Charge scheduling (again... sorry!)

[Simonix]

Here's another update, after Tesla Support reached out to me following a bug report I raised on the App Store. It's a cut & paste from an email exhage I had with VehicleSupportEMEA - [email protected] - sorry if it is a bit long, but it was necessary to explain the problem in detail.

I wrote:

The underlying problem is that I cannot schedule a start and end time for charging, so as to fit within my electricity supplier’s off-peak times. The app is trying to implement these use cases: 1) “charge to this battery percentage by this time” (scheduled departure) and 2) “start charging at this time, stop when this battery percentage is reached” (scheduled charge).

It is counter intuitive call this second use case “scheduled charging” if you can only schedule the start time, and the “off peak” feature is only available on the scheduled departure tab. There is a “peak time end” in the scheduled departure tab but I can’t actually reach that on my phone because it is below the lower border of the screen. I have an iPhone 7, and this is a definite bug in the app; the app should allow scrolling as it does on other screens.

What I need is this use case: “charge up to a specified percentage starting at [start time] and ending at [end time]”. If the specified SoC isn’t achieved by the end time, it should still stop charging, and it should honour the charge rate too (amperage setting). In this way, I can leave my Tesla plugged in, and it will top up my battery only within the (off peak) times I specify. You can see why this might be useful – over a period of days I can keep my battery topped up without risking peak time electricity usage, and use it for local trips, knowing that it will be routinely topped up, but only with off peak electricity.

I participate in forums and Facebook groups and I know that there are many other users who need this feature to be implemented in the Tesla App and car. In the UK and Europe, we do not have the same sorts of tariffs that you enjoy in the US, and the start time for off peak cannot be assumed, as it varies by region.

Reply:

Thank you for the detailed explanation.

I understand the main issue here now.

As an interim solution, I advise you to choose the 'Schedule charging' option, while setting the charge limit accordingly (so for example if you want the car to stop charging after 5 hours, you can set the limit to around 60% and will achieve a similar result). I understand this is not the most convenient solution but hopefully will be of help in the meantime.

The interim solution won't cut it:

That is a bit hit and miss.

Prior to the latest update, the app would alter the start time in the scheduled charging tab according to the departure time and charge level / amperage so I could – with trial and error – manually see when it’d start (with departure time as the end time). Not ideal, a bit klunky but better than nothing. Since the car software has updated, it no longer changes the start time in the phone app, so I don’t have that option.

I have to fall back on guesswork which is less than ideal.

So I would appreciate it if you could get the proper schedule use case as described in my previous email into the development queue. This is more important to me (and others) than integrating another game that we won’t use. I’m looking at you, Sonic.

Please let me know how you get on, and what the outcome is of my request.

Reply:

Thank you for the clarification, I understand the inconvenience.

As I have mentioned, I have escalated this to our development team to consider for future updates.

Unfortunately, We will not be able to update on the outcome of this request specifically, but invite you to stay updated on our website.




So there we have it. The devs will get notified (hopefully a proper ticket will be raised) but we won't know if it's addressed until we see it in the app.

Good job! Hopefully someone will take notice.

I mean it’s not hard is it?!

Start time, end time. Job done!

 

[PhilN]

Ive just sent the following email to Tesla support - maybe if enough people email on this issue something might be done (or am I being to naive and hopeful?)

I took ownership of a new Tesla 3 in December 2021.
Why is it so complicated to try and schedule a start time and a stop time to coincide with off-peak electricity tariffs?
My electricity supplier has a 5 hr off-peak window starting at midnight ending at 5:00am. The only way I can currently do this is by calculating (approximately) how much battery charge can be added in that 5 hrs (10% per hour) and setting it each night according to the remaining charge in the battery at the end of each day - why not supply new teslas with a slide rule and abacus just make it really inconvenient?
Instead of pointless gimmicks like the S3XY lightshow, why not improve much needed functionality like a charge start and stop time (with a battery charge % limit option).
There are lots of comments on so many Tesla forums requesting this simple 'schedule a charge start and stop time' function - I can’t say I ever saw one where people were crying out for lights that flash with their music when the car is parked up!
Help!

 

[Adopado]

Ive just sent the following email to Tesla support - maybe if enough people email on this issue something might be done (or am I being to naive and hopeful?)

I took ownership of a new Tesla 3 in December 2021.
Why is it so complicated to try and schedule a start time and a stop time to coincide with off-peak electricity tariffs?
My electricity supplier has a 5 hr off-peak window starting at midnight ending at 5:00am. The only way I can currently do this is by calculating (approximately) how much battery charge can be added in that 5 hrs (10% per hour) and setting it each night according to the remaining charge in the battery at the end of each day - why not supply new teslas with a slide rule and abacus just make it really inconvenient?
Instead of pointless gimmicks like the S3XY lightshow, why not improve much needed functionality like a charge start and stop time (with a battery charge % limit option).
There are lots of comments on so many Tesla forums requesting this simple 'schedule a charge start and stop time' function - I can’t say I ever saw one where people were crying out for lights that flash with their music when the car is parked up!
Help!

I completely agree with you… but I’m just going to play devils advocate for a minute because I did actually have a couple of rare occasions where a fixed stop time would have been a problem. It made me wonder if this scenario is why Tesla decided not to offer a simple start stop.

Here’s what happened: my car was set with its start charging time as per my cheap rate. I had 50% battery and needed to leave first thing in the morning with close to 100% battery to be able to get to an appointment.

My car started to charge as normal and would easily be able to add 50% in the 4 hour window at 7+kW/32amp charging rate(M3 SR+). Except that unbeknownst to me my car picked up a voltage issue during the night and backed off the charge rate to 16amps. Of course the car took about 7 hours to charge and went beyond my cheap rate window. But… my car was ready with a full battery and I made my appointment. If the car had used a simple stop and start time I would have been in trouble! In that situation I would rather pay the higher rate and have the percentage needed than be left short.

This may mean that a stop start timer would be better not being too simple… it would need some conditional overrides available too.

 

[spdpsba]

Ive just sent the following email to Tesla support - maybe if enough people email on this issue something might be done (or am I being to naive and hopeful?)

I took ownership of a new Tesla 3 in December 2021.
Why is it so complicated to try and schedule a start time and a stop time to coincide with off-peak electricity tariffs?
My electricity supplier has a 5 hr off-peak window starting at midnight ending at 5:00am. The only way I can currently do this is by calculating (approximately) how much battery charge can be added in that 5 hrs (10% per hour) and setting it each night according to the remaining charge in the battery at the end of each day - why not supply new teslas with a slide rule and abacus just make it really inconvenient?
Instead of pointless gimmicks like the S3XY lightshow, why not improve much needed functionality like a charge start and stop time (with a battery charge % limit option).
There are lots of comments on so many Tesla forums requesting this simple 'schedule a charge start and stop time' function - I can’t say I ever saw one where people were crying out for lights that flash with their music when the car is parked up!
Help!

It is an American car for American customers mainly. Not sure how it will go down if for example Ford makes a 1.5l diesal Mustang just because diesel prices are expensive in UK.

Cheap tariffs are around 12 hrs in most of the states in US. I am not saying Tesla should apply the same logic but that’s the logic and they don’t want to make it more complex by introducing various conditions etc.,

Just applied the same logic of lift the pump, fill in the tank, pay and go!

 

[kelvin 660]

If you really need a STOP charge time then you can use an app to do that. For example, I use TeslaFi to stop charging (if charging) at 4:30 and it works perfectly...

 

[JonB]

If you really need a STOP charge time then you can use an app to do that. For example, I use TeslaFi to stop charging (if charging) at 4:30 and it works perfectly...

Third party apps come with their own set of issues, such as security risks and waking the car too often leading to battery drainage.

The functionality being requested is very basic in nature, and easy to implement even with the proposed overrides.

Tesla apologists should realise that replacing one set of inconveniences imposed by Tesla due to a myopic US-centric view of the world with another set is not an acceptable solution on a £50k car. @spdpsba they are exporting to the UK and should be mindful of UK conditions. Or are you saying, for example, that it is OK for FSD to not work with roundabouts, because we have them and the US doesn't? Is it OK for the auto wipers to be sub par, because it rains much less in California than the UK? Is it OK for the heat pumps to pack in at extremely low temperatures, because Canada is colder than Fremont? Can you see where I am going with this? We have to hold Tesla to account for this sort of thing - it's not good enough to say it's "the Tesla way" (not that you said this, but others have) as if it is some sort of excuse for all the issues with the car.

Only by holding them to account can we drive improvements in our market.

 

[spdpsba]

Third party apps come with their own set of issues, such as security risks and waking the car too often leading to battery drainage.

The functionality being requested is very basic in nature, and easy to implement even with the proposed overrides.

Tesla apologists should realise that replacing one set of inconveniences imposed by Tesla due to a myopic US-centric view of the world with another set is not an acceptable solution on a £50k car. @spdpsba they are exporting to the UK and should be mindful of UK conditions. Or are you saying, for example, that it is OK for FSD to not work with roundabouts, because we have them and the US doesn't? Is it OK for the auto wipers to be sub par, because it rains much less in California than the UK? Is it OK for the heat pumps to pack in at extremely low temperatures, because Canada is colder than Fremont? Can you see where I am going with this? We have to hold Tesla to account for this sort of thing - it's not good enough to say it's "the Tesla way" (not that you said this, but others have) as if it is some sort of excuse for all the issues with the car.

Only by holding them to account can we drive improvements in our market.

I am not going to answer all the other questions.

But just to give a perspective BMW never changed their indicator and wiper stalks (their placement) in other markets like India, Srilanka, Singapore, Thailand etc., (cars normally have the indicator (right) and wiper stalks (left) in these market). The only reason given is just to keep it simple in all cars BMW makes. I am not saying this is the right comparison. In fact it costs more to buy a standard BMW in India - around £50-60000 and then you can see drivers switching wipers on when they had to turn on indicator signals and vice versa! Then you have the audacity of Audi Qtron S (£90,000) charging extra £25 for cup holder next to the rear seat as an option pack as Germans generally stay away from using disposable plastic cups. These are things other car companies do all the time and not blown out of proportion,! but when Tesla does something for its primary market we blame Elon and then the whole discussion of auto wipers and headlights come up!

 

[Simonix]

But like all owners forums for different brands (non tesla), there are many threads with issues they have with their cars. These forum are all the same. I don’t think we are “blowing it out of proportion”.

What I have noticed on this forum which is different to other, is Tesla seems to have more “Fanboys” that will defend the brand to death against any negativity.

Tesla is more or less “unique” that they have the ability to update/change their programming to “improve” the end user experience. It’s a shame that Tesla do not embrace this, and actually use this in response to the owners and enthusiasts requirements in their global marketplace a bit better than they do currently.

 

[Adopado]

It is an American car for American customers mainly. Not sure how it will go down if for example Ford makes a 1.5l diesal Mustang just because diesel prices are expensive in UK.

I'm not sure that logic goes very far ... they do put the steering wheel on the other side of the car for us after all... and that's just a little bit more trouble and expense than an electronic timer!

 

[spdpsba]

But like all owners forums for different brands (non tesla), there are many threads with issues they have with their cars. These forum are all the same. I don’t think we are “blowing it out of proportion”.

What I have noticed on this forum which is different to other, is Tesla seems to have more “Fanboys” that will defend the brand to death against any negativity.

Tesla is more or less “unique” that they have the ability to update/change their programming to “improve” the end user experience. It’s a shame that Tesla do not embrace this, and actually use this in response to the owners and enthusiasts requirements in their global marketplace a bit better than they do currently.

Apple is more influential than Tesla but it will never ever change the decision regarding the imessage communication to Androids. It has an imessage lock and if you are not in their platform you can't have the advantage of read receipts, emojis, end to end security etc., The global consumer feedback to Apple has been damn negative when it comes to imessage but Apple will never embrace this. It is a pure business decision Apple has made. Why would you expect Tesla to behave in another way!.

I don't think 'fanboys' connotation is necessary here!

 

[spdpsba]

I'm not sure that logic goes very far ... they do put the steering wheel on the other side of the car for us after all... and that's just a little bit more trouble and expense than an electronic timer!

In a business you calculate and adapt so that the change you are making bring in more consumers and profit, Elon is intelligent enough to know that if he doesn't put the steering wheel on the other side of the car, he will lose not just in UK but other markets like Australia, Singapore, Hongkong, S Africa etc.,

 

[khyros]

Great, Elon has a great team of twitter advisers so sure they will bring this to his attention. The only issue is whether his team understands the significance of this. I was told rightly or wrongly the whole charging set up (both app and car) is setup with American market in mind. They have weird charging tariffs - something like 7am-7pm or something along those lines when the electricity is charged at reduced rate, so you generally do not need to give a start and end time. They connect the car and it will be in charger till they disconnect and the battery will be full. We poor Britain does not have that luxury and we have a 4hr window and I do not think Elon's team took that into account when they initially set up the charging unit. It is not a hard job to tweak this but I think it is something that did not cross the beautiful American minds!

I think the British energy market situation is not too disimilar to other countries. In Spain you have 3 or even 4 time periods, peak, off-peak, super-off-peak and night. often with 2-hour slots right in the middle of the day. It's totally crazy.

 

[JonB]

I am not going to answer all the other questions.

But just to give a perspective BMW never changed their indicator and wiper stalks (their placement) in other markets like India, Srilanka, Singapore, Thailand etc., (cars normally have the indicator (right) and wiper stalks (left) in these market). The only reason given is just to keep it simple in all cars BMW makes. I am not saying this is the right comparison. In fact it costs more to buy a standard BMW in India - around £50-60000 and then you can see drivers switching wipers on when they had to turn on indicator signals and vice versa! Then you have the audacity of Audi Qtron S (£90,000) charging extra £25 for cup holder next to the rear seat as an option pack as Germans generally stay away from using disposable plastic cups. These are things other car companies do all the time and not blown out of proportion,! but when Tesla does something for its primary market we blame Elon and then the whole discussion of auto wipers and headlights come up!

Yes, agreed some carmakers are sh1ts when it comes to pricing and extras. Nothing new there, and in this regard Tesla's model is great.

I raised the wipers as an example only - of where Tesla would do well to prioritise the efforts of the non-FSD development teams. Heaven forfend we should have another discussion about this particular failing.

For my part, I cannot see the logic of implementing that stupid light show feature in preference to something that is actually useful (such as fixing the auto wiper, or giving us a simple start / stop timer for the charge feature). Tesla appear to be focused on FSD development to the detriment of day to day usability. Or, put another way, it appears to me that their best developers are working on FSD and the inexperienced developers on everything else. It's the only way to explain the V11 UI.

 

[Adopado]

In a business you calculate and adapt so that the change you are making bring in more consumers and profit, Elon is intelligent enough to know that if he doesn't put the steering wheel on the other side of the car, he will lose not just in UK but other markets like Australia, Singapore, Hongkong, S Africa etc.,

My point is simply that Tesla makes the car to suit different markets. If that's the case ... and it is ... then a suitable timer that allows UK users to choose their cheap rate periods for charging seems reasonable to expect. Your point seemed to be that they make it for the American market so we can't expect UK specific needs to be catered for!

 

[spdpsba]

I think the British energy market situation is not too disimilar to other countries. In Spain you have 3 or even 4 time periods, peak, off-peak, super-off-peak and night. often with 2-hour slots right in the middle of the day. It's totally crazy.

I think I have said this before. Tesla tried to replicate what we normally do when we go to the forecourt - lift the pump, fill it, pay (not sure about that in Texas) and go. So what we have in Tesla at the moment is the closest to this activity. They are lucky that cheap tariffs runs for 12hrs or so in US. Btw, these things were set very early and they might need some sort of revisions or updates as Tesla is selling more in the global market since the launch of Model 3. But if there is a way to keep it simple for their primary market they will do that.

I am not sure what is the best way to keep it simple and introduce some conditions - may be app based - like apple watch complications - if you don't want to use it you don't have to touch it at all but people who wants it can create a set of conditions. So that the car will still keep it simple for the American market.

Tesla nod Khyros if I see you somewhere near Trumpington!

 

[spdpsba]

My point is simply that Tesla makes the car to suit different markets. If that's the case ... and it is ... then a suitable timer that allows UK users to choose their cheap rate periods for charging seems reasonable to expect. Your point seemed to be that they make it for the American market so we can't expect UK specific needs to be catered for!

No, I have explained @khyros what my point is!

 

[Dilly]

A ’simple’ on/off timer is what’s needed in the U.K. What we don’t need is Sonic the hedgehog etc.
my previous PHEV’s and EV’s all had them and carried out BMS during the timer period.
Fortunately, my Zappi handles the timing and most of my charge sessions terminate before the Zappi timer shuts off Power allowing BMS to operate.

 

[khyros]

I think I have said this before. Tesla tried to replicate what we normally do when we go to the forecourt - lift the pump, fill it, pay (not sure about that in Texas) and go. So what we have in Tesla at the moment is the closest to this activity. They are lucky that cheap tariffs runs for 12hrs or so in US. Btw, these things were set very early and they might need some sort of revisions or updates as Tesla is selling more in the global market since the launch of Model 3. But if there is a way to keep it simple for their primary market they will do that.

I am not sure what is the best way to keep it simple and introduce some conditions - may be app based - like apple watch complications - if you don't want to use it you don't have to touch it at all but people who wants it can create a set of conditions. So that the car will still keep it simple for the American market.

Tesla nod Khyros if I see you somewhere near Trumpington!

Gladly, as soon as I get my Tesla

 

[JonB]

Upcoming Tesla update will allow you to choose a custom car color

According to one of our sources, Tesla will soon allow you to pick a custom color for your vehicles. The custom color will be shown in the car visualization

www.notateslaapp.com

Couldn't make this sh1t up... they are putting out this kind of cr@p functionality for the tiny proportion of owners who have wrapped their cars, but we still can't have something as essential as start / stop charge scheduling.

 

[M3P_W8]

Tesla tried to replicate what we normally do when we go to the forecourt - lift the pump, fill it, pay

Not convinced that is the case, otherwise they wouldn't have implemented any scheduling functionality at all.... I can't imagine there are many who want to lift the pump, wait a while, then fill it and pay.

The fact that Tesla implemented some charge scheduling functionality suggests that they do acknowledge that there are people out there (me included) who want to choose the time when they charge. Just allowing a 'Start' time without having the option of a 'Stop' time seems like a half implemented scheduling solution to me.

Personally I'm not too bothered by all this as I am able to control my cheap electricity charging window using the scheduling functionality that my Andersen A2 charger provides.... it does, however, fail on occasions so I would personally like Tesla to add the ability for me to also set a charging stop time so I have redundancy in the system!