaches 200A total (per phase).

Installing a sub panel obviously works. But 2 pole 50 A breakers come in the thin design so you only need to get rid of one fat single pole breaker to add a 50 amp dual pole for a new circuit provided that there are two stabs accessible under the slot you clear. And what about the slot you clear? You have to replace it and another fat single pole with slims or tandems. It depends on how your panel is configured, how old it is and how it is populated.

 

[jerry33]

[QUOTE="joebruin77, post: 4123350, member: 93195"
So if I am correct, what would be the cheapest way to safely have the configuration that TampaRich has, where the 14-50 outlet is right next to the Wall Connector and each has the 50 amp and 60 amp breaker respectively? It sounds like running a second line with the second line being connected to a 50 amp breaker in the breaker box would be the way to go.

If I do not have the capacity for another 50 amp breaker on my main breaker box, I could then either have my electrician install a subpanel or I could install the 14-50 outlet in an an RV panel with a double throw switch, such as the one miimura recommended? Which would be cheaper to install, a subpanel or a RV panel with a double throw switch?[/QUOTE]

Running a second line would be my recommendation.
Very few panels don't have room for another because you can always use a double switch for some of the 15 amp circuits to make room for another 50 amp. The main reason for a subpanel is if there are several circuits to run and the cost of the panel is less than the cost of the wiring (e.g. one wire run to the sub panel and several circuits to the devices. For example, the subpanel I have connects to the washer, dryer, UPS, a Clipper Creek for the Leaf, and two 15 amp circuits for the garage).

 

[joebruin77]

So I met with my electrician and we are going to install the Nema 14-50 outlet on a separate line with a 50 amp breaker. Now I need to choose the specific Nema 14-50 outlet. Can anyone recommend a specific Nema 14-50 outlet brand and model? This is for an outdoor installation on the front of my house. So I would want one that is rugged, water-proof, and has a way of locking when not in use. I appreciate any recommendations.

Thank you,
joebruin77

 

[jerry33]

So I met with my electrician and we are going to install the Nema 14-50 outlet on a separate line with a 50 amp breaker. Now I need to choose the specific Nema 14-50 outlet. Can anyone recommend a specific Nema 14-50 outlet brand and model? This is for an outdoor installation on the front of my house. So I would want one that is rugged, water-proof, and has a way of locking when not in use. I appreciate any recommendations.

For outside, what you want is a box that will cover the receptacle and the part of the UMC that houses the electronics, as they aren't made for heavy rain. Once you have the rainproof box (and lockable), the type of receptacle isn't an issue. If you are going to unplug daily, then there are receptacles with large duty cycles. Here is one: https://www.amazon.com/Hubbell-Wiri...CGCC3TGC9RY&psc=1&refRID=F5Q319ZHECGCC3TGC9RY

 

[TampaRich]

What size breaker do you have?

It’s on a 50. Thankfully my wall connector has worked flawlessly for over 4 years. Have never had to use the backup 14-50 outlet, but is a nice safety net if I ever need it.

 

[Watts_Up]

The configuration OP is asking about is exactly what I had installed 4 years ago.
No special adapters or splitters required, just a pass-through from the Nema 14-50 to Tesla wall charger.

I wonder what size of wires you used? I was surprised that you were able to connect two wires on the Tesla charger?
The connectors seems to be able to accept ony one single wire:

I was thinking that you have to use 3 way spliiers and put all the wires into a junction box to be able to branch out the second line:

 

[woodguyatl]

Yes, the Wall Connector is on a 60amp breaker. So if I want a 14-50 next to the Wall Connector, the electrician would have to run a new and separate line from the breaker box? What amp size should the breaker be for the 14-50 outlet?

FYI - the number after the dash for outlets is the max amperage AKA the breaker size.

 

[gilscales]

Don't forget that the new code requires that a 14-50 installed for the purpose of charging electric cars need GFCI protection

"625.54 Ground-Fault Circuit-Interrupter Protection for Personnel. All single-phase receptacles installed for the connection of electric vehicle charging that are rated 150 volts to ground or less, and 50 amperes or less shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel."

 

[Rocky_H]

I don't have the NEC with me so I can't check but as I recall it says EVSE requires a dedicated circuit. My question would be as to whether installing a transfer switch (e.g. GE 100 Amp 240-Volt Non-Fused Emergency Power Transfer Switch-TC10323R - The Home Depot) and an outlet would be considered adding things other than EVSE.

My wording "only thing" was slightly informal layman's terms. It wasn't about the only type of thing you can attach; it was about how many end connections you may have. It speaks of one endpoint. It is finally enforcing against this kind of condition where people attach 2 or 3 outlets or devices and "promise" not to use more than one at a time. They are codifying to prevent that from happening for whatever reason.

The determining authority isn't me or anyone else on this site. It's your local inspector. These provisions are new and inspectors that do mostly residential aren't always up to speed as this stuff is more industrial than residential.
I think you have a very good argument as to why this should be allowed. It's obviously safe. A logical inspector would probably accept it. A "book" man might not. Your electrician should knows the local inspectors.

And yes, of course it is up to the inspector, but several people here have reported that having the throw switch has been inspected and approved as fulfilling that "only one" type of requirement.

 

[davewill]

I wonder what size of wires you used? I was surprised that you were able to connect two wires on the Tesla charger?
The connectors seems to be able to accept ony one single wire:

I was thinking that you have to use 3 way spliiers and put all the wires into a junction box to be able to branch out the second line:

I think you misunderstood him. I'm pretty sure he did the junction inside the box with the 14-50, not inside the wall connector,