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Canceling my reservation

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I started out at 1200 baud :eek:. Where does the time go?
Lucky you - 300 here! Thankfully I didn't have to deal with acoustic couplers, with the VicModem you would dial on the phone then unplug the cord from the handset and plug it into the modem.

At one point we learned you could tweak the UART timing for non-standard speeds, so I added support to my BBS and Terminal software to "zap baud rate". It would send test strings at ever increasing speeds until errors were introduced, then back off to a speed that worked without errors. Seem to recall I'd consistently get around 450-470 baud.

music term III v1.3.jpg
 
Lucky you - 300 here! Thankfully I didn't have to deal with acoustic couplers, with the VicModem you would dial on the phone then unplug the cord from the handset and plug it into the modem.

At one point we learned you could tweak the UART timing for non-standard speeds, so I added support to my BBS and Terminal software to "zap baud rate". It would send test strings at ever increasing speeds until errors were introduced, then back off to a speed that worked without errors. Seem to recall I'd consistently get around 450-470 baud.

View attachment 289644

I'm amazed to say I understood everything you said. ;)
 
I like my Model 3 a lot but am surprised to see anyone use the word luxurious to describe it.

everything is relative. It'd be the most luxurious car I've ever owned if I got one tomorrow.

Nissan Leaf and Toyota Prius are laughably poor on some parts of comfort and technology that I'd consider luxury features that Tesla provides even on the base trim.

My Saturn before that had nothing on a base Model 3.

I could go on and on but it just gets worse.
 
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So is health care for breathing polluted air, repair and relocation costs for rising sea levels, and insurance costs for natural disasters. Yes, stupidly expensive, much more than the cost of a BEV or the electricity to power it. Penny wise and pound fuelish.
Cow farts cause a large mount of atmospheric damage, should I turn vegan? Will you? I like my BBQ too much

Telsa is an expensive car with the world's most expensive DLCs. I'm not the only one that thinks so. To me its too expensive to jump on the bandwagon this stage. I will look at CPO M3 in the future but not now.

Also buying new things damages the environment as well. Updating to a new Tesla has significant environmental impacts, more so those clowns here that upgrade Teslas like Iphones then throw shade at ICE owners for "killing the environment"...

You're disillusional if you think otherwise.

Interesting.

I drive less than the average north American (10,000 miles per year), my oil burner cost me $32K USD, and has consumed $25K in fuel over 11 1/2 years of ownership.

Significant TCO factor imo. Electricity here in California is some of the most expensive in the states, and would have been about 1/2-1/3 of fuel.
Only significant saving with a Tesla is fuel, here is about half for me. I run about 300km a week on average. My car is modified and chews 9L/100km (26mpg) there about. Which equates to about $50 a week vs $20 for Tesla, So I save $1.3K a year there.

Road tolls, registration costs are the same.

But my insurance will increase by at least 5 times, I pay $600 comprehensive for my 15 year old WRX. Last time I want an expensive V8 that was around the $60K mark that was jump to $5K in insurance, so decided against it. Teslas are seen as expensive to repair in terms of accidents, so this might be higher. Another Subaru for a $30k will be $1.2K in insurance.

Servicing, I service my car myself. Cost me about $100 a year, I used cheap filters and use Diesel truck oil i buy in bulk. In terms of failures, nothing major in 15 years apart from toasted clutches but thats me being silly. say $300 a year on average including tyres and brakes.

Repairs, small accidents, sky is the limit for Tesla. My ICE, I can DIY most repairs by buying parts off wreaked car (recycling).

Depreciation, rate of Tesla 50% in 100,000 mile (160,000km). On a $70K car thats $35K for me. My WRX I bought at one year old for $29K, 15 years later I can sell it for 15K, net depreciation of $15K over a longer period of time. This is why I'm going for a Subaru again over a Tesla.

TL;DR, ownership of a Tesla over a ICE in 10 years
-$13K fuel
+$30k in insurance costs
- $3K in servicing
+ $20K depreciation.
= loss of $35K over 10 years over a ICE + $40K cost of a model 3 over a Subaru.

= -$70K
+ ???? in accident repair costs.



above In Kangaroo dollar (x0.77 to USD)
ref:

1. https://www.choice.com.au/transport/cars/eco-friendly/articles/tesla-model-3-costs-versus-savings
we pay around 0.30per KwH now, so its about $20 a week to run for arguments sake.

2. Tesla Model 3 to have best-in-class depreciation, report says
 
Cow farts cause a large mount of atmospheric damage, should I turn vegan? Will you? I like my BBQ too much
I became a vegetarian years ago, so there is that. If more people became vegetarians, they would be healthier and we would need fewer cows to support an unhealthy lifestyle.

Yes, too much of our luxurious lifestyle depends on non-renewable fossil fuels. But one has to start someplace and starting with the biggest polluter (that we have a personal direct control over), carbon emissions from ICE, is a good place to start, one user at a time. Individually one person is not going to make a significant difference, but an army of revolutionaries is what it is going to take. I would be a much wealthier person today if I had only considered the least expensive personal TCO of personal transportation and lifestyle and invested in oil stocks that were returning windfall profits, but I joined the revolution years ago and the rest is history for me and I am much happier because of it. Yes, I am a "complete enthusiast" and a hardcore tree hugging snowflake.

(I am going to enjoy all the 'disagrees' I get on this post, but it is worth it)
 
I became a vegetarian years ago, so there is that. If more people became vegetarians, they would be healthier and we would need fewer cows to support an unhealthy lifestyle.

Yes, too much of our luxurious lifestyle depends on non-renewable fossil fuels. But one has to start someplace and starting with the biggest polluter (that we have a personal direct control over), carbon emissions from ICE, is a good place to start, one user at a time. Individually one person is not going to make a significant difference, but an army of revolutionaries is what it is going to take. I would be a much wealthier person today if I had only considered the least expensive personal TCO of personal transportation and lifestyle and invested in oil stocks that were returning windfall profits, but I joined the revolution years ago and the rest is history for me and I am much happier because of it. Yes, I am a "complete enthusiast" and a hardcore tree hugging snowflake.

(I am going to enjoy all the 'disagrees' I get on this post, but it is worth it)
I dont buy in the consumerist treehugger lifestyle, its contradicts itself. Buying certain crap to make a statement about being "green" is an oxymoron. This includes the vegan lifestyle, I disagree about the positive health affect, infact I believe the opposite. However like most things, its about moderation more than a hard shift from 5th to R.

I agree fossil fuels need to go, but the numbers dont stack up buying a Model 3 at this stage as above. These are are early in life, prone to failure and treated like Iphones by thier customer base. The 1%ers buying these cars and saying they done their part for the world is short sighted and lazy slacktivism while they sit their McMansions.

Numbers also in terms of emissions. Sadly world is run by idiot conservative governments that are in bed with fossil fuel companies, even I switched to an EV, power is still come from coal, as much as I hate it. I would like a solar array however housing and solar here is prohibitly expensive much like Telsas.

Personally Id rather cycle to work but government policy and housing pricing prevents me doing this. Greater good for the individual is voting for non idiot governments. these are by far the worst polluters than any individual. Sustainable public transport is far better, Id prefer a train or pushbike than drive to be honest.

I miss the days being able to cycle to work, commute and cardio at the same time, though powered by beef...
 
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Cow farts cause a large mount of atmospheric damage, should I turn vegan? Will you? I like my BBQ too much
...

I quit eating meat in 1967. I was 19 years old and decided that killing sentient creatures to eat them, in an industrial nation where it's not needed (some pre-industrial societies need meat) was just barbaric.

My health improved, and after a few years I found that I enjoyed my vegetarian meals just as much as I ever enjoyed meat previously. I gave up none of the pleasure of eating food, and I gained enormously in health. (There were a couple of years when I missed eating meat, but that was a small price to pay for improved health.)
 
I dont buy in the consumerist treehugger lifestyle, its contradicts itself. Buying certain crap to make a statement about being "green" is an oxymoron.
Buying rooftop PV is "crap?" Buying a BEV or PHEV is "crap?" Reforestation is "crap?" Reducing water dependence is "crap?" Recycling is "crap?" Reducing your carbon footprint is "crap?" Tell me how these are an oxymoron?
This includes the vegan lifestyle, I disagree about the positive health affect, infact I believe the opposite. However like most things, its about moderation more than a hard shift from 5th to R.
You should have a conversation with your personal physician about the deleterious effects of meat in your diet. Don't take my word for it.

I agree fossil fuels need to go, but the numbers dont stack up buying a Model 3 at this stage as above. These are are early in life, prone to failure and treated like Iphones by thier customer base. The 1%ers buying these cars and saying they done their part for the world is short sighted and lazy slacktivism while they sit their McMansions.
For the record, my "McMansion" is a two bedroom, 2 bath, 1500 square feet bungalow. I didn't put my residential investment in square footage but rock solid insulation, the most currently advanced energy efficient appliances, energy efficient fenestrations, Solar City PV, a energy efficient irrigation system with lush award winning drought tolerant landscaping, etc. We can all do more to improve the environment as technology advances. If you cannot afford a model 3, there is no shame in that, but there are alternatives. You can purchase a previously owned Prius, Leaf, Bolt, etc. BEV or PHEV, something that will fit in your budget. Take a small step for a man, but a big step for mankind.

Numbers also in terms of emissions. Sadly world is run by idiot conservative governments that are in bed with fossil fuel companies, even I switched to an EV, power is still come from coal, as much as I hate it. I would like a solar array however housing and solar here is prohibitly expensive much like Telsas.
Become a consumer activist. Demand that your government and vote for those who support alternative energy through regulation, investment, and financial support.

Personally Id rather cycle to work but government policy and housing pricing prevents me doing this. Greater good for the individual is voting for non idiot governments. these are by far the worst polluters than any individual. Sustainable public transport is far better, Id prefer a train or pushbike than drive to be honest.

I miss the days being able to cycle to work, commute and cardio at the same time, though powered by beef...
I applaud your efforts to be environmentally conscious. I sincerely appreciate it. I am not your enemy, in fact my Aussie friends say I am a 'FAIR DINKUM' kind of guy. I am here to support and encourage you as your amigo. Together we can make a difference, one small step at a time. Don't be discouraged and don't give up. We shall overcome, the times they are a changin'.
 
Servicing, I service my car myself. Cost me about $100 a year, I used cheap filters and use Diesel truck oil i buy in bulk. In terms of failures, nothing major in 15 years apart from toasted clutches but thats me being silly. say $300 a year on average including tyres and brakes.
How are you spending $200/year on tires and brakes? Tires for my beater Prius are $200-$300 and last 4-6 years.

$200/year for me would cover tires, brakes, and a brand new hybrid battery from the factory every decade, not that the car needs a new hybrid battery every decade.

Also, I'd look for another insurance company. Charging you 5x what you pay for your Subi is nuts!
 
I'm holding on to my reservation just in case I need a BEV to replace my 02 Civic (also have an 11 Accord coupe and 16 RAV4H so really not in a rush to get a fourth car for three drivers since the Accord's resale is a pittance and the Civic holds no value but lots of utility) because by then (2020/21), the competition may just be churning out very limited number of BEVs. Outside of Tesla (first time doing this), I hate having to make a reservation, pay MSRP or next to no discount, be put in an opaque type of lottery where I may have to buy upsells to get a vehicle and be told the car will be ready by X but really arrives only by Y.

The minimum vehicle I think I will settle for would be a hybrid Toyota or Honda and if I feel like penny pinching. Because of CAFE requirements, car makers have to keep innovating to get better MPG which I think will lead to more costly repair jobs on the engines and transmissions eventually. At least with hybrids, there are fewer mechanical components and they're easier to start during winter time.

My gripes with the M3, likely so because my household isn't affluent (jobs are not as secure as in the past generations), though not dirt poor (from the most stupid concerns to the most major concerns of mine):

  1. ESA details haven't come out yet (I think it will be expensive to own a M3 post-warranty especially if you don't get one of the perfectly built units and paying $4k to cover eight years is my strategy; details will come out eventually)
  2. Build quality (repairable and seems a bit of a crap shoot which to me is better than mass production defects that affects all the cars)
  3. With multiple drivers, that one screen interface to access 95% of functions could necessitate opting for the $5k PUP if only for the driver memory settings (could be my personal money is an issue problem)
  4. To get TACC, I need to pay $5k for EAP (I don't need highway exit assist and could be my personal money is an issue problem)
  5. Lack of Right to Repair (goes back to cost of ownership post-ESA)
  6. I know almost everyone believes Tesla will survive but for my Honda's and Toyota, the thought of them leaving has never occurred to me.

Still waiting for the verdict on winter driving range for the SR since my wife drives around 130 miles round trip once a week but even if it's not doable, opting for the SR will allow me to perhaps swallow the thought of getting EAP and she can always drive the other cars for those days when the temperature is too frigid.

I've priced out a few cars for fun like the 2 Series and the Cayman and yes, the Germans really nickel and dime its customer base and ACC is not even available until you get into a much higher trim so I guess Tesla is going for the middle approach -- pricier upgrades compared to the Japanese non-luxury divisions but not as expensive as the Germans' ala carte offerings.
 
After following Tesla for 16 years, I've concluded that the Model 3 is not the car I've been waiting for and the Model Y doesn't look any better (we do know it will be on the Model 3 sled). It's too large, too expensive (how about that unicorn SD?), and too much of a gadget. Yes, OTA updates are cool, but jamming most of the functions into the software interface is a serious safety hazard. I don't want to have to take my eyes off the road while hunting through menus. Sure, once the interface stabilizes and I'm up on the learning curve, that isn't a problem, but until then it's flat out dangerous.

Maybe if I was younger and used to texting while driving instead of watching the road, this wouldn't bother me so much.

I also have problems with the location of the charge point, the fragile frunk lid, and being a beta tester for critical software; to name a few more points.

I certainly hope other people maintain their level of enthusiasm, so the stock price will continue to rise. Some day I'll buy an electric car using the profits, but I really don't think it will be a Tesla.
Good.
 
I dont buy in the consumerist treehugger lifestyle, its contradicts itself. Buying certain crap to make a statement about being "green" is an oxymoron. This includes the vegan lifestyle, I disagree about the positive health affect, infact I believe the opposite. However like most things, its about moderation more than a hard shift from 5th to R.

I agree fossil fuels need to go, but the numbers dont stack up buying a Model 3 at this stage as above. These are are early in life, prone to failure and treated like Iphones by thier customer base. The 1%ers buying these cars and saying they done their part for the world is short sighted and lazy slacktivism while they sit their McMansions.

Numbers also in terms of emissions. Sadly world is run by idiot conservative governments that are in bed with fossil fuel companies, even I switched to an EV, power is still come from coal, as much as I hate it. I would like a solar array however housing and solar here is prohibitly expensive much like Telsas.

Personally Id rather cycle to work but government policy and housing pricing prevents me doing this. Greater good for the individual is voting for non idiot governments. these are by far the worst polluters than any individual. Sustainable public transport is far better, Id prefer a train or pushbike than drive to be honest.

I miss the days being able to cycle to work, commute and cardio at the same time, though powered by beef...
I've have a sneaking suspicion that most members have put you on "ignore ".
 
Cow farts cause a large mount of atmospheric damage, should I turn vegan? Will you? I like my BBQ too much

Telsa is an expensive car with the world's most expensive DLCs. I'm not the only one that thinks so. To me its too expensive to jump on the bandwagon this stage. I will look at CPO M3 in the future but not now.

Also buying new things damages the environment as well. Updating to a new Tesla has significant environmental impacts, more so those clowns here that upgrade Teslas like Iphones then throw shade at ICE owners for "killing the environment"...

You're disillusional if you think otherwise.


Only significant saving with a Tesla is fuel, here is about half for me. I run about 300km a week on average. My car is modified and chews 9L/100km (26mpg) there about. Which equates to about $50 a week vs $20 for Tesla, So I save $1.3K a year there.

Road tolls, registration costs are the same.

But my insurance will increase by at least 5 times, I pay $600 comprehensive for my 15 year old WRX. Last time I want an expensive V8 that was around the $60K mark that was jump to $5K in insurance, so decided against it. Teslas are seen as expensive to repair in terms of accidents, so this might be higher. Another Subaru for a $30k will be $1.2K in insurance.

Servicing, I service my car myself. Cost me about $100 a year, I used cheap filters and use Diesel truck oil i buy in bulk. In terms of failures, nothing major in 15 years apart from toasted clutches but thats me being silly. say $300 a year on average including tyres and brakes.

Repairs, small accidents, sky is the limit for Tesla. My ICE, I can DIY most repairs by buying parts off wreaked car (recycling).

Depreciation, rate of Tesla 50% in 100,000 mile (160,000km). On a $70K car thats $35K for me. My WRX I bought at one year old for $29K, 15 years later I can sell it for 15K, net depreciation of $15K over a longer period of time. This is why I'm going for a Subaru again over a Tesla.

TL;DR, ownership of a Tesla over a ICE in 10 years
-$13K fuel
+$30k in insurance costs
- $3K in servicing
+ $20K depreciation.
= loss of $35K over 10 years over a ICE + $40K cost of a model 3 over a Subaru.

= -$70K
+ ???? in accident repair costs.



above In Kangaroo dollar (x0.77 to USD)
ref:

1. https://www.choice.com.au/transport/cars/eco-friendly/articles/tesla-model-3-costs-versus-savings
we pay around 0.30per KwH now, so its about $20 a week to run for arguments sake.

2. Tesla Model 3 to have best-in-class depreciation, report says

I think you are forgetting that one is a Tesla and one is a Subaru.

We can throw in a Civic, Elantra, Corollla or a thousand other examples that would make one look like a financial moron to even consider a Tesla. You are on a Tesla enthusiast forum not the “Who can keep their 15 year old dinosaur running the longest with salvaged air filters pulled from weekend dumpster diving trips at salvage yards” forum.

I like scoobies but the only thing they have in common with Tesla’s is they both have 4 wheels.

It’s always nice to also see WRXs make loud noises and turbo lag from light to light around Camrys but settle the F down when a Tesla pulls up.
 
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...At least with hybrids, there are fewer mechanical components and they're easier to start during winter time....

I won't try and change your mind about most of those opinions - I'm fine agreeing to disagree - except for the comment about hybrids being simpler and more reliable. I think it's the opposite: hybrids by definition have an ICE and all of its complexities and costs, PLUS electric engine and brake regeneration mechanicals as well. So I think of them as more complex, and more things can go wrong.

I got on to Tesla only a little while ago while researching hybrids for a friend. When I saw the compromises, I thought "wow, a pure electric is so much simpler and more elegant." I don't need a car (2013 Suzuki SX4 for winter, 2007 Miata [pictured] for summer), but I was so convinced in the logic and beauty of Elon's (and co) design that I put my deposit down there and then. I've been obsessed ever since.

It's great you have a hybrid but accept that you're still polluting almost as much. Do you know the RAV4 Hybrid uses only about 10%-20% less fuel than the gas model? I'm sure all the RAV4 drivers are patting themselves on the back because "I'm driving a hybrid!", but it's barely helping.

Again, I respect your priority of extending your assets and not getting into debt - I won't tell you what should be important to you - but I don't agree a hybrid is a simpler design than an EV.
 
...the numbers dont stack up buying a Model 3 at this stage as above. These are are early in life, prone to failure and treated like Iphones by thier customer base. The 1%ers buying these cars and saying they done their part for the world is short sighted and lazy slacktivism while they sit their McMansions.
You come across as very bitter and contemptuous ...
People buying the model 3 are by no means 1%ers, they aren't switching cars like iPhones, and certainly don't live in McMansions.
 
You come across as very bitter and contemptuous ...
People buying the model 3 are by no means 1%ers, they aren't switching cars like iPhones, and certainly don't live in McMansions.

Agree dsvick.

@Asymmetry So if I own an iPhone X and live in a 3700 sq ft house, I am somehow "disillusional"??

And I'm not if I eat red meat and drive an F-150?

Sheesh. Let's just give up vehicles altogether because according to you ANY progress is not going to help. Let's all just throw our hands up and give up. The battle is lost.

/end sarcasm/
 
I won't try and change your mind about most of those opinions - I'm fine agreeing to disagree - except for the comment about hybrids being simpler and more reliable. I think it's the opposite: hybrids by definition have an ICE and all of its complexities and costs, PLUS electric engine and brake regeneration mechanicals as well. So I think of them as more complex, and more things can go wrong.

I got on to Tesla only a little while ago while researching hybrids for a friend. When I saw the compromises, I thought "wow, a pure electric is so much simpler and more elegant." I don't need a car (2013 Suzuki SX4 for winter, 2007 Miata [pictured] for summer), but I was so convinced in the logic and beauty of Elon's (and co) design that I put my deposit down there and then. I've been obsessed ever since.

It's great you have a hybrid but accept that you're still polluting almost as much. Do you know the RAV4 Hybrid uses only about 10%-20% less fuel than the gas model? I'm sure all the RAV4 drivers are patting themselves on the back because "I'm driving a hybrid!", but it's barely helping.

Again, I respect your priority of extending your assets and not getting into debt - I won't tell you what should be important to you - but I don't agree a hybrid is a simpler design than an EV.

Yes and no. There are new systems, with new failure modes. However, these new systems reduce the normal modes of wear and tear and eliminate some of the most complex and failure prone parts

Many hybrids don't have a conventional transmission, merely a couple gears hooking the motors and engine together (much, much more reliable since there's no clutching, no shifting under load, and far less heating.

The alternator and starter motor are two of the most common failure points - also eliminated.

As he noted above, using a 50kW permanent magnet motor to start the engine is much more certain than using a 1 kW 12V motor in the cold - and most hybrids spin the engine all the way to idle, wait for oil pressure, and then start fuel injection/combustion - which eliminates the 80% of engine wear that comes from the initial start up before oil lubrication is there.

Regenerative braking means longer life for the brakes, too.

I'll not argue your point about savings - certainly hybrids are an improvement, but usually not a huge one, and EVs have major advantages over hybrids.
 
The Toyota Prius is mechanically fairly simple but computationally very complex. In its day it burned about half as much fuel as other cars and got the best pollution rating of any car then available, the EVs of the 90's being then no longer made and only available very rarely and for a lot of money on the used market. It was cutting edge technology and the greenest private automobile you could buy new.

That was then, and this is now. A modern EV uses about half as much energy as a Prius while delivering significantly better performance. The U.S. grid is getting cleaner by the year; in many places you can choose to pay a bit extra for solar or wind power; and depending on your home location and design, in many places you can power your car from your own solar installation.

All that said, EVs still pay a penalty in both cost and convenience for all those batteries, and they are not for everyone. As much as I've loved all three of my EVs, I would advise anybody never to borrow money for a car if you can avoid it, and if you must borrow, then get the most economical car that can meet your needs, which will probably be a 3 to 5 year old economy stinker. (I am very debt-averse. I think that going into debt is a dreadful idea if you can possibly avoid it. I am aware of the arguments on the other side, but I think debt is more likely to bite you in the butt in the end. JMO.)
 
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I won't try and change your mind about most of those opinions - I'm fine agreeing to disagree - except for the comment about hybrids being simpler and more reliable. I think it's the opposite: hybrids by definition have an ICE and all of its complexities and costs, PLUS electric engine and brake regeneration mechanicals as well. So I think of them as more complex, and more things can go wrong.

I got on to Tesla only a little while ago while researching hybrids for a friend. When I saw the compromises, I thought "wow, a pure electric is so much simpler and more elegant." I don't need a car (2013 Suzuki SX4 for winter, 2007 Miata [pictured] for summer), but I was so convinced in the logic and beauty of Elon's (and co) design that I put my deposit down there and then. I've been obsessed ever since.

It's great you have a hybrid but accept that you're still polluting almost as much. Do you know the RAV4 Hybrid uses only about 10%-20% less fuel than the gas model? I'm sure all the RAV4 drivers are patting themselves on the back because "I'm driving a hybrid!", but it's barely helping.

Again, I respect your priority of extending your assets and not getting into debt - I won't tell you what should be important to you - but I don't agree a hybrid is a simpler design than an EV.

We don't have to agree but if you read my post carefully, I said I would like to have a BEV for my next purchase (I probably didn't explain why but it's because they're less complex and there is significant travel cost savings (electricity vs. gasoline)) but if BEVs are going to be too steep in price and limited in features, then I am okay going with a hybrid.

And I'm speaking of Toyota hybrids. I don't care about polluting the air with ICEV. If I show empathy to people of all walks of life, I think I've done more than my fair share.

For people who don't want to leave carbon foot print, they can do much more than just drive a BEV. Just look at SCN station hoggers just because they have lifetime charging , they don't get any of my respect.

Someone who's nice overall and drives a BEV is best. But someone who drives a BEV doesn't necessarily mean he/she is nice and respectful to people, which to me is much more important.

Toyota Hybrid FAQs | Reliability, Charging & Warranty Info for Durham, Chapel Hill, Raleigh & Apex NC Hybrid Drivers

Toyota did mention BEVs in early 2020's. I'm not cancelling my reservation and waiting if the car makers are taking out of the a$$es when they talk about selling BEVs in significant numbers. I don't even care if they cost a little bit more than ICEV if they are going to be much more reliable.
 
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