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CCS adapter please.

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by McRat, Oct 22, 2016.

  1. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    I'm at a Marriott in Goleta.
    The charger is CCS only.

    A half mile away is L2. But it is 9 mph charge rate.

    It's time.
     
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  2. David99

    David99 Active Member

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    I think they said they are working on an adapter
     
  3. BerTX

    BerTX Active Member

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    I have never seen a CCS-only charger. Lots of CHAdeMO- only, and a few with both. Most of the new installations NOT located in Nissan dealerships seem to be both.

    The CCS adapter will no doubt be smaller and less expensive, but since I already have a CHAdeMO, I doubt I'll get one. The only places likely to have CCS-only is dealerships, and those are unlikely to be Tesla-friendly for long, if at all.
     
  4. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    I'm looking at it right now. It's CCS only. It is at a hotel on US 101. This is not an auto dealership. You sleep here. Yes it was installed by BMW/VW as part of the Pacific Coastal Corridor. But it is operated by ChargePoint.
     
  5. jbcarioca

    jbcarioca Active Member

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    Many CCS only are on their way to NA, most of which will be ChargePoint operated funded by BMW, VW et al. As for size/complexity if CCS adapters, they will be much more complex than CHAdeMO because CCS depends on AC power for network functions and thus will make vehicle modifications as well as an adapter. CHAdeMO is simple by comparison. OTOH, Tesla is a full member of CharIN, the entity that manages CCS, so that helps. Another issue, CCS NA and EU use different charging connectors so Tesla needs to have two such adapters. The EU Superchargers use a CCS compatible plug, but use different pins to handle DC fast.

    Simply said; CCS Fast DC charging is quite a complex beast. The currently installed NA CCS DC Fast are not really quick even though the standard is ready for faster-than-present-Supercharger speeds. It will not be quickly deployed.
     
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  6. BerTX

    BerTX Active Member

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    I wasn't doubting that they exist or that you know of one, just relating my experience, which is limited.

    Too bad they reduced the size of the frunk -- mine will be filled with charging adapters...
     
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  7. jbcarioca

    jbcarioca Active Member

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    Mine are ready to go to the Frunk, but until Tesla changes the old-fashioned Frunk latching process, I'll just let the well in the Trunk be full of assorted gear. I'd like to think we'll end out with a single standard, but we will not; there has yet to be a single standard for any electric connection even in a single country AFAIK. IIRC the UK has three distinct legal choices for a standard 240v domestic outlet. Here in Brazil we have roughly nine (counting the 127v/120//240v domestic standards, and about three legal choices for each). The US has lots more for 208/220/240. Nobody except parts of the EU have a settled DC Fast standard. Check the Australia forum for an exercise in incompatible L2 standards. For the foreseeable future any EV driver wanting long distance travel had best plan for many adapters and lots of space, as well as an academic course on competing standards.:eek:
     
  8. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    Interesting. I don't see that charger listed on Chargepoint. You might want to add it.

    @jbcarioca my trunk well is also where I keep my adaptors. Currently I have a 6-50, L6-20, 14-30 and 14-50 along with the standard adaptors that Tesla provides, as well as a 15 foot NEMA 14-50 extension cord. That's a lot of stuff.

    At this time I cannot envision ever buying a CHAdeMO or CCS adapator. The Supercharger network is the only thing I use for long distance travel. Over the past 3 years I have become less reliant on destination charging, not more reliant. And the Tesla Destination Charging Network is expanding at an amazing rate.

    @McRat is it necessary for you to charge at the Goleta Marriott, or would it simply be a convenience? When traveling on Hwy 101 there are many Superchargers. I realize you are aware of that, I'm just trying to understand your need for charging at that location. Buelton and Oxnard are close by.
     
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  9. TexasEV

    TexasEV Well-Known Member

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    It's more convenient to charge when you sleep. That said, CCS at a hotel is overkill. Better they install a few level 2s, including Tesla destination charging.
     
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  10. BerTX

    BerTX Active Member

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    Living in California, you are right -- CHAdeMO is not needed. However, the real world doesn't have Superchargers every few miles, and certainly none IN cities. They are truly for long distance travel, located well outside populated areas.

    One time that CHAdeMO is useful is when going to visit and stay with someone living in a city with no convenient Supercharger, and that person has no means to charge your car overnight (they live in an apartment or condo). Choices are to park the car somewhere for hours unattended while it charges at an L2, or find a CHAdeMO to charge more quickly while having a meal.
     
  11. mpmeyer

    mpmeyer Member

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    According to Chargepoint it's a 24 kW
     

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  12. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for correcting me. My mistake, I now realize that I have my ChargePoint "filters" set to not show "DC Fast Combo" stations since my cars can't use them to charge. When I change my filters to show those kinds of stations I can see the station that you and @McRat are referring to.
     
  13. MP3Mike

    MP3Mike Active Member

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    What do they mean by "Combo" wouldn't that mean CHAdeMO and CCS?
     
  14. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    Combo = Combined Charging System. It's a SAE J1772 with 2 more connectors to allow DC, but AFAIK, not compatible with J1772 L2 AC charging?

    Yes, 2 L2 J1772's would have been cheaper and a better choice.

    Comedy Moment - As we left, there was a Lamborghini parked in the EV stall, perhaps one of the thirstiest cars ever made. Next to it, was Tesla Model X, who could not use the charger anyhow. Irony.
     
  15. gregd

    gregd Active Member

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    So, could one create a connectors-and-wires-only adapter (i.e. no active electronics) to pick off the J1772 part of the CCS connector, and charge the car (slowly) from there?
     
  16. TexasEV

    TexasEV Well-Known Member

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    The "combo" of CCS (AKA Frankenplug) is both DC charging and J1772 AC charging in the same port, but not the same charging station. Compare that to the sleekness of the Tesla Connector and charging port which is also used for both DC and level 2 AC charging.
     
  17. Jeff N

    Jeff N Active Member

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    A car with an SAE CCS port can use either a J1772 AC station or an SAE CCS station.

    An SAE CCS station plug cannot be used with a car that only has a J1772 AC port and there would be no purpose in that anyway since such cars cannot accept DC and CCS DC chargers do not supply AC.

    In theory, I suppose, you could have a large scale installation with lots of charging stalls and plugs but a smaller number of DC charging units sharing the cables. Cars could immediately park and use the SAE CCS plugs to draw AC while queuing for the next available DC charging unit to become available and then the AC pilot signal could be dropped to stop the AC charge and a new charging session could be started for the faster DC charging phase. Later, when nearing full, the DC charge could end and the DC charger could be switched to another car while the nearly full car could revert back to AC charging.

    I could see how that might make economic sense in some situations but I'm unsure whether the existing signaling protocols would actually allow for such a handoff.

    You could, in theory, do similar things with the Tesla plug however it's probably unlikely to work with CHAdeMO since it is capable of DC only.

    Just to confuse things further, there actually is an SAE J1772 "Level 1 DC" specification which allows for DC charging over the same pins normally used for AC charging at up to 500V at 80A or 40 kW. At least I think that is how it works -- I haven't bothered to read that part of the specs. I don't think anyone, DC charger makers or car makers, actually implements support for that.
     
  18. gregd

    gregd Active Member

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    I guess this is the answer I was wondering about. In the unusual case (I suppose) that your J1772-only car was at a CCS-only station, could you pick off the J1772 portion of the station's CCS plug and use that? If a CCS station's plug won't supply charging power through the AC pins, then the adapter I was wondering about wouldn't work.

    So, to complete my understanding about the CCS standard, are the J1772 pins on the CCS connector only used for communication to control the DC charging?
     
  19. Saghost

    Saghost Active Member

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    There's a CCS only unit right across the street from where I work, too.

    I'd probably pay for that adapter along with the CHAdeMO I already have..
     
  20. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    Yeah, the CCS does look like it was designed by a government bureau. That is not a compliment. :D

    But SAE doesn't stand for silly auto equipment. There must have been some very specific reasons they did it that way. I'd guess higher voltages and/or higher amps for future apps, or higher capabilities before watercooling becomes necessary.
     

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