CCS - buy now or wait?

[bradtem]

I bought the Lectron CCS adapter in anticipation of having my model S retrofitted for CCS.
However my friend just bought a new Model Y.
So we tried the adapter on his car at a Volta CCS station. We couldn’t get it to work.
We then went to a Electrify America station and it did work fine.

I contacted Volta about our problem at their station.
Here is one line of their response:
“ Please note: Our network does not support the use of 3rd party CSS adapters that are not explicitly approved by the manufacturer.”

Does this sound right?

That is their policy in theory, but I would not think they could detect this adapter, certainly not that quickly. It is possible the adapters have some properties which can be detected by the charging station, and that Volta might try to do that, but even if this is possible, and Volta decided to do that, I would be amazed that they got samples of this adapter so quickly and coded this in to their stations.

The main reason they would have a rule like this is liability, so they can say "we're not liable if you used that adapter," so I would not think block them would be urgent.

 

[Midnightsun]

I got my Lectron unit just yesterday and do have the OEM Tesla unit also. Will be trying out the lectron unit in a couple of places and IF it does not work I will try the Tesla unit to see if it works. Technically they are passive units so it should not matter at all and should behave the same.

 

[spokey]

I got my Lectron unit just yesterday and do have the OEM Tesla unit also. Will be trying out the lectron unit in a couple of places and IF it does not work I will try the Tesla unit to see if it works. Technically they are passive units so it should not matter at all and should behave the same.

A number of people have said they are passive but that doesn't seem right. At the least they throttle down if they heat up. Maybe they actually do some other stuff.

TEMPERATURE MONITORING - Equipped with real-time internal temperature monitoring - At 179 °F the current will be reduced (depending on the Tesla system); at 188.6 °F the current will be cut off until ambient temperature is restored

 

[boingolover]

A number of people have said they are passive but that doesn't seem right. At the least they throttle down if they heat up. Maybe they actually do some other stuff.

TEMPERATURE MONITORING - Equipped with real-time internal temperature monitoring - At 179 °F the current will be reduced (depending on the Tesla system); at 188.6 °F the current will be cut off until ambient temperature is restored

I think the most interesting bit of that is:

(depending on the Tesla system)

There is a provision for a temperature sensor in the ccs1 connector. It entirely possible - likely even - that this adapter is still passive and just passing along temperature readings via the sensor, and Tesla is doing the throttling based on that input.

 

[spokey]

If that is the case then
. Equipped with real-time internal temperature monitoring
seems like false advertising to me

 

[bradtem]

If that is the case then
. Equipped with real-time internal temperature monitoring
seems like false advertising to me

There are two ways you could do that.
1) The adapter could have a thermistor in it which somehow the car reads, though I don't know what pins it uses.
2) More likely the thermistor just interrupts the data channel which stops charging. Though I think it is more sophisticated than that. Is there something built into the protocols for this?

Why would that be false advertising. I am sure there is a thermistor in the adapter, and that it somehow signals to stop or reduce charging. That's probably even required by the specs.

 

[boingolover]

There are two ways you could do that.
1) The adapter could have a thermistor in it which somehow the car reads, though I don't know what pins it uses.

2) More likely the thermistor just interrupts the data channel which stops charging. Though I think it is more sophisticated than that. Is there something built into the protocols for this?

Good question, and not that I'm seeing what pin a thermistor would connect to anywhere anywhere. I did find the specs of a CCS1 plug you could buy, and it included a pt1000 style temperature sensor. It could just be breaking / disconnecting the prox pin?

 

[spokey]

Why would that be false advertising. I am sure there is a thermistor in the adapter, and that it somehow signals to stop or reduce charging. That's probably even required by the specs.

I agree that would not be false advertising. I would contend that it is not passive in that case. It is detecting something via the termistor and acting upon that. Yes, it is simple but it is not passive.

 

[bradtem]

I agree that would not be false advertising. I would contend that it is not passive in that case. It is detecting something via the termistor and acting upon that. Yes, it is simple but it is not passive.

Most people are using "passive" to mean the adapter has no smarts, it does not intercept or alter the protocol signals going through it. The CHAdeMO adapter is non-passive, and has circuits which convert the CHAdeMO protocols to signals the Tesla can read. Tesla put support for CCS signalling and protocols in the Tesla car charge controller, so the adapter for that is just pass through. I don't know how the thermal sensor in the adapters signals overheat, but I believe this is also a standard function needed in the plug on the charger as well, and this is just extending that. If the plug overheats or the adapter overheats or the socket overheats, sensors trigger shutdown or reduction of current.

If anybody has detailed info on just how this is done, that would be of interest. But it's not by translating the protocol.
Another non-passive adapter is the SETEC. It translates the CCS protocol into the protocol Tesla uses to talk to its CHAdeMO adapter.

 

[spokey]

OK. Yes, I'm thinking 'passive' as the dictionary defines the word but if most mean what you say then it sounds like it is 'passive'

 

[sleepydoc]

OK. Yes, I'm thinking 'passive' as the dictionary defines the word but if most mean what you say then it sounds like it is 'passive'

Passive vs active is used differently in electronics vs the classical literary usage.

 

[kithytom]

aside from Tesla OEM, anyone compared the reliability between Lectron and Hansshow? These two can be still siginificantly cheaper than OEM with discounts

 

[bradtem]

Passive vs active is used differently in electronics vs the classical literary usage.

So an adapter with a fuse is not a passive adapter? That is pretty much what this is, I think. One reason all the adapters have this thermal detect is I suspect you could not ever get UL for an adapter without it. Though I am not sure they will get UL, they probably wish to.

 

[israndy]

Cheap CCS1 Tesla clone adapter $59.60
Normally $148.99 - 60% off

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256805371617870.html

Shipping: $16.82

Not sure if the specs being all over the map is a bad sign or not

 

[Mateo83]

I think I've use mine 2-3 times. Not worth the investment

 

[CMPT PAD]

if U travel A LOT on highway... It's for a peace of mind
IF NOT... not worth it because in the long run most CCS1 based charge stations will be able to handle Tesla charge port (I think)

 

[howardnj]

if U travel A LOT on highway... It's for a peace of mind
IF NOT... not worth it because in the long run most CCS1 based charge stations will be able to handle Tesla charge port (I think)

I use my CC1 adapter frequently at the Florida FPL Evolution 350kWh chargers because they are usually cheaper than the Tesla 250kWh chargers. Well worth it in my opinion.

 

[davewill]

It sounds like it won't be all that long before most of the CCS1 stations will have Tesla plugs on them as well. I'm just hoping they'll work on cars like mine that don't have CCS1 capability.

 

[tangible1]

We've been waiting over a year for Tesla to sell it in the US. What makes you think it'll be available in the next few months?

I have no need for it but I still want one. I'm waiting for it to be sold here before I purchase.

I guess you missed the CCS Adapter sale Tesla had this past fall. They were dumping them for $175

 

[Midnightsun]

I have never used mine except for a test. One day you will be glad you have it or kicking yourself in the butt because you don't.