CHAdeMO adapter wait frustration

[bollar]

The Leaf can actually make inter-city trips in WA and OR because the West Coast Green highway has DC chargers spaced every 30-40 miles along I-5. In contrast, CA and TX has stations clustered near major cities (near SJ and LA for CA, DFW and Houston for TX) designed mainly for local usage.

Yes, which may be driven by the size of the mentioned cities and the distance between them. Dallas & Fort Worth are 32 miles apart (city center to city center) and there's a huge amount of traffic between the two cities. The current DC deployment scattered all around the Metroplex seems to make sense and makes the Leaf viable in this market, especially given the pollution restrictions in place. I would imagine a similar story could be told for LA.

On the other hand, Dallas to Houston is 239 miles, and there's nothing in between (apologies to the residents of Ennis, Centerville, Madisonville & Huntsville). With a fully built out network, I agree that you'd want to have DC stations every 50 miles or so. I just don't see many BEV owners with 70 mile range making that journey.

I would like to try the West Coast Green Highway, though!

 

[stopcrazypp]

Although there are a ton of tt30 sockets at all RV parks, almost every RV park has 50 amp service somewhere. I just got back from a 1k mile trip, and there was no shortage of nema 14-50 sockets. Calling ahead is a must.

Can a Model S charge when using the 14-50 adapter with another 14-50 to TT-30 adapter in the end (or 14-30 adapter to 14-30 to TT-30)? Of course with the current dialed down to 24A. That would give him at least access to the TT-30 and twice as fast charging (even though voltage is still 120V).

If I'm understanding correctly, he used a 5-15 to TT-30 (which is why the "pilot signal" is not there since 5-15 plugs don't use pilot signals), which is practically worthless.

 

[qwk]

Can a Model S charge when using the 14-50 adapter with another 14-50 to TT-30 adapter in the end (or 14-30 adapter to 14-30 to TT-30)? Of course with the current dialed down to 24A. That would give him at least access to the TT-30 and twice as fast charging (even though voltage is still 120V).

If I'm understanding correctly, he used a 5-15 to TT-30 (which is why the "pilot signal" is not there since 5-15 plugs don't use pilot signals), which is practically worthless.

Yes, the adapter would need to adapt to a Tesla 240v adapter. That is still 20A at 120V. Best case would be 6mph charging. That doesn't sound too bad until you are the one waiting for the car to charge. It flat out sucks.

IMO, 120V charging is only for people who drive less than about 40 miles per day, or emergency situations. Using 120V on a road trip is silly to me, because there are 14-50's at almost every RV park, you just have to ask for 50 amp service. RV parks are literally everywhere.

 

[brianman]

IMO, 120V charging is only for people who drive less than about 40 miles per day, or emergency situations.

This is essentially "by definition". With 2mph charging (projected from 110V/12A), it takes you 20 hours to replenish that 40 miles. That only leaves 4 hours to drive and sleep -- NOT concurrently.

 

[FlasherZ]

I don't think you understand the basics of how the "Quick 220" works. It takes one hot line from each 120 volt circuit and combines them in EXACTLY the same way they would be wired for 240 volts in your house or at a campground. The ground is common, and the neutral is unused.

I think I know precisely how they work. The reason I cringe is that the average person using a "Quick220" generally uses it with a pair of 50 or 100 foot AWG 16 extension cords.

The use of this device violates NEC code, as a load may not be served simultaneously by more than 2 branch circuits.

I've probably seen nearly every type of jury-rigged electrical configuration you might think of, from a homeowner creating a 240V subpanel in a detached shed using two extension cords tied overhead to two exterior outlets on opposite sides of a home, to a machine shop operator using the 208V stinger-to-ground voltage in a 3-phase delta config using the grounded conduit for return (because "I only had one wire!"), to creative use of paralleled conductors in an RV park to supply 50 amp service from a group of 3 parallel NEMA 5-15's.

See my FAQ for reasons why you may not want to do this.

 

[100thMonkey]

all the other camp sites I tried were full for the weekend. there was one 14/50 on a panel, in the middle of a field, and the host would not let me drive on the grass to get to it.
the trouble is, just because a 14/50 exists at a camp site doesn't mean it's not already in use. I was amazed at how common TT30's are and 30A would have really given me a lot more flexibility and peace of mind.

... Or, if I simply had a CHAdeMO adapter I could have camped at a non-RV site, charged up on the way and way back and enjoyed a more out doorsey feel with the kids while there without having the issue of charging dominate the experience.

Although there are a ton of tt30 sockets at all RV parks, almost every RV park has 50 amp service somewhere. I just got back from a 1k mile trip, and there was no shortage of nema 14-50 sockets. Calling ahead is a must.

I don't think that you need many adapters. 120V charging is useless on a road trip, and the only other 240 socket I have run into in the wild is a Nema 10-50. Other than a 10-50 adapter(which tesla doesn't sell for some reason), the only other helpful adapter would be a 14-50, so one can charge at relatives homes using their dryer outlet. The problem with that is the short length of the UMC, so a 20 foot or so extension cord is a must, which makes the 14-50 adapter useless.

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got this notice from Blink Today, only $5 for a QC on their CHAdeMO network:

"Blink Network's goal is to give you the freedom to stay charged whenever and wherever you want. Our Blink DC Fast Chargers are there to help you charge up and charge on quickly.

As of June 10, we’ll be adding Blink DC Fast Chargers to our membership plans. All Blink members will be able to fast charge at an introductory rate of just $5 per session. Guests may also charge for $8 per fast charge.

Now, more than ever, it makes dollars and sense to be a Blink member. There's no annual fee, your membership card is free and there's no prepayment. If you haven’t registered to become a Blink member yet, why not sign up today?"

 

[Seattle]

Someone should sell tt-30 plug adapters setup for tesla that have the "only for use for tesla, not for rv use" on them. I wish I could buy one. Actually tesla should sell this.

 

[Brandonm]

This is essentially "by definition". With 2mph charging (projected from 110V/12A), it takes you 20 hours to replenish that 40 miles. That only leaves 4 hours to drive and sleep -- NOT concurrently.

2mph? When I've had to use a normal outlet my S says 3.7mph when charging. It's terrible, but not as terrible as you're suggesting.

 

[brianman]

2mph? When I've had to use a normal outlet my S says 3.7mph when charging. It's terrible, but not as terrible as you're suggesting.

At most I saw it tap 3mph, but never saw near 4mph. Again, at the time (by bug or design) it was based on Projected so YMMV.

 

[FlasherZ]

2mph? When I've had to use a normal outlet my S says 3.7mph when charging. It's terrible, but not as terrible as you're suggesting.

With 120V, I've seen everything from 0 rMPH instant charging rates to 3 rMPH listed by the app. I do believe that in some cases, the charge rate was negative with cold weather. Ask the Canadians how much they got out of their 120V connections during the winter.

Voltage plays a big part here, the difference between 110V and 120V is almost 10%! There will be a noticeable difference between a receptacle powered by a 12 AWG 20-amp branch circuit 30 feet from the service panel and a receptacle powered by a 14 AWG 15-amp branch circuit 100+ feet from the service panel.

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Someone should sell tt-30 plug adapters setup for tesla that have the "only for use for tesla, not for rv use" on them. I wish I could buy one. Actually tesla should sell this.

I suspect the design costs would be too high and it only distracts from the goal which would be to move toward more pervasive charging systems. That said, it's a good emergency adapter to have when your RV park doesn't know how to set up 240V outlets properly. Best solution IMO is to lobby Tesla to whip up a TT-30 adapter for the UMC.

 

[NigelM]

I was amazed at how common TT30's are and 30A would have really given me a lot more flexibility and peace of mind.

Almost all campgrounds now have 14-50s and TT-30s on all sites. There's more and more RV's made to operate with 125v 30A these days.

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Someone should sell tt-30 plug adapters setup for tesla that have the "only for use for tesla, not for rv use" on them. I wish I could buy one. Actually tesla should sell this.

I think this should work fine: $16.89 from Walmart

 

[zax123]

Almost all campgrounds now have 14-50s and TT-30s on all sites. There's more and more RV's made to operate with 125v 30A these days.

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I think this should work fine: $16.89 from Walmart

View attachment 22801

With an adapter like this one you've linked from Walmart, would the UMC know to downgrade from 240 to 120V? And is the 50amp side of that adapter compatible with 14-50 or 6-50? Not sure...

 

[Seattle]

With an adapter like this one you've linked from Walmart, would the UMC know to downgrade from 240 to 120V? And is the 50amp side of that adapter compatible with 14-50 or 6-50? Not sure...

That walmart adapter just seems too easy. Could flasherZ or one of the other experts chime in whether this would work for us and deliver 120v at 30 amps? Based on my understanding, all we have to do is dial down the amperage to 24 (80% of 30amps, as always)? I also found this http://www.evseadapters.com/adapters-for-tesla-model-s.php. The tt-30 adapter on that page converts to the normal 120v outlet it looks like, so as described in this thread, this should only privde the power of a normal 120v outlet (because of the tesla umc thinking its normal 120v).

 

[PhilBa]

For a road trip, I don't know about others but I can't imagine going to a campground/RV Park for 220/40A charging unless I was totally desperate. Especially as it would mean at bare minimum of a couple of hours. And 110V charger is a total non-starter as others have mentioned. To me, a road trip shouldn't require hanging out in RV Parks.

 

[NigelM]

And is the 50amp side of that adapter compatible with 14-50 or 6-50? Not sure...

It's compatible with a 14-50.

 

[donauker]

I think this should work fine: $16.89 from Walmart

View attachment 22801

With an adapter like this one you've linked from Walmart, would the UMC know to downgrade from 240 to 120V? And is the 50amp side of that adapter compatible with 14-50 or 6-50? Not sure...

This adapter will not work since they tie both L1 and L2 pins of the 14-50 to the one hot pin of the TT-30. The UMC will see this adapter as providing no power.

This is designed to provide power to an RV that only uses 120 volt appliances wired from either hot pin to neutral on the 14-50 connector. Large motorhomes can detect that this adapter is being used by the fact that both hot pins are on the same phase (wired together) and automatically sequence appliances so they draw no more the 30 amps total at any given time.

 

[Eberhard]

I dont really understand the demand for CHAdeMO. Teslas DC charger as well as the CCS are based on the IEC 62196 protocol, better all CHAdeMO is getting another plug to comply with the
IEC 62196-3. An adapter for would be as easy as for the J1772 plug. The use of an adapter for CHAdeMO may also be illegal.

 

[100thMonkey]

some campgrounds only have TT30's, the connector you show is almost identical to the one I got a hold of and unless it sends a pilot signal the car refuses to charge on it. from talking with Tony Williams, it sounds like the Quick 220 is the only way to really get substantially better than a tt30 to 5-15 which is limited to 120V at 12A= about 3 mph. it sounds like the TT30 to 14-50 would have to be shunted to 23A, if the car would even let me, and that would have been double what I was pulling so still worth it. I have been really reluctant to use something like a quick 220, call it ignorance, but I just am leery to plug two plugs into anything, I just don't know enough to have confidence that I won't run into trouble... but I will probably be getting over that real soon as a 64 hour turn around time is not going to cut it in the future.

Almost all campgrounds now have 14-50s and TT-30s on all sites. There's more and more RV's made to operate with 125v 30A these days.

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I think this should work fine: $16.89 from Walmart

View attachment 22801

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This adapter will not work since they tie both L1 and L2 pins of the 14-50 to the one hot pin of the TT-30. The UMC will see this adapter as providing no power.

This is designed to provide power to an RV that only uses 120 volt appliances wired from either hot pin to neutral on the 14-50 connector. Large motorhomes can detect that this adapter is being used by the fact that both hot pins are on the same phase (wired together) and automatically sequence appliances so they draw no more the 30 amps total at any given time.

yes, that's exactly what happened. do you know of such an adapter that would work with the S.

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For a road trip, I don't know about others but I can't imagine going to a campground/RV Park for 220/40A charging unless I was totally desperate. Especially as it would mean at bare minimum of a couple of hours. And 110V charger is a total non-starter as others have mentioned. To me, a road trip shouldn't require hanging out in RV Parks.

Imagine that the campground/RV park is your destination for a few days, which it was for me. 220/40A would have been great, much better than 120F/12A!

 

[markb1]

some campgrounds only have TT30's, the connector you show is almost identical to the one I got a hold of and unless it sends a pilot signal the car refuses to charge on it.

What do you mean by this? The pilot signal is sent by the UMC. If you have the Telsa-provided 14-50 adapter attached, it signals the UMC to provide a 40A pilot.

 

[donauker]

yes, that's exactly what happened. do you know of such an adapter that would work with the S.

What do you mean by this? The pilot signal is sent by the UMC. If you have the Telsa-provided 14-50 adapter attached, it signals the UMC to provide a 40A pilot.

The only way to get an adapter for TT-30 to UMC is to build one yourself. This adapter would be totally non-code compliant and would potentially destroy any other device designed for 240 volts that could be plugged in to it. Since the Model S is designed to only draw a max of 20 amps when it detects 120 volts regardless of the pilot signal from the UMC, that is the max charge rate. The Roadster does not have this limit and can charge at 24 amps or even higher NEC violating and breaker testing levels.