car and driver P90D 11.1 @ 121 MPH

[sorka]

1. Tesla and ICE quarter miles times simply cannot be compared with respect to horsepower. You don't need nearly this much power to achieve even lower quarter mile times if you have an ideal transmission, which is nearly what you're getting in the Tesla.
2. The corvette does not "have 644 hp" at altitude. It only has 644 hp at SAE standard temp/pressure/humidity.

Still waiting to see what MT did. They usually publish a sheet with all their numbers and correction factors, I've seen it before for other cars.

- - - Updated - - -



Because the tires suck.

Yes, and no. You can still compare exit speeds with eventual maximum held horsepower, but the Tesla puts out more power under the curve (and hence more torque at each RPM at that point as well) than a typical ICE at lower RPMs so the Tesla gets the hole-shot advantage. Once the ICE is up to it's maximum horsepower and is straddling that with it's 8 speed multi speed transmission keeping the power at near peak (which again puts out maximum torque at the wheels for each RPM) they become more compatible. At that point, the 532 L (at > 90%) accelerates just as hard hp / lb as any ICE with a slight advantage going to the Tesla because the ICE can't hold peak power. The ICE that makes 550 hp peak is only making 525 (example) average peak between the shift points......except that the ICE has more drivetrain losses in 1st than 4th so less of the 525 peak average makes it to the wheels.

So you can compare them, as long as you compare there differences. The EV has an ultra wide power band which allows it to put down more power at early RPMs compared to an ICE and hence more torque.

The EV doesn't lose power at altitude. But loses power on cold mornings unless your battery is warm.
The EV loses power as the battery SOC goes down if it was already maxing out current at maximum charge (p85D(L)(90D)(L) variants.

Each has their strengths and weakness. I will say that all things roughly equal a 500 hp AWD EV car is faster in all respects to a 500 hp AWD ICE as it makes wider power and more of the power it does make at any RPM is sent to the wheels.

 

[AWDtsla]

maybe, but neither were spinning at the track... anyone who thinks they will be quicker/faster with 19"s will be disappointed....

Because the car will limit torque output before any visible or audible spinning of the tires.

 

[fiksegts]

negative at the drag strip, very sticky no spinning at all.... or let's see the proof otherwise??

Because the car will limit torque output before any visible or audible spinning of the tires.

 

[AWDtsla]

negative at the drag strip, very sticky no spinning at all.... or let's see the proof otherwise??

Pretty easy to demonstrate. Put on crappy tires, test 0-60. No complaining from the tires, no traction control lights. Turn on slip start, not only do we hear complaining from the tires but the car is faster, even with slip-start auto-disabling itself. So how much limiting is there on good tires? Who knows. But the behavior exists where it limits without any indication from the tires or the dash. I think wk057 should try some runs with TcEspOff.

Tesla Model S P90DL 0-60 100% SoC - YouTube

 

[Vince Cobelo]

I was at StreetDrags in Palm Beach Florida yesterday. About half dozen MS were racing and they were so consistent on time it was almost boring. Some ran a little worse time because they had just got the Launch mode but overall P85/90DLs ran consistently mid 11's in the 1/4 mile. Don't remember specific speeds or times but 115 mph sounds about right. They were up against nothing but modified cars from Lambos to GT R. One of the GT Rs did a 7.96 so they didn't win many races except against the vettes.

 

[fiksegts]

we had a P90DL with 19"s and a P90DL with 21"s and a P85D with 19"s and a P85D with 21"s at the track all day.... 19"s were not quicker....

Pretty easy to demonstrate. Put on crappy tires, test 0-60. No complaining from the tires, no traction control lights. Turn on slip start, not only do we hear complaining from the tires but the car is faster, even with slip-start auto-disabling itself. So how much limiting is there on good tires? Who knows. But the behavior exists where it limits without any indication from the tires or the dash. I think wk057 should try some runs with TcEspOff.

Tesla Model S P90DL 0-60 100% SoC - YouTube

 

[bhzmark]

What were the tires on the different wheels? That likely makes more of a difference than the wheel weight. A/s tires on lighter wheels may be slower than stickier summers on the heavier 21 oem wheels.

 

[What_Was_That?]

Street Car Drags January 31, 2016. Time slips from our 2015 P85D with 19" tesla wheels, 12,500 miles on the tires, dual chargers, pano, next generation, not using launch, power cords, purse, lots of jackets and iPads and a scared old lady at the wheel for 2 of the three runs. 116.93 mph 11.653 seconds. What an experience.

 

[fiksegts]

great times! are you upgrading the car to Ludicrous?

Street Car Drags January 31, 2016. Time slips from our 2015 P85D with 19" tesla wheels, 12,500 miles on the tires, dual chargers, pano, next generation, not using launch, power cords, purse, lots of jackets and iPads and a scared old lady at the wheel for 2 of the three runs. 116.93 mph 11.653 seconds. What an experience.

 

[What_Was_That?]

great times! are you upgrading the car to Ludicrous?

We ordered ours after the P90D Ludicrous was offered as a $13k upgrade. So ours is not elgible for the upgrade. Darn. Hope to see the times on your X P90DL soon.

 

[lolachampcar]

Take a close look at the raw data (front and rear motor torque) and I think you will find there is some room for more traction. This is my car with 10 lb lighter rims and Pilot Super Sports. I tried for some data last weekend at the drags but it did not happen.......

Cross posted from another thread-
I've been curious about exactly what Launch Mode does and wanted to verify Fiks' work (where he showed it did nothing for times).

The following are a bunch of back to back 0-60 runs with battery heat enabled using both Launch Mode and Fast Foot Mode

I found it interesting that the power at first wheel movement for some of the runs was near double for the Fast Foot method.

Here is a quick summary-
SoC 072.6 BatT 36.74 BatOdo 015487 same as run below as data ran together
1329.26 Launch Mode
1325.40
3.86

SoC 072.6 BatT 36.74 BatOdo 015487
1342.38 Fast Foot Mode
1338.99
3.39

SoC 072.0 BatT 37.96 BatOdo 015487
1381.37 Fast Foot Mode
1377.94
3.44

SoC 071.6 BatT 38.76 BatOdo 015487
1422.93 Launch Mode
1419.41
3.52

SoC 071.3 BatT 39.42 BatOdo 015487
1459.88 Fast Foot Mode
1456.75
plus .44 seconds for having to lift early (from other data sets)
3.57

SoC 070.9 BatT 40.21 BatOdo 015487
1487.47 Fast Foot Mode
1483.88
3.59

SoC 070.5 BatT 41.01 BatOdo 015488
1521.12 Launch Mode
1516.61
4.51 Suspect motor was getting hot

Supporting Data
Time......TPS....Speed.....R_Tq....F_Tq....BatV.....BatI......Pwr Speed MPH Torque in ft-lbs Current in amps and Power in KW
1325.36 100.0 +000.00 +338.5 +174.0 366.33 -0108.0 039.5
1325.37 100.0 +000.00 +338.9 +173.1 365.95 -0109.0 039.8
1325.38 100.0 +000.00 +345.3 +172.4 365.70 -0109.7 040.1
1325.39 100.0 +000.00 +349.2 +172.0 366.07 -0109.1 039.9
1325.40 100.0 +000.20 +349.9 +171.8 366.21 -0107.2 039.2
1325.41 100.0 +000.40 +349.2 +165.7 365.95 -0106.3 038.9
1329.24 100.0 +059.85 +199.3 +113.2 288.41 -1304.1 376.1
1329.25 100.0 +059.95 +199.1 +113.2 287.03 -1308.1 375.4
1329.26 100.0 +060.05 +199.6 +113.0 286.14 -1302.7 372.7
1329.27 100.0 +060.15 +199.3 +112.8 288.65 -1298.6 374.8
SoC 072.6 BatT 36.74 BatOdo 015487 same as run below as
data ran together
1329.26 Launch Mode
1325.40
3.86




1338.97 100.0 +000.00 +385.0 +232.3 356.76 -0228.6 081.5
1338.98 100.0 +000.00 +395.8 +235.2 356.39 -0236.2 084.1
1338.99 100.0 +000.25 +405.2 +235.0 355.49 -0242.4 086.1
1339.00 100.0 +000.60 +415.0 +235.2 355.23 -0249.9 088.7
1339.01 100.0 +000.90 +423.7 +235.6 354.48 -0264.3 093.6
1339.02 100.0 +001.20 +429.6 +235.6 353.47 -0278.0 098.2
1342.35 100.0 +059.65 +198.9 +112.2 287.90 -1290.9 371.6
1342.36 100.0 +059.75 +197.8 +112.1 287.52 -1293.8 371.9
1342.37 100.0 +059.90 +198.0 +112.1 286.02 -1294.4 370.2
1342.38 100.0 +060.00 +197.8 +112.2 287.16 -1293.1 371.3
1342.39 100.0 +060.10 +199.1 +112.2 287.28 -1301.5 373.8
1342.40 100.0 +060.20 +199.8 +112.4 286.40 -1295.3 370.9
1342.41 100.0 +060.30 +199.8 +112.4 286.64 -1287.4 369.0
1342.42 100.0 +060.40 +199.3 +112.2 287.64 -1290.7 371.2
1342.43 100.0 +060.50 +199.1 +112.1 286.77 -1278.6 366.6
SoC 072.6 BatT 36.74 BatOdo 015487
1342.38 Fast Foot Mode
1338.99
3.39




1377.92 100.0 +000.00 +368.2 +205.4 357.65 -0221.0 079.0
1377.93 100.0 +000.00 +383.9 +212.6 356.89 -0232.4 082.9
1377.94 100.0 +000.30 +396.8 +217.5 356.27 -0242.7 086.4
1377.95 100.0 +000.60 +409.1 +220.5 355.64 -0254.2 090.4
1377.96 100.0 +000.90 +421.3 +222.9 355.15 -0265.4 094.2
1377.97 100.0 +001.20 +430.5 +225.1 354.78 -0276.6 098.1
1381.34 100.0 +059.75 +172.5 +149.7 291.56 -1243.2 362.4
1381.35 100.0 +059.85 +171.4 +149.5 291.44 -1237.7 360.7
1381.36 100.0 +059.95 +171.1 +148.9 290.80 -1243.0 361.4
1381.37 100.0 +060.05 +170.3 +148.4 291.32 -1233.8 359.4
1381.38 100.0 +060.15 +170.3 +148.4 291.69 -1238.2 361.1
1381.39 100.0 +060.25 +170.1 +148.6 291.55 -1233.6 359.6
SoC 072.0 BatT 37.96 BatOdo 015487
1381.37 Fast Foot Mode
1377.94
3.44




1419.37 100.0 +000.00 +397.9 +225.3 359.11 -0183.0 065.7
1419.38 100.0 +000.00 +401.9 +229.9 359.36 -0177.3 063.7
1419.39 100.0 +000.00 +406.2 +232.1 358.75 -0183.4 065.7
1419.40 100.0 +000.00 +411.0 +231.0 357.99 -0197.8 070.8
1419.41 100.0 +000.25 +415.9 +230.1 356.86 -0216.8 077.3
1419.42 100.0 +000.45 +419.8 +231.4 355.85 -0239.8 085.3
1419.43 100.0 +000.70 +418.9 +232.5 355.48 -0252.0 089.5
1419.44 100.0 +000.90 +411.1 +231.2 355.63 -0247.2 087.9
1419.45 100.0 +001.15 +406.3 +227.3 355.63 -0243.2 086.4
1419.46 100.0 +001.35 +405.2 +225.3 355.51 -0245.4 087.2
1422.89 100.0 +059.65 +194.7 +103.9 293.58 -1203.4 353.2
1422.90 100.0 +059.75 +193.6 +103.9 294.59 -1193.9 351.7
1422.91 100.0 +059.85 +193.2 +103.9 295.84 -1193.5 353.0
1422.92 100.0 +059.95 +193.9 +103.8 295.08 -1189.4 350.9
1422.93 100.0 +060.05 +193.9 +103.4 294.95 -1188.1 350.4
1422.94 100.0 +060.15 +193.2 +103.4 295.09 -1185.6 349.8
1422.95 100.0 +060.25 +192.5 +103.0 294.44 -1190.7 350.5
1422.96 100.0 +060.35 +191.7 +102.8 294.32 -1185.8 349.0
SoC 071.6 BatT 38.76 BatOdo 015487
1422.93 Launch Mode
1419.41
3.52






1456.73 100.0 +000.00 +145.4 +131.2 363.32 -0106.8 038.8
1456.74 100.0 +000.00 +173.8 +143.8 361.56 -0133.5 048.2
1456.75 100.0 +000.15 +226.6 +162.2 360.57 -0160.2 057.7
1456.76 100.0 +000.30 +271.7 +180.7 359.92 -0177.6 063.9
1456.77 100.0 +000.40 +299.6 +195.2 359.30 -0187.7 067.4
1456.78 100.0 +000.55 +317.1 +206.5 358.67 -0199.4 071.5
1459.82 100.0 +054.25 +189.9 +144.5 297.59 -1167.9 347.5
1459.83 100.0 +054.35 +189.1 +144.5 297.71 -1165.6 347.0
1459.84 100.0 +054.45 +188.8 +144.5 297.72 -1165.4 346.9
1459.85 099.6 +054.55 +188.4 +144.7 297.61 -1168.5 347.7
1459.86 093.2 +054.65 +188.0 +144.9 297.60 -1165.8 346.9
1459.87 086.4 +054.80 +187.1 +145.1 297.23 -1173.7 348.8
1459.88 080.4 +054.90 +186.9 +145.1 297.47 -1169.0 347.7
SoC 071.3 BatT 39.42 BatOdo 015487
1459.88 Fast Foot Mode
1456.75
plus .44 seconds for having to lift early (from other data sets)
3.57


1483.85 100.0 +000.00 +343.3 +222.1 356.80 -0225.7 080.5
1483.86 100.0 +000.00 +362.3 +228.8 356.17 -0236.1 084.0
1483.87 100.0 +000.00 +377.4 +232.8 355.79 -0244.0 086.8
1483.88 100.0 +000.25 +392.9 +233.2 354.92 -0256.1 090.8
1483.90 100.0 +000.90 +407.3 +235.6 354.27 -0268.5 095.1
1483.91 100.0 +001.20 +419.3 +235.8 353.88 -0276.9 097.9
1483.92 100.0 +001.40 +428.1 +234.1 353.38 -0285.2 100.7
1483.93 100.0 +001.65 +433.8 +232.8 353.00 -0294.0 103.7
1483.94 100.0 +001.85 +437.9 +230.3 352.87 -0297.1 104.8
1487.41 100.0 +059.50 +164.8 +140.1 300.26 -1115.6 334.9
1487.42 100.0 +059.60 +164.4 +140.1 300.38 -1117.6 335.7
1487.43 100.0 +059.70 +163.7 +140.1 300.26 -1118.2 335.7
1487.44 100.0 +059.80 +163.0 +140.3 300.38 -1116.7 335.4
1487.46 100.0 +060.00 +162.8 +140.5 299.38 -1121.2 335.6
1487.47 100.0 +060.05 +162.2 +140.6 300.37 -1117.8 335.7
1487.48 100.0 +060.15 +161.7 +140.6 299.60 -1122.3 336.2
1487.49 100.0 +060.25 +161.1 +140.6 300.99 -1115.5 335.7
1487.50 100.0 +060.35 +161.1 +140.8 299.48 -1122.0 336.0
1487.51 100.0 +060.45 +160.4 +140.6 300.75 -1115.1 335.3
SoC 070.9 BatT 40.21 BatOdo 015487
1487.47 Fast Foot Mode
1483.88
3.59


1516.57 100.0 +000.00 +362.1 +172.2 362.80 -0117.0 042.4
1516.58 100.0 +000.00 +363.2 +170.9 362.93 -0114.7 041.6
1516.59 100.0 +000.00 +364.7 +170.3 362.53 -0114.1 041.3
1516.60 100.0 +000.00 +365.2 +169.6 362.67 -0114.5 041.5
1516.61 100.0 +000.20 +363.4 +170.3 362.54 -0116.2 042.1
1516.62 100.0 +000.40 +350.8 +169.6 362.43 -0118.1 042.8
1516.63 100.0 +000.50 +343.8 +168.9 362.55 -0118.5 042.9
1516.64 100.0 +000.65 +349.2 +170.1 362.68 -0118.7 043.0
1516.65 100.0 +000.75 +347.0 +173.1 362.68 -0118.0 042.7
1516.66 100.0 +000.85 +354.3 +174.2 362.54 -0117.9 042.7
1516.67 100.0 +000.90 +350.3 +170.9 362.56 -0118.6 042.9
1516.68 100.0 +000.95 +354.9 +169.8 362.79 -0119.3 043.2
1516.69 100.0 +001.00 +353.4 +171.6 362.43 -0118.1 042.8
1516.70 100.0 +001.05 +358.8 +173.1 362.67 -0115.7 041.9
1516.71 100.0 +001.10 +357.9 +173.5 362.67 -0114.8 041.6
1521.07 100.0 +059.55 +185.6 +095.6 303.10 -1071.9 324.8
1521.08 100.0 +059.60 +185.3 +095.6 302.98 -1068.7 323.7
1521.09 100.0 +059.70 +184.2 +095.6 303.98 -1075.7 326.9
1521.10 100.0 +059.80 +184.0 +095.6 303.22 -1072.6 325.2
1521.11 100.0 +059.90 +183.2 +095.5 303.47 -1074.0 325.9
1521.12 100.0 +060.00 +182.5 +095.3 303.10 -1073.4 325.3
1521.13 100.0 +060.10 +182.3 +095.1 302.23 -1074.7 324.8
1521.14 100.0 +060.15 +181.2 +095.1 303.23 -1073.9 325.6
1521.15 100.0 +060.25 +181.0 +094.9 303.23 -1072.1 325.0
1521.16 100.0 +060.35 +181.2 +094.7 303.61 -1078.0 327.2
1521.17 100.0 +060.45 +181.0 +094.7 303.60 -1070.6 325.0
1521.18 100.0 +060.55 +180.8 +094.7 303.36 -1079.2 327.3
1521.19 100.0 +060.65 +181.0 +094.7 302.72 -1071.0 324.2
1521.20 100.0 +060.70 +181.2 +094.5 303.73 -1068.6 324.5
SoC 070.5 BatT 41.01 BatOdo 015488
1521.12 Launch Mode
1516.61
4.51 Suspect motor was getting hot

Raw Data
Dropbox - Multiple0_60RawData.TXT

- - - Updated - - -

Just looked at the raw data for my P85D and this is about the best I saw for torque
1326.37 100.0 +013.40 +430.5 +228.4 331.89 -0676.9 224.6 or a total of 650 ft-lbs. Sure would have been nice to get some P90DL data to see if it makes the high 700s that C&D saw. Any P90DLs local in WPB?

 

[sorka]

We ordered ours after the P90D Ludicrous was offered as a $13k upgrade. So ours is not elgible for the upgrade. Darn. Hope to see the times on your X P90DL soon.

You could always place an order and see if they accept it.

 

[fiksegts]

I was looking for you when I made my first pass at 11am so we could data log....

Sure would have been nice to get some P90DL data to see if it makes the high 700s that C&D saw. Any P90DLs local in WPB?

 

[AWDtsla]

Take a close look at the raw data (front and rear motor torque) and I think you will find there is some room for more traction. This is my car with 10 lb lighter rims and Pilot Super Sports. I tried for some data last weekend at the drags but it did not happen.......

Cross posted from another thread-
I've been curious about exactly what Launch Mode does and wanted to verify Fiks' work (where he showed it did nothing for times).

...

Just looked at the raw data for my P85D and this is about the best I saw for torque
1326.37 100.0 +013.40 +430.5 +228.4 331.89 -0676.9 224.6 or a total of 650 ft-lbs. Sure would have been nice to get some P90DL data to see if it makes the high 700s that C&D saw. Any P90DLs local in WPB?

Launch mode does nothing for me either. Seems like a dumb feature for people that have creep mode on, like probably many magazine testers.

I am not close enough. How much was the investment in your CAN hardware?

 

[sorka]

Another one posted today vs a GTR:

An 11.27. Not even close to 10.9. Still an impressive show against the GTR.

 

[rowdy]

Another one posted today vs a GTR:

An 11.27. Not even close to 10.9. Still an impressive show against the GTR.

Great vid. A stock 2013 GT-R has pretty much identical specs to what the P90DL is meant to. 0-60 of 2.7sec and 1/4 mile 10.9. The traction is there on the Tesla. Maybe a future update will increase the amps that can be drawn and finally deliver the 10.9...

 

[sorka]

Great vid. A stock 2013 GT-R has pretty much identical specs to what the P90DL is meant to. 0-60 of 2.7sec and 1/4 mile 10.9. The traction is there on the Tesla. Maybe a future update will increase the amps that can be drawn and finally deliver the 10.9...

Possibly with slicks and an update to allow more power below 30 MPH, but above that, the smart fuse is already maxed out at 1500 amps.

 

[Andyw2100]

Maybe a future update will increase the amps that can be drawn and finally deliver the 10.9...

Maybe.

But what about the people who paid to have it months ago?

 

[rowdy]

But what about the people who paid to have it months ago?

Well I guess it's like autopilot all over again. It does look like the car is capable, just the battery is falling short of delivering enough power (due to amp limit)

Is the smart fuse programmable? I know it's digital, but wondering if it's on one of the buses

 

[Andyw2100]

Well I guess it's like autopilot all over again. It does look like the car is capable, just the battery is falling short of delivering enough power (due to amp limit)

Is the smart fuse programmable? I know it's digital, but wondering if it's on one of the buses

I don't own one of those cars, so I have no skin in this particular game, but I'd say in some ways this is worse. At least with the autopilot issue Tesla was promising to eventually deliver. Tesla has not said a word about why the car is not meeting the advertised spec, and if it is ever going to.