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Yeah, there's a lot in there... however the unit's feature set is pretty significant:
- 10KW of charging in a compact package
- Mulitiple input voltage support
- Variable output voltage/current support
- Smart communication capability with EVSE's
- Smart communication with Superchargers
- Liquid cooled
- Thermal monitoring
- Capability to coordinate charging with second unit in master/slave configuration
- Integrated with car display/control systems via CAN bus
- Integrated with Battery Management System (BMS)
I think the biggest challenge in attempting to repair it is that, without the proper digital control capability (i.e. replicating the car's CAN bus messaging to it), the unit won't do anything sitting on a bench even with power applied.
- 10KW of charging in a compact package
- Mulitiple input voltage support
- Variable output voltage/current support
- Smart communication capability with EVSE's
- Smart communication with Superchargers
- Liquid cooled
- Thermal monitoring
- Capability to coordinate charging with second unit in master/slave configuration
- Integrated with car display/control systems via CAN bus
- Integrated with Battery Management System (BMS)
I think the biggest challenge in attempting to repair it is that, without the proper digital control capability (i.e. replicating the car's CAN bus messaging to it), the unit won't do anything sitting on a bench even with power applied.
Well this is not good. My car exhibited the "unable to charge" behavior again last night/this morning. Red-ring and similar attempts to ramp up current 3 times and then give up.
It eventually worked after a couple of tries.
I am not happy.
It eventually worked after a couple of tries.
I am not happy.
Electric700
Active Member
I got the red indicator but was able to successfully charge after cleaning the electrical contacts on the car. You could try using compressed air first and then if you still have trouble, perhaps use a soft brush for both your car's port and your wall connector (or UMC).
There's also a chance that there could be something wrong with your wall connector/UMC or a component in the car. How's your power? Do you have a whole house surge protector (something like this: Leviton 120/240-Volt Residential Whole House Surge Protector-R01-51110-SRG - The Home Depot )?
There's also a chance that there could be something wrong with your wall connector/UMC or a component in the car. How's your power? Do you have a whole house surge protector (something like this: Leviton 120/240-Volt Residential Whole House Surge Protector-R01-51110-SRG - The Home Depot )?
I cleaned the contacts recently. The behavior I get when they are dirty tends to be a flaky pilot signal/ground and the car does a lock/unlock cycle a couple of times when I insert the cable. I also tend to get the current throttling back to 30A.
This is the same power circuit the car has been on for 3 yrs. Input voltage is right around 244V and sags down to 236 or so @40A. When the first charger failed I tried the UMC as well, to no avail, so it was the charger that was dead at that point, not the HPWC. The logs Tesla pulled also confirmed that.
While I suppose it's possible that a UMC could kill a charger, I can't think of what could do that other then a circuit over-voltage, which would have meant my whole panel was fed high voltage, which I suspect would have manifested it myself a number of places elsewhere in my house.
The only other thing I could think of is some sort of internal fault in the HPWC that supplied overvoltage to the pilot signal pin, thus frying the HPWC on the car charger. That also would seem unlikely, as the failure mode of the car's charger didn't include not recognizing the pilot signal current reading... it did indeed indicate the charger was plugged in and capable of delivering 40A.
This is the same power circuit the car has been on for 3 yrs. Input voltage is right around 244V and sags down to 236 or so @40A. When the first charger failed I tried the UMC as well, to no avail, so it was the charger that was dead at that point, not the HPWC. The logs Tesla pulled also confirmed that.
While I suppose it's possible that a UMC could kill a charger, I can't think of what could do that other then a circuit over-voltage, which would have meant my whole panel was fed high voltage, which I suspect would have manifested it myself a number of places elsewhere in my house.
The only other thing I could think of is some sort of internal fault in the HPWC that supplied overvoltage to the pilot signal pin, thus frying the HPWC on the car charger. That also would seem unlikely, as the failure mode of the car's charger didn't include not recognizing the pilot signal current reading... it did indeed indicate the charger was plugged in and capable of delivering 40A.
Same here as am being billed $2000 to replace a faulty charger unit that failed after 75K miles?? Not fair as should be under the battery or drive train warranty same 125K or eight years. Why is it excluded ??
Canuck
Well-Known Member
I wonder if you charged at 44 amps with a HPWC, meaning 22 amps each charger, if the charger would have failed? My theory is that these take a lot of abuse at 40 amps daily such that they need cooling so I split my daily charge over both hoping to avoid such a failure.
Who's best on the forum with power analysis and tools to dig into this? We should crowdsource finding the defective component on this charger, find a replacement source for that part... and post a how-to fix your own charger.
Any bets what the most likely part to go defective in what you see there in the photo?
Any bets what the most likely part to go defective in what you see there in the photo?
I was going to ask what your habitual charging habits were at home... but I think this answers it. You seldom charged at more than 40A.
I forget how power spills / splits over 2 chargers... even tho it's been covered many times. This either means each charger was seeing 20A or the primary was seeing 40A, I forget which.
I have dual chargers and habitually charge at 80A at home. So I know I've been maxing my dual chargers out at 40A each. I do most of my charging at home 2 to 3 x per week to get to 80% or 90%, been doing that for more than 1.5 years.
I just went outside and lowered to 64A. I'm hoping this is an even split of 32A over each charger. I think I have just adopted this as my new habit... less heat and stress. And I've noticed my HPWC charger cable has been getting hotter after a bout of charging... even after cleaning the socket and plug contacts.
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Everything up to, and including, 40A goes to the primary charger, once you go beyond 40A it splits evenly between the two chargers. (Obviously this only applies to the pre-refresh cars with dual 40A chargers, not the new single 48/72A charger.)
Maybe because it isn't part of the battery or drive-train. (I assume the drive-train is the just the motor/inverter unit.)
Good timing that this thread got picked by up. I had some travel recently and was occupied, but I never was contacted by Tesla despite specifically asking for a contact in my survey feedback.
I still feel this is something I want to discuss with them. The fact that Breffni seems to have an identical failure is interesting. My Service Adviser told me that in his experience these are extremely rare.
That might seem to indicate we got sub-standard units. For a $2K part so critical to the car to die with only normal usage is concerning. I also wonder if this is a result of having an earlier unit.
@scottm: There's been some discussion of the capacitors in the power supply... those can and do have issues with heat/age in high power applications...
I still feel this is something I want to discuss with them. The fact that Breffni seems to have an identical failure is interesting. My Service Adviser told me that in his experience these are extremely rare.
That might seem to indicate we got sub-standard units. For a $2K part so critical to the car to die with only normal usage is concerning. I also wonder if this is a result of having an earlier unit.
@scottm: There's been some discussion of the capacitors in the power supply... those can and do have issues with heat/age in high power applications...
chipmunk
Member
I have also specifically asked to be contacted in survey feedback as well, and have never been contacted. It's very disappointing.
Sorry for your troubles, but this is kind of discouraging to me. I have until tomorrow to cancel my MS order and get a refund on the $2500 deposit. (I just ordered with the single charger). In hindsight would it have been worth it to get the extended warranty? I believe it is $4000 for 4 yrs/50K miles whichever comes first? Its hard to find details on the tesla site like is there deductible too?
Sorry for your troubles, but this is kind of discouraging to me. I have until tomorrow to cancel my MS order and get a refund on the $2500 deposit. (I just ordered with the single charger). In hindsight would it have been worth it to get the extended warranty? I believe it is $4000 for 4 yrs/50K miles whichever comes first? Its hard to find details on the tesla site like is there deductible too?
Electric700
Active Member
Welcome to the forum Odguy.
The two replacement reports on this thread are the only ones I've seen, and the original ones that were replaced were probably not second generation versions. More here: 2nd Gen Charger.
You can get an Extended Service Agreement according to Tesla's site (Service plans) which will take effect after your original warranty expires. I believe you can order it at any time through a service center after you get the car, up until 30 days before warranty expiration. This is something that I don't have on mine, but will probably be getting soon just in case.
You can also contact Tesla at [email protected].
If you do decide to go forward with your Tesla purchase, then congratulations would be in order! By the time you would need a charger replacement, and I hope that you never do need one, Tesla may be offering unit repairs, or it could be covered under the Extended Service Agreement if you do decide to get one. Remember that other components such as the AC should also be covered by that agreement.
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To add another data point for those following this discussion - my Model S developed the exact same charger problem yesterday (~78,000 miles). Tesla Service Center finished their diagnostics and confirmed that the charger has developed an internal failure. Cost to replace = $1,800, not covered by battery/drive unit warranty.
Electric700
Active Member
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