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CCS Adapter for North America

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Read the forum, technically it is not possible for a simple mechanical lock extension from the car port to the Type1 plug as used in the Type 2 plug necessitating an electromagnetic lock, power, and the logic to drive it, can't be dumb, and it can't be cheap.

I read the forums quite a lot (possibly too much,) and this was the first I've heard of it. But it sounded like there was something specific behind it, so I spent a while digging. I still haven't seen a thread about it, but I think she has a point.

In the EU, both Type 2 and CCS2 connectors expect to be locked to the car via action of the car using a gap in the top of the plug that the car places a pin through. Tesla plugs in the US work similarly, with the car locking both AC and Supercharger plugs to the car using a pin raised up from the bottom.

In the US, J1772 is locked to the car by a latch on the plug at the top that is actuated by a button on the handle mechanically, which also trips the proximity circuit (and the EVSE dumps the contactors when it trips and counts on that being fast enough.) Some cars also have a pin they move to lock the connector, but it's not a requirement and many cars don't have it.

US CCS chargers expects to be able to command a latch in the plug assembly in the same location electrically to lock to the car.

Here's a company brochure that shows and talks about the various connectors and a little about their locking mechanisms:

https://www.mouser.com/pdfdocs/PhoenixContactsolutionsbrochurefore-mobility.pdf

Since we're talking about 400V DC, not having it positively locked to the car would be a serious risk.

I'm not sure this completely prevents a dumb adapter, though. You certainly can't make one that works the way the EU and J1772 adapters work, that you place on the plug and then plug in to the car.

But I think they could build one that you plug in to the car, the car locks it down, and then you plug a CCS1 unit in to that. The CCS unit still commands the electro-mechanical lock to lock on the the car - which locks on to the adapter. The car holds the adapter locked, which prevents any safety risk.

You'd need some sort of special mode controlling locking the adapter in and the chargeport door, and some way of telling it when to lock and unlock, but neither of these seems terribly challenging.
 
Right, so a CCS Type 1 socket assembly with the required lock and the ability to hold the plug and cord will be too bulky and heavy leveraging too much torque on the vehicle's TSL-02 port. That will necessitate a pigtail design like the existing CHAdeMO adapter with an extra foot or two of cable and a Tesla plug with the release soft button in it. Such solution is surely possible, but again, it will not be a "dumb" passive adapter and it will not be cheaper than the CHAdeMO adapter.
 
Simple innovation is indeed possible, just use freaking the superchargers, easier, more reliable, cheaper :)

I would have loved it if Tesla had offered a CCS Type 1 adapter five years ago, would have bought one even though I already had a CHAdeMO one. Could have used it on a few locations that only have CCS type 1 plug.

Disappointed they still haven't.

Fun fact, I bought my CHAdeMO adapter, a second (technically first) mobile connector and all of the NEMA adapters before I even took delivery of my car, in universally accessible charging I do believe.
 
Simple innovation is indeed possible, just use freaking the superchargers, easier, more reliable, cheaper :)
Unfortunately this is highly dependent on where you live, if you're a yank (especially in Cali), sure I agree. As a canuck, Tesla literally just finished a single path that allows Canadians to cross the country in a Tesla without having to cross the border into the USA. And it's only one route in the second largest country in the world. Go check out the supercharger map for Canada and see how complete that network looks to you. If I want to go further north than 500km to the US border, I am pretty much out of luck.

As for cheaper, also depends where you are. In my province there are probably near 100 government owned level 3 chargers that are absolutely free. I'm sure that will eventually change, but it would be nice to have the adapter for now to take advantage of what my tax money helped pay for!
 
My third Supercharger session with my car was last week in Irvine, Calif. I was visiting customers, and was down to 20% SOC. I could make it back to the shop, but it would be close.

So I tell the car to go the nearest SC. It takes me to the inside of a hidden parking structure on Lvl 2. I get there, and there is a line waiting for it. So out of politeness, I turned off my headlights. 75 minutes later (70kW SC) I depart at 50% SOC. I now switch the headlights to AUTO, but now AUTO means "stay on forever". Now I have manually operate the headlights. I may have to have it serviced just to do a full bootstrap reload. Oddly enough the car lacks a power switch or an easy to access battery terminal. Two buttons and brake reboot it, but the AUTO problem is persistent.

Why the long winded tirade? My other EV is CCS, I never spend 75 minutes at DCFC. It charges at ~75 kW average from 10% to 90% which is actually faster than my X at a 140kW. And there was a CCS closer to me than that hidden parking structure. After ~30 DCFC sessions, my other EV has never had to wait for a stall. And it doesn't have dozens minor software bugs in virtually all systems.
 
Read the forum, technically it is not possible for a simple mechanical lock extension from the car port to the Type1 plug as used in the Type 2 plug necessitating an electromagnetic lock, power, and the logic to drive it, can't be dumb, and it can't be cheap.
We've had this discussion earlier in this thread, but I'm not convinced that this is a show stopper:

CCS Adapter for North America
 
Seems that an adapter could have been made simpler if J1772 had gone with a car-side lock instead of the handle-side lock; would have made CCS1 look a lot more slimline. But that's a discussion for another time...

Something to note though is that when Tesla changed the ports to the Chinese standard one, they provided adapters for both AC and DC plugs. Also there is a mechanical lock on the handle in the standard, though there is also a car-side one (but it isn't clear to me if that's always used or not):

新国标充电适配器 | 特斯拉中国 - Tesla
Users manual for the DC adapter (in english): https://www.tesla.cn/sites/default/..._Adapter_Owners_Manual_1103873-00-D_en-CN.pdf

AC adapter (english): https://www.tesla.cn/sites/default/files/downloads/GBAC-adapter-manual-1115367-00-B-English.pdf

(note: this is what I found on Google, there may be different revisions out there)

Picture of GB/T Handle
https://www.mouser.com/new/phoenix-contact/phoenix-contact-gb-t-fast-dc-china/
 
Right, so a CCS Type 1 socket assembly with the required lock and the ability to hold the plug and cord will be too bulky and heavy leveraging too much torque on the vehicle's TSL-02 port. That will necessitate a pigtail design like the existing CHAdeMO adapter with an extra foot or two of cable and a Tesla plug with the release soft button in it. Such solution is surely possible, but again, it will not be a "dumb" passive adapter and it will not be cheaper than the CHAdeMO adapter.
Even in this scenario, where a CCS adapter was the same basic design/price as the CHAdeMO adapter, I'd imagine a ton of people would still buy them. Obviously, something the size/price of the standard J1772 adapter would be preferred (if the engineering/physics/etc would allow for it).

Part of me also wonders if Tesla's avoidance of CCS is to drive/maintain SuperCharger revenue? I.e. if Tesla did make a CCS adapter as convenient as the J1772 adapter, how much SuperCharger business would be lost to competitors (like VW's EA)?
 
Even in this scenario, where a CCS adapter was the same basic design/price as the CHAdeMO adapter, I'd imagine a ton of people would still buy them. Obviously, something the size/price of the standard J1772 adapter would be preferred (if the engineering/physics/etc would allow for it).

Part of me also wonders if Tesla's avoidance of CCS is to drive/maintain SuperCharger revenue? I.e. if Tesla did make a CCS adapter as convenient as the J1772 adapter, how much SuperCharger business would be lost to competitors (like VW's EA)?

I always thought that the superchargers were a way to sell cars, not run a charging business. How many folks would buy a new Tesla knowing that it can be plugged into any charger? Win win.
 
Part of me also wonders if Tesla's avoidance of CCS is to drive/maintain SuperCharger revenue? I.e. if Tesla did make a CCS adapter as convenient as the J1772 adapter, how much SuperCharger business would be lost to competitors (like VW's EA)?

Probably very little as they almost all cost significantly more and have fewer stalls. So if they were significantly cheaper, or more convenient, they would be over crowded.
 
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My third Supercharger session with my car was last week in Irvine, Calif. I was visiting customers, and was down to 20% SOC. I could make it back to the shop, but it would be close.

So I tell the car to go the nearest SC. It takes me to the inside of a hidden parking structure on Lvl 2. I get there, and there is a line waiting for it. So out of politeness, I turned off my headlights. 75 minutes later (70kW SC) I depart at 50% SOC. I now switch the headlights to AUTO, but now AUTO means "stay on forever". Now I have manually operate the headlights. I may have to have it serviced just to do a full bootstrap reload. Oddly enough the car lacks a power switch or an easy to access battery terminal. Two buttons and brake reboot it, but the AUTO problem is persistent.

You can see on the screen how busy each of the nearby Supercharger sites are (# of stalls available vs # of stalls). There are a couple sites fairly near Irvine that have both more stalls and are not Urban (72 kW) style. (E.g., Fountain Valley, Santa Ana) I'd happily drive a couple extra miles to avoid a line.

I tend not to use the Auto highbeam feature. Too many false positives from taillight reflectors on cars parked on the side of the road in my neighborhood. The auto headlight feature in our Volt is the same way. On the highway it actually seems pretty good (in both cases).

Why the long winded tirade? My other EV is CCS, I never spend 75 minutes at DCFC. It charges at ~75 kW average from 10% to 90% which is actually faster than my X at a 140kW. And there was a CCS closer to me than that hidden parking structure. After ~30 DCFC sessions, my other EV has never had to wait for a stall. And it doesn't have dozens minor software bugs in virtually all systems.

To some extent, Teslas Supercharger network is a victim of its own success. I know several of the Supercharger sites around here are almost always maxed out during the day. They keep building more sites, but then they keep selling more cars as well. (Not to mention Silicon Valley real estate prices keep a lot of fairly high income folks in rental properties where they can't charge at home...) Doesn't really bother me because I can charge at home. But on road trips, I've had little problem with congestion. Have taken the last stall a couple times though.

If you really want the flexibility to use non-Tesla fast charging, there is always the CHAdeMO adapter. In fact a few EVgo sites here in the Bay Area and especially in LA are starting to attach CHAdeMO adapters to their charging stations in order to attract some Tesla business.
 
Nobody really knows -- at least, not outside of Tesla. There have been some vague promises that Tesla will eventually support "all important charging standards," or words to that effect, but that claim is very much open to interpretation, and of course there's nothing remotely resembling a promise as to when new products will be made available. I seem to recall seeing a post somewhere from somebody who received a vague promise that Tesla was working on such an adapter from a customer support person, but that's nth-hand information from somebody who's likely not involved in the development, and so that information doesn't carry much weight with me.

Personally, given Tesla's history on this and the fact that a CCS adapter is far from required in North America (or any other market that uses the same CCS variety we use here), I'd say it's likely to materialize sometime, but the wait is likely to be measured in years, not weeks or months. Note that CHAdeMO is quite dominant in Japan, so Tesla was highly motivated to create that adapter for the Model S when they introduced it into the Japanese market, and to make the CHAdeMO adapter work with the Model 3 when they began selling the Model 3 there. There's no equivalent compelling need for CCS, AFAIK.
CCS and ChadeMo are the most popular in Canada for cross country travel not including Tesla on the TransCanada but not the Yellowhead
 
Another summer of road trips has rolled around and I'm still holding out hope a CCS adapter will be available soon (tm). My first trip of the year I am borrowing a friends CHAdeMO adapter; he bought it back in his Model S days 6 years ago so it was a worthwhile investment at the time. I find it hard to want to shell out the cash now though, when I see that the CCS adapter being sold in Europe is smaller, cheaper, and charges at a higher rate! Almost none of the public DCFCs are free now in BC (as it should be), and of course none of the private ones are, so there is no cost-benefit argument to just buy it now. The only reason is to get the ability to travel further afield...

My usual stomping grounds - DCFC coverage:

View attachment 553595


Supercharger coverage:

View attachment 553596
That is a whole lot of BC, AB and northern WA/ID/MT I can't get to at all. Many of these regions are major tourism draws and/or major cities (at least as far as BC is concerned for size!). If they won't build us more SC's in these areas, at least give us the ability to use the latest standard. CHAdeMO is dying a slow death and I do not want to spend big $$ on an adapter for it.

Good news - I caved and bought the CHAdeMO adapter, so the CCS adapter should come out in a few months or less. (This is based on my past experience of having off-timing for almost every EV related purchase thus far haha! BC government rebate cancelled right before I bought my Leaf in 2014, Tesla dropped price substantially on my M3 a few months after I bought it, Tesla actually released the MY really early, which I would have preferred over my M3 but couldn't wait 2+ years...)
 
Good news - I caved and bought the CHAdeMO adapter, so the CCS adapter should come out in a few months or less. (This is based on my past experience of having off-timing for almost every EV related purchase thus far haha! BC government rebate cancelled right before I bought my Leaf in 2014, Tesla dropped price substantially on my M3 a few months after I bought it, Tesla actually released the MY really early, which I would have preferred over my M3 but couldn't wait 2+ years...)
Oof feels bad man, are there any free BC hydro chargers near you? If so, what kind of kWs do you see on them?
 
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Good news - I caved and bought the CHAdeMO adapter, so the CCS adapter should come out in a few months or less.
Hey, that was my joke.

And I made it over a year ago when *I* caved. Now I have had it so long I have paid off the upfront cost in free and inexpensive charge stations like the ones all over LA. Even if they do come out with a CCS adapter most chargers are going to be as slow as CHAdeMO (45kW) or more expensive than Supercharging, and CCS won't work outside North America, and the CCS2 adapter won't fit my car.

So I'll be keeping my CHAdeMO that is now nothing but free and international power (for when they pave the Bering Straits, I can go back the way my ancestors came 10,000 years ago).
 
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