Tesla promised to deliver the model 3 at $35K before tax rebate with early 2017 expected availability. People bought in, but Tesla didn’t honor their promise. And for that, you have every right to be upset. I too am upset about parking a grand interest free at Tesla. But I try to cut them some slack. They’re really struggling to deliver a tremendous car while still staying afloat.
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Cancelled my order today...
- Thread starter AviP
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Tesla did not promise the $35k version before the tax credit expired. That was the hope of many people, but Tesla did not called it a $25,000 car. They always referred to it as a $35k car.
Why don't you just buy an MR and resell it, then buy an SR?
Prices For New Tesla Model 3 & Other Popular EVs Lower Than Used Prices | CleanTechnica %
Prices For New Tesla Model 3 & Other Popular EVs Lower Than Used Prices | CleanTechnica %
Subaru makes good cars that keep their value as well. I'm sure it will last another six to nine months before the SR M3 comes out. Hope the line isn't too long by then. Would hate to see a post about that after you gave your spot in line. Hope that grand helped out in the interim!
Glamisduner
Active Member
I don't see a tesla replacing my truck anytime soon. And as much as people hate on older diesels, I don't see a charging solution for trucks hauling large trailers coming anytime soon. It's bad enough having to stop for gas every 400 miles and maneuvering the trailer into some of these petrol car stations that do not have the pumps lined up in a way such that you can get gas and pull out without making impossibly sharp turns. There is a shortage of easily accessible stations even for gas cars.
Replacing the F150 light truck world will happen faster and be more practical though. Electric motors might be even better for hauling things than going fast!
I think SR AWD non premium will be the last option as well if that ever even becomes a thing.
Glamisduner
Active Member
Commercial charging won't be available to the public IMO. We will see though, maybe I'm wrong. I think a reasonable replacement for the 2500 and 350's will be a long time out though.
Semi's and Light trucks 1500/150's and smaller will make a larger impact on clean transportation anyways.
I'm surprised no one has said it... Tesla (and the world) had no idea how many units would be ordered on that day in 2016. I was amazed, 600 people I counted in line that didn't seem to quit.
In response to this amazing demand, Tesla needed to plan for much larger production capacity and pulled in the timeline which cost them big bucks that they could not have anticipated.
Now factor in the FUD as the bears tried very hard to BK Tesla... they basically had no choice to sell high revenue first. It was a matter of life or death. Had the orders been as expected, you'd have your 35K car by now IMO. In the meantime, Tesla made the power play of the century and changed the world forever since everyone else followed (or at least they're trying).
As a consequence, some people were disappointed but that's just selfish talking. They didn't put the customer first because they put the planet first, wise choice.
Eventually you'll realize how sick that sounded. We were all sick (as in sick-sick, brain-washed sick). Reminding you of this...
Elon Musk on Twitter
Elon at the unveil said the price is $35K. A few months later, dates went up at Model 3 Reservations FAQ from end of July 2017.
Given the timeframe Elon gave during the unveil and the above, the full $7500 tax credit was still in effect and Tesla hadn't hit the 200K qualifying vehicles to begin to trigger phaseout. And, at the time, many folks would still be eligible for the $2500 CVRP (not Elon's fault that later CA imposed a bunch of limits including income limits).
So, if people believed what Elon said, what Tesla published and the CVRP status at the time, it wasn't too far fetched to imagine that they could get a $35K Model 3, since he said that was the price and be eligible for both of the above, taking the car down to $25K before tax and fees.
The credit doesn’t phase out at some time period. It phases out at number of cars sold. Tesla failed to ramp up as quickly as they planned to, but if they had met their original timeline, the phase out would have simply started sooner.
On the first part, yes. But given when Elon said the 3 would be available and the Nov 2017 I already cited, given how the phaseout works (see bottom of Federal Tax Credits for Electric and Plug-in Hybrid Cars), it seems not that unlikely that a 3 SR in Q4 2017 or Q1 2018 should've been eligible for the full $7500, possibly even Q2 2018. At this point, given Electric Vehicle Incentives, if the $35K 3 ever arrives, it'll probably be a $3750 tax credit or less.
If Tesla had produced and sold the 35k version first, they would not be alive today. There's no if's and but's about it, no shades of gray. Tesla/Elon did what they had to do, and everything they had done leading up to this point, they couldn't have done it any other way. They had to sell the more expensive versions in order to make enough money to stay alive in this harsh auto business. There was simply on way for them to ramp up with the cheap 35k version.
So please, give them some credit. Yes it's taken some time, but they're finally here. The production hell is over, they're making good money, there's good demand for all their models. The introduction of Mid-Range is proof of it. It means Standard Range is coming next. Sorry you couldn't wait any longer, but you are the one that's missing out. This iphone on wheels is worth the money and wait. Giving up when it's finally here and right around the corner just seems silly. But hey, it's your choice.
So please, give them some credit. Yes it's taken some time, but they're finally here. The production hell is over, they're making good money, there's good demand for all their models. The introduction of Mid-Range is proof of it. It means Standard Range is coming next. Sorry you couldn't wait any longer, but you are the one that's missing out. This iphone on wheels is worth the money and wait. Giving up when it's finally here and right around the corner just seems silly. But hey, it's your choice.
Then as others have already said in other threads, Elon and Tesla shouldn't have made those claims and listed those projected dates right on their web site.
Tesla's all about hype. Perhaps the only reason to confirm the $35K price was for hype and media buzz. If he started off saying the 3's starting price is $49K, that would've been a lot more honest. And, if he were actually ready with a $35K car w/a more definitive and achievable timeframe, he could announce it then. The "$35K" 3 is going to be more than a year late, if it ever arrives.
Hindsight is always 20/20. They've repeatedly stated they made mistakes with production and ramp up. This is their first mass production car and they were not shy of admitting mistakes. But if say production didn't have any issues, then their timeline wouldn't have been far off. So were they optimistic? Sure. But did they bump into production & ramp up issues that slowed them down? Definitely.
Just a reminder no other automakers have done what Tesla has achieved so far with this Model 3 volume production. Their ramp up, once solving production issues, have been incredible. In this country where we're owned by big oil lobbyists, Tesla can't even setup dealerships in 16 States. So people can dwell on what he said this and that 2 years ago. But reality is, Model 3 is now a top selling Sedan, it owns the EV market, Mid-Range just became available, and Standard Range will become available very soon. You want to pull out now, I still say you're the one that's missing out.
Well you will need to join the back of some other line - none of the competition can produce sufficient EVs comparable to any Tesla product. I’m waiting for RHD but I’ll happily wait until 2020 for it.
Lasairfion
Member
I think the OP has a fair point. But at the end of the day, I do also agree that a lot of the circumstances leading to Tesla making the SR vehicles last has been out of their hands, forcing them to sell higher margin cars for much longer (and demand is there after all). As a company they've made the smarter choice, even if it leaves some original customers disappointed.
The AWD SR is very likely to be last. I can understand not wanting to wait with your money in someone else's bank account. By the time that car comes out it'll likely only be a short wait before delivery anyway.
So get your money back, keep your current car, and when the AWD SR finally comes out, go buy one.
Also as an aside, a lot of people were ordering on the expectation of a $25k car even if Tesla hadn't specifically said it. Why wouldn't someone who can only afford a Toyota Camry not want to be a part of the future too?
NOTE: There are a couple of bills before the senate currently. One that basically says "extend the rebate for a long time" and another that says "end the rebate immediately and tax EVs". These two extremes are unlikely to ever really gain traction.
However, there is a NEW bill introduced now by Senator Dean Heller of Nevada which is a great compromise. It would scrap the 200,000 car cap on manufacturers, but introduce an end to the rebate completely by 2022.
That way manufacturers are incentivised to produce more cars, US manufacturers near or at the cap like Tesla and GM would be competitively priced against foreign produced EVs that still have the rebate, and an end date on the programme would make it affordable for the government and incentivise people to buy an EV now rather than keep waiting into the long and distant future.
So go and write to your local representation in support that bill.
The AWD SR is very likely to be last. I can understand not wanting to wait with your money in someone else's bank account. By the time that car comes out it'll likely only be a short wait before delivery anyway.
So get your money back, keep your current car, and when the AWD SR finally comes out, go buy one.
Also as an aside, a lot of people were ordering on the expectation of a $25k car even if Tesla hadn't specifically said it. Why wouldn't someone who can only afford a Toyota Camry not want to be a part of the future too?
NOTE: There are a couple of bills before the senate currently. One that basically says "extend the rebate for a long time" and another that says "end the rebate immediately and tax EVs". These two extremes are unlikely to ever really gain traction.
However, there is a NEW bill introduced now by Senator Dean Heller of Nevada which is a great compromise. It would scrap the 200,000 car cap on manufacturers, but introduce an end to the rebate completely by 2022.
That way manufacturers are incentivised to produce more cars, US manufacturers near or at the cap like Tesla and GM would be competitively priced against foreign produced EVs that still have the rebate, and an end date on the programme would make it affordable for the government and incentivise people to buy an EV now rather than keep waiting into the long and distant future.
So go and write to your local representation in support that bill.
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Your wishful misinterpretation of what was said does not constitute a "promise" on Tesla's part.
Again, at no point was promise made, they said they planned to do something, those plans changed. Now if they had actually come out and said they guaranteed that there would be $35K versions that would get the tax credit then you might have an argument. As it is though, people can be as upset as they want to be but no one owes anyone anything.
I agree most buying the SR non PUP models will not buy unneeded software.
Tesla will have to produce those models very soon as the demand for the expensive models fall and production levels increase.
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