CCS Adapter for North America

[srs5694]

I would prefer if Tesla would just get around to adding CCS chargers to the NAV display. At least for high speed CCS stations like ChargePoint and EA. There are several CCS adapters on the market, so they shouldn't wait to add CCS to NA Teslas until their own adapter is available. They probably should have added them when they adding the CCS Enabled information tag to the Car Info section.

In addition to @jsight's point, I'm not sure I'd agree that there are "several CCS adapters on the market." Currently, for North America, the only one that's officially available is the Setec/Lectron adapter. (This was originally sold direct from Setec, but the last I'd heard they'd appointed Lectron as their official North American distributor, so it's now sold under that name.) Tesla has been repeatedly disabling this adapter, citing safety concerns -- it appears to be possible to disconnect the CCS plug from the adapter without first powering it down, creating a high-voltage electric spark hazard. Setec has been countering by updating their own firmware, so owners find that it works one week, fails to work the next week (after a Tesla firmware update), and then works again a week or two later (after updating the adapter's firmware), and so on. Of course, if Tesla's concerns are valid and not overblown (and I tend to give Tesla the benefit of the doubt on this one), the adapter really isn't safe and should be used cautiously at most, and arguably not at all. What's more, it maxes out at 50 kW, so your comment about adding high-speed stations is kind of moot for it. (In theory, it could do 80 kW, and for a while it did so on Models S and X; but Tesla has imposed a 50 kW limit in software to CHAdeMO devices, which the Setec adapter pretends to be.)

Tesla's CCS adapter is not officially available in North America, AFAIK. Although a number of people here have bought one from Korea, until Tesla starts officially selling them, it'd be hard to justify Tesla adding CCS stations to the in-car navigation. Also, this adapter works only on newer Teslas (like, those made sometime in 2020 or later; I don't know the exact cutoff date). Older ones, like my own 2019 Model 3, lack the required CCS support in the car. Thus, some people might never be able to use Tesla's adapter, even once it becomes available, unless they first update their charging hardware. I gather that some people have managed to do this, but I expect a lot of people wouldn't feel comfortable doing this themselves, and it's unclear if Tesla will ever officially support such an upgrade, or how much it would cost through them.

AFAIK, those are the only two CCS1 adapters in existence. Tesla does sell a CCS2 adapter for Model S and X vehicles in Europe, but that's another market entirely, with different issues. I have no idea if European Teslas show non-Tesla CCS2 stations in their navigation.

 

[spokey]

there is also a CCS1 that was being sold here that was made in the Ukraine. That has stopped of course and I don't know how many are around. Supposedly it was a good one although IIRC it was pricey as in 5-600 range.

 

[DrGriz]

there is also a CCS1 that was being sold here that was made in the Ukraine. That has stopped of course and I don't know how many are around. Supposedly it was a good one although IIRC it was pricey as in 5-600 range.

Wish I could have gotten one from them. FYI, calling it "the Ukraine" is considered insulting, because it is the Russian way of referring to it as though they possessed it. Right now, Ukraine prefers plain "Ukraine." I have had a hard time changing, too. No worries.

 

[spokey]

ah politics everywhere I go

BUT my CCS1 came this evening.

Heavier than I expected

 

[RichAZ/CapeCod]

Rumors say that all Teslas are gonna get TrackMode in the not too distant future, hopefully we can all precondition on demand.

I would prefer if Tesla would just get around to adding CCS chargers to the NAV display. At least for high speed CCS stations like ChargePoint and EA. ...

Randy, the Nav display kinda-sorta does. I have the Korean CCS adapter and will be going to Cape Cod from AZ this coming Saturday (6/4) so I'm planning on using the adapter. Thus I was playing with the system.

Push the right side wheel button and say something like; "Navigate to Electrify America chargers" (or ChargePoint, I've done both this way) and they pop right up.

I'll do a mini-write up on what transpires on this road trip. I have half a dozen EA stops planned. First one in Deming NM at a Walmart.

I've used EA before, on a road trip from Cape Cod to AZ (back in 2019, ugh...). Hear the system is lots better now. We'll see. I'll only be using EA sites which are close to Tesla SC locations.

Rich

Charging the Bolt in NM. Bolt is kinda slow taking a charge. Would you believe the guy my wife was speaking with was a fully fleshed out guy when the conversation started!!

 

[srs5694]

there is also a CCS1 that was being sold here that was made in the Ukraine. That has stopped of course and I don't know how many are around. Supposedly it was a good one although IIRC it was pricey as in 5-600 range.

I'd not heard of that one. Do you have a link to any more information? Obviously if it's no longer available it's of little or no practical importance, but I am curious about it.

 

[Randy-12]

ah politics everywhere I go

BUT my CCS1 came this evening.

Heavier than I expected

wow yes, I was really surprised at the heft of it as well. I was not expecting that weight.

 

[Randy-12]

I'd not heard of that one. Do you have a link to any more information? Obviously if it's no longer available it's of little or no practical importance, but I am curious about it.

Tesla US CCS1/CCS2 (400A)

Due to war and huge internal demand, export orders likely will NOT be executed any time soon. We will do our best to restore the manufacturing supply chain, for each order placed. We will contact each order owner when it`s ready to ship. Our apologies. Tesla US - ccs1 adapter...

evhub.shop

 

[Randy-12]

Push the right side wheel button and say something like; "Navigate to Electrify America chargers" (or ChargePoint, I've done both this way) and they pop right up.

After selecting the station you want, does it start preheating the battery?

 

[srs5694]

Tesla US CCS1/CCS2 (400A)

Due to war and huge internal demand, export orders likely will NOT be executed any time soon. We will do our best to restore the manufacturing supply chain, for each order placed. We will contact each order owner when it`s ready to ship. Our apologies. Tesla US - ccs1 adapter...

evhub.shop

Thanks for the link. That looks like a simple pass-through design similar to Tesla's, but without the interlock to prevent removal of the CCS plug when the charge is underway. That would give it the same safety issues as the Setec/Lectron adapter, but I doubt if the car could detect it and disable it the way Tesla's been doing (in a whack-a-mole way) with the Setec/Lectron adapter. All in all, if I had a CCS-enabled Tesla, I'd definitely prefer Tesla's adapter.

It also strikes me that the main body of the adapter looks like it's 3D-printed. I'm guessing it's a 3D-printed shell into which metal parts are inserted.

 

[Randy-12]

Thanks for the link. That looks like a simple pass-through design similar to Tesla's, but without the interlock to prevent removal of the CCS plug when the charge is underway. That would give it the same safety issues as the Setec/Lectron adapter, but I doubt if the car could detect it and disable it the way Tesla's been doing (in a whack-a-mole way) with the Setec/Lectron adapter. All in all, if I had a CCS-enabled Tesla, I'd definitely prefer Tesla's adapter.

It also strikes me that the main body of the adapter looks like it's 3D-printed. I'm guessing it's a 3D-printed shell into which metal parts are inserted.

I was listening to an InsideEV podcast and they mentioned that some stations are able to see what adapter you're using and if you are using the one from Ukraine the station will not start. They are able to block it due to the safety issue you mentioned.

They said that the station has a way to detect the adapter.

Don't know it if is true or not as I don't have this adapter and have only tried one station close to home.

 

[srs5694]

I was listening to an InsideEV podcast and they mentioned that some stations are able to see what adapter you're using and if you are using the one from Ukraine the station will not start. They are able to block it due to the safety issue you mentioned.

They said that the station has a way to detect the adapter.

Don't know it if is true or not as I don't have this adapter and have only tried one station close to home.

If it is a simple pass-through device, then I don't see how the station could tell it apart from Tesla's adapter. The Setec/Lectron adapter, OTOH, would probably be identifiable to the CCS station, just as it is to the car (which is how Tesla is identifying them and shutting them off). Thus, I wonder if whoever said this on the podcast might have gotten those two adapters mixed up. If CCS chargers are refusing to work with the Setec/Lectron adapter, then that might help explain some of the problems being reported on the thread about it. Then too, maybe the Ukrainian device is not the simple pass-through device that it appears to be.

 

[israndy]

I was listening to an InsideEV podcast and they mentioned that some stations are able to see what adapter you're using

Yeah, that's far from useful information.

First off, WHAT stations? EA? EVgo? ChargePoint? GreenLots (ahem, Shell)? Anyone I am forgetting?
Secondly, WHY would they care? They can change anything that comes their way, car, truck, motorcycle, homebuilt, and they are gonna try to figure out if there is a specific adapter on a single car manufacturer?

Perhaps they are looking for any adapter, for fear that people might start trying to hook their chargers to devices/batteries not made to work with them, but at the moment that would queer the connection only with Tesla and they have been great stewards of charging, the Swiss Army Knife of EVs if you will. Just kinda sounds like bunk, that's all.

 

[Randy-12]

It could have to do with the locking mechanism or lack there of.
I don't know how they would tell but then again there most of this is all new to me.

 

[avs007]

If it is a simple pass-through device, then I don't see how the station could tell it apart from Tesla's adapter. The Setec/Lectron adapter, OTOH, would probably be identifiable to the CCS station, just as it is to the car (which is how Tesla is identifying them and shutting them off). Thus, I wonder if whoever said this on the podcast might have gotten those two adapters mixed up. If CCS chargers are refusing to work with the Setec/Lectron adapter, then that might help explain some of the problems being reported on the thread about it. Then too, maybe the Ukrainian device is not the simple pass-through device that it appears to be.

The Setec adapter is doing protocol emulation, as it is talking CCS on the station side, and Chademo on the car side. That means the car and the station are probably able to identify the adapter, since the adapter has to have the entire networking stack on both sides, so it would be able to be uniquely identified. The Tesla CCS adapter on the other hand, is a passthru, so the station probably would only be able to identify the car, since it is communicating directly with the CCS controller on the chargeport ECU.

 

[avs007]

Yeah, that's far from useful information.

First off, WHAT stations? EA? EVgo? ChargePoint? GreenLots (ahem, Shell)? Anyone I am forgetting?
Secondly, WHY would they care? They can change anything that comes their way, car, truck, motorcycle, homebuilt, and they are gonna try to figure out if there is a specific adapter on a single car manufacturer?

Perhaps they are looking for any adapter, for fear that people might start trying to hook their chargers to devices/batteries not made to work with them, but at the moment that would queer the connection only with Tesla and they have been great stewards of charging, the Swiss Army Knife of EVs if you will. Just kinda sounds like bunk, that's all.

I can't remember which, maybe it was both, but I remember reading that either EA or EVGO (or both) have a clause stating that using third party charging adapters is prohibited. It says you can only use adapters provided by the vehicle manufacturer. I remember thinking that was odd, since I remember someone else said that EA (or maybe it was EVGO), said Tesla owners should use the Setec adapter in lieu of the Chademo plugs they were decommissioning, or something like that. That last part was second hand, so I don't remember the details.

But anyways, the original clause about the 3rd party adapters. I vaguely remember it stating it was due to liability in case the user was trying to charge something homebuilt or something like that.

 

[MP3Mike]

I can't remember which, maybe it was both, but I remember reading that either EA or EVGO (or both) have a clause stating that using third party charging adapters is prohibited. It says you can only use adapters provided by the vehicle manufacturer. I remember thinking that was odd, since I remember someone else said that EA (or maybe it was EVGO), said Tesla owners should use the Setec adapter in lieu of the Chademo plugs they were decommissioning, or something like that. That last part was second hand, so I don't remember the details.

But anyways, the original clause about the 3rd party adapters. I vaguely remember it stating it was due to liability in case the user was trying to charge something homebuilt or something like that.

EVGo prohibits third-party adapters and EA used the availability of the SETEC adapter as an excuse to discontinue installing CHAdeMO chargers.

 

[Bunklung]

The Setec adapter is doing protocol emulation, as it is talking CCS on the station side, and Chademo on the car side. That means the car and the station are probably able to identify the adapter, since the adapter has to have the entire networking stack on both sides, so it would be able to be uniquely identified. The Tesla CCS adapter on the other hand, is a passthru, so the station probably would only be able to identify the car, since it is communicating directly with the CCS controller on the chargeport ECU.

When I used my CCS adapter at an EVgo station it knew I was a Tesla. It was displayed on the station screen. My vehicle is not added to my EVgo profile. The vehicle model/make must be declared by the protocol.

 

[STS-134]

EVGo prohibits third-party adapters and EA used the availability of the SETEC adapter as an excuse to discontinue installing CHAdeMO chargers.

How would that be an excuse for anything? The SETEC adapter plugs into CCS chargers, so if they're going to use it as an excuse for anything, it would have been to discontinue CCS.

 

[avs007]

When I used my CCS adapter at an EVgo station it knew I was a Tesla. It was displayed on the station screen. My vehicle is not added to my EVgo profile. The vehicle model/make must be declared by the protocol.

Yes, but the protocol endpoint is the setec adapter, so the adapter can really say whatever it wants. My point was that since the entire networking stack is on the adapter for the Setec, it would be possible to fingerprint the adapter, since the station is not communicating with the car directly, since the car is speaking a completely different protocol. The setec adapter is basically a man-in-the-middle. There are usually a lot of ways to detect a man-in-the-middle that isn't doing a simple relay.