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Canadian CHAdeMO charging

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I wonder what they mean by “fast easy activation”. Swipe card? I already have 5 swipe cards in my EV wallet. Guess I can find room for another. :).
They have a credit/debt card tapping spot dead center, so that’s what they have in mind.
Down the road, they might do a card as well, it’ll depend on what people will tolerate.

You can also earn PetroPoints at chargers. ;)
 
I just received my Chademo adapter. This thing is huge. I'm just waiting for the firmware update and I will test it out on one of BC hydro free Chademo station. I've noticed there's a lot of new charging station coming this 2019 going up North to Prince George and also Jasper Narional Park.

Greetings @bolero - would you be so kind to let me know if this fits in the rear trunk well and if it does share a picture?

May the Electrons be with you.
 
Greetings @bolero - would you be so kind to let me know if this fits in the rear trunk well and if it does share a picture?

May the Electrons be with you.
It’s not THAT big bro. :p

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This is true, however at the grand opening event one of execs there revealed that the model they are currently leaning towards is time based, as in you’re charged for the length of time spent charging and not the power drawn.
When queried on that, the response was that only power utilities can charge per kilowatt hour, thus most charging networks use time instead. I believe he said it was driven by governmental policy (charging per unit of power being utility companies only) but I wasn’t a part of the conversation, so I might have misunderstood.
Those are the class of laws that inform Tesla Supercharging pricing. Tesla uses per kWh where they are allowed by local laws, and use the per min pricing where they are legally required to. I've never gotten in my car to check Canadian Superchargers in each province to see if this is the case across the country (in the provinces that currently have SC to check). I just know that Alberta is per min because I've charged there.

Was he stating this is Federal law? I would have expected that's province by province law.
 
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This is correct, only power companies can charge by the kWh in Canada. This is also why all Canadian superchargers are time, and not power, based.

A few months ago I wrote letters to both the Federal and Provincial levels of government explaining why this is an impediment to widespread electric vehicle adoption, and why a waiver for ev chargers should be introduced.

I suggest anyone else passionate about EVs should too.
I'm personally in favour of per minute pricing being the norm, to help discourage clogging of charging stations by slow-charging vehicles.
 
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I'm personally in favour of per minute pricing being the norm, to help discourage clogging of charging stations by slow-charging vehicles.

From my experience discussing EVs with people, the biggest issue with per minute charging is that it complicates the question of "how much will it cost to get 500 kms of range". It adds another step to the equation, which confuses people. Imagine how much more difficult it would be to figure out how much it would cost to fill up at a gas station if gas was sold per minute at the pump, and each gas station (and even different pumps at the same station) had pumps that fill at different speeds. It would be much more difficult for gas stations to advertise their prices to people driving by, and people would have to do math as they're driving down the street to try and compare prices.

For the general public who goes out and is looking to buy an electric vehicle, trying to wrap their head around the concept of $/min * charging rate * wh/km is enough to make people frustrated and confused. Pricing per kWh is what people are used to when buying gas, and allows an easy calculation of what a full charge will cost. Especially since exactly none of the fast charging options for Teslas charge at a consistent rate, varying the charging speed based on battery voltage and temperature, making it completely impossible to calculate how much a charge will cost before plugging into a $/min charger without first breaking out charging graphs and doing calculus.

Yes, right now most DC fast chargers are so heavily subsidized and cheap to use that this isn't really a concern for most current EV drivers, however as charger demand increases and the more price-sensitive income brackets start moving into EVs this issue will become a much larger obstacle to widespread EV adoption.
 
From my experience discussing EVs with people, the biggest issue with per minute charging is that it complicates the question of "how much will it cost to get 500 kms of range". It adds another step to the equation, which confuses people. Imagine how much more difficult it would be to figure out how much it would cost to fill up at a gas station if gas was sold per minute at the pump, and each gas station (and even different pumps at the same station) had pumps that fill at different speeds. It would be much more difficult for gas stations to advertise their prices to people driving by, and people would have to do math as they're driving down the street to try and compare prices.

For the general public who goes out and is looking to buy an electric vehicle, trying to wrap their head around the concept of $/min * charging rate * wh/km is enough to make people frustrated and confused. Pricing per kWh is what people are used to when buying gas, and allows an easy calculation of what a full charge will cost. Especially since exactly none of the fast charging options for Teslas charge at a consistent rate, varying the charging speed based on battery voltage and temperature, making it completely impossible to calculate how much a charge will cost before plugging into a $/min charger without first breaking out charging graphs and doing calculus.

Yes, right now most DC fast chargers are so heavily subsidized and cheap to use that this isn't really a concern for most current EV drivers, however as charger demand increases and the more price-sensitive income brackets start moving into EVs this issue will become a much larger obstacle to widespread EV adoption.
Already simple on cost “between 1/4 and 1/3 cost of gasoline for a 28 mpg car, aka typical sedan”. Or really “so cheap you'll quickly treat it as insignificant”. That’s exactly how I describe it, because that’s fairly universal & you don’t need to talk local rates even. That’s a big part of why I initially had a tough time answering that question, because it was so small. Then I went with “Houston to NYC & back was less than $150”. But ultimately I refined it to percentage of gas for people to grasp quickly.

Of course that’s specific to Tesla SC & home charging BEVs, if you’re using something else it might work out differently, given EA is aiming to make their pricing gasoline equivalent (!). But when you have the vehicle, if you still care, you’ll know the costs.

As for “charging companies will throttle”, Well it’ll be VERY obvious to the customer, the number will be right in their face. If they cannot do anything in response to that then they’re boned anyway.
 
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Supposedly the V3 SUperchargers have a battery backup (Bunch of PowerWalls?) to level off the peak consumption during charging. It's only logical that other chargers will adopt the same strategy. I suppose in times of high demand, the charger's battery would drain until there's a break in the charging line-up,, and some people would still have throttled charging. Worse, this would happen when there's a line-up to use the charger. (Depends how peak works. I know in the old utilities model, whatever peak you hit during the month, affects what you pay for the entire month's consumption.)
 
Supposedly the V3 SUperchargers have a battery backup (Bunch of PowerWalls?) to level off the peak consumption during charging. It's only logical that other chargers will adopt the same strategy. I suppose in times of high demand, the charger's battery would drain until there's a break in the charging line-up,, and some people would still have throttled charging. Worse, this would happen when there's a line-up to use the charger. (Depends how peak works. I know in the old utilities model, whatever peak you hit during the month, affects what you pay for the entire month's consumption.)
1) Powerpack, the commercial/utility version of a Powerwall. Powerpack - Commercial & Utility Energy Storage Solutions | Tesla
2) The advantage in mitigation of surge demand warrants consideration by other charging providers. I wonder how much of that is being done in Europe? It’ll be quite some time before it’ll be happening in NA. A couple years for use to even really be happening.
3) If there’s that much sustained draw that using the battery to partially displace usage draw, in a smart planning way to keep below peaking, can’t keep up then it is likely they undersized the install or there’s so much sustained use of that charger that the economics are okay drawing flat out. Having a big use isn’t inherently bad, it is having an uneven use. Having high percentage of capacity in use means you’re back near even.
 
1) Powerpack, the commercial/utility version of a Powerwall. Powerpack - Commercial & Utility Energy Storage Solutions | Tesla
2) The advantage in mitigation of surge demand warrants consideration by other charging providers. I wonder how much of that is being done in Europe? It’ll be quite some time before it’ll be happening in NA. A couple years for use to even really be happening.
3) If there’s that much sustained draw that using the battery to partially displace usage draw, in a smart planning way to keep below peaking, can’t keep up then it is likely they undersized the install or there’s so much sustained use of that charger that the economics are okay drawing flat out. Having a big use isn’t inherently bad, it is having an uneven use. Having high percentage of capacity in use means you’re back near even.
Yes and no. Last thanksgiving there were quite a few supercharger locations with appreciable lineups. My point was that if there’s a nonstop parade of cars charging during a peak event, it’s possible at some point to drain the battery.

(Assume the battery cuts mains draw in half. Then when it’s charged the equivalent of twice the battery capacity the battery is dead and cannot recharge until the line is gone (or reduce charge rates to keep peak down. Another strategy would depend on what the best peak meter avoidance techniques pay off best. Ideally everyone uses their car to plan their trip and it reports ahead to the charger which then calculates optimal contribution by the battery to minimize the monthly power bill. I’m sure the have programmers looking at this.)
 
They appear to be more transparent than Tesla in indicating which sites will come online next (though that's not saying much).

Some of the "Coming Soon" locations are in West or Mid-Canada.

EV Fast Charge car charging stations
Looks like some locations redundant with superchargers... (CrossIron/RockyView and Canmore...) so not super useful locations for me. Highway 16 appears to be ignored by PetroCan and Tesla :( . I'd like to get from Saskatoon to Jasper at least....
 
Yes and no. Last thanksgiving there were quite a few supercharger locations with appreciable lineups. My point was that if there’s a nonstop parade of cars charging during a peak event, it’s possible at some point to drain the battery.
Not every jurisdiction is like this, but usually the peak is per month. If it is once or twice a year that’s only 8%-15% of the months w/the higher cost.

I can’t speak to others but I wouldn’t expect Tesla shy away from keeping the power turned up. What they do seem willing to do is limit max SOC. Which is in the opposite direction, increasing charge speed.

Remember, experience first is Tesla’s goal here. They sell cars (well batteries, often with wheels on them), not charging.
 
Looks like some locations redundant with superchargers... (CrossIron/RockyView and Canmore...) so not super useful locations for me. Highway 16 appears to be ignored by PetroCan and Tesla :( . I'd like to get from Saskatoon to Jasper at least....
Those aren’t redundant, that’s the kind of spacing that’s required in the climate for winter.

Jasper to Edmonton CCS/Chademo is listed as planned, and Battleford Canadian Tire is listed, too I think? But yeah, those are going to be late for long distance charging (likely usage expectations).