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ChargePoint FAST DC Chargers

Discussion in 'Model X: Battery & Charging' started by Oceanwolf, Nov 10, 2016.

  1. Oceanwolf

    Oceanwolf Oceanwolf

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    I have a ChargePoint CHaDeMo/Combo DC Fast Charger at work which is supposed to charge at 50 kwh. I use it with ChaDeMo adapter my charge rate is 40 kwh. Does any know if it is the car's limit or CHaDeMo limit?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. bkp_duke

    bkp_duke Member

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    It's a limit on the charging station most likely.

    I have a CHaDeMo that I use frequently and it hits the max 50kwh that the station is set to.

    Try a different station, preferably one that is known to operate at 50kwh for other users.
     
  3. Oceanwolf

    Oceanwolf Oceanwolf

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    Good idea, there are a couple of other Tesla owners using that station.

    ChargePoint.jpeg
     
  4. MP3Mike

    MP3Mike Active Member

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    How empty was your battery when you started?
     
  5. apacheguy

    apacheguy S Sig #255

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    Most Chaedmos are limited to 45 kW. At least that's the maximum rate I saw in my LEAF.
     
  6. Jeff N

    Jeff N Active Member

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    The "50 kW" rating is misleading because the actual power is dependent upon the design of the car's battery pack and the cell configuration within it.

    For example, the S90 battery cell configuration results in a higher pack voltage than the S60 configuration when both packs are at the same state of charge (like 50% or whatever). Higher states of charge also result in higher pack voltage so the pack voltage rises gradually while charging.

    The "50 kWh" charger is really limited to 125A so at a pack charging voltage of 320 that will give 320V x 125A or 40,000 Watts.

    An S90 charging at the same ChargePoint 50 kWh charger at the same state of charge will charge at a higher power at 125A than an S60 at 125A.
     
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  7. gaswalla

    gaswalla P4201/85/airsusp/pano/19i

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    That implies faster charging at higher soc. that would be untrue.
    To answer the op, your car can take 50kw,
     
  8. Jeff N

    Jeff N Active Member

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    Faster charging at higher SOC is absolutely true when the charger is amperage-limited like it can be with today's existing CHAdeMO/CCS chargers with cars with big packs that are capable of pulling higher power like a Tesla using a CHAdeMO adapter.

    Of course, when the battery gets closer to being full the battery will inherently be less capable of taking in power so eventually the power rate will ramp down. But in the earlier stage of charging on low amperage chargers you may very well so a gradual rise in charging power as the current is stuck at the chargers maximum 125A (for example) while the charging voltage gradually ramps up as the SOC goes up resulting in a gradual early ramping up of charging power.

    This commonly does not happen in a significant way today at Tesla Superchargers because their maximum amperage is near 400A rather than 125A and so is a much closer match to the maximum charging intake that today's battery packs are capable of absorbing.
     
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  9. Oceanwolf

    Oceanwolf Oceanwolf

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    I generally start with 50%, but it has nothing to do with the starting point. it starts with 40kwh and stays at that level until it gets to 85% and then goes down.
     
  10. Oceanwolf

    Oceanwolf Oceanwolf

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    It is true that CPE200 has a maximum 125A but it is @ 400-500V. Next time I am charging I will check if the voltage or the amper is limited.
    Here is the data sheet for CPE200.
     

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  11. Ulmo

    Ulmo Active Member

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    #11 Ulmo, Dec 17, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2016
    This 40kW happened to me when I tested my Chademo adapter for the first time () at the ChargePoint headquarters in Campbell, on my new Tesla Model S 60D with software limited 75 battery.

    Here's the SMS (Short Message System text messages on mobile phones) I got from ChargePoint:

    ChargePoint: ChargePoint: At 09:35 pm, the parking fee set by the property owner increases from $0.00/min to $0.10/min.
    ChargePoint: ChargePoint: At 09:35 pm, the parking fee set by the property owner increases from $0.00/min to $0.10/min.
    ChargePoint: The cost was $9.15 for adding 30.29 kWh. {{ <--- This was the Chademo "fast DC charger" (TeslaFi Charge 8)}}
    ChargePoint: The cost was $1.42 for adding 5.69 kWh. {{ <--- This was a J1772 charger (TeslaFi Charge 9)}}

    Here's the same charges on TeslaFi:

    Charge 8
    Address Started Ended Starting Level Ending Level kWh Used kWh Added Charge Efficiency Charge Cost Rated Miles Added Actual Time Estimated Time Odometer Delete
    [​IMG] 250 E Hacienda Ave, Campbell, CA 9:06 PM 9:52 PM 48 % 93 % 29.5 kWh 0.0 kWh 0.0 % $ 3.68 100.4 45 Minutes 49.8 Minutes 239.16

    Charge 9
    Address Started Ended Starting Level Ending Level kWh Used kWh Added Charge Efficiency Charge Cost Rated Miles Added Actual Time Estimated Time Odometer Delete
    [​IMG] 250 E Hacienda Ave, Campbell, CA 10:04 PM 10:57 PM 93 % 100 % 6.0 kWh 4.57 kWh 76.6 % $ 0.75 15.6 52 Minutes 49.8 Minutes 239.26
     
  12. TonyWilliams

    TonyWilliams Active Member

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    #12 TonyWilliams, Dec 25, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2016
    First, electrical power is delivered in kW, not kWh (which is units of energy).

    Power is:

    Amps * Volts = Power

    A * V = kW

    The Tritium Veefil charger that you were plugged into is capable of 125 amps

    The Tesla CHAdeMO adaptor is capable of 125 amps

    Your Tesla car is capable of 300 amps or more

    Therefore, your probable battery voltage between 300 and 380 volts in your Tesla with a 85-90-100kWh battery could provide the following:

    125A * 300V = 37.5kW (low battery voltage / low SOC%)
    125A * 380V = 47.5kW (high battery voltage / high SOC%)

    The above would also be true of the following cars: LEAF, Kia Soul EV, BMW i3, second generation Volt, Bolt EV, etc.

    The same 125 amp station charging a:

    1) Tesla Roadster can operate up to about 50kW (125A* 400V)

    2) Tesla 60-70-75kWh car can operate up to about 42.5kW (125A* 340V)

    ******************

    CHAdeMO specification is a battery between 50 and 500 volts at:

    125 amps max (typical 35-45kW, commonly referred to as 50kW, but 62.5kW capable)

    200 amps (max theoretical initial design = typical 60-80kW, up to 100kW capable)

    350 amps (typical 125-140kW, up to 175kW capable)

    350 amps * 1000 volts max = 350 kW (proposed summer 2016, likely 200-250kW typical)

    **************

    Typical EV max battery voltage is:

    354 volts (84 cells in series) - Mercedes B-Class ED / B250e, Tesla 60-70-75kWh cars

    386 volts (92 cells in series) - 2012-2014 Toyota RAV4 EV

    395-403 volts (96 cells in series) - almost every other car - LEAF, Kia Soul EV, all 85-90kWh Tesla, BMW i3, second generation Volt, Bolt EV, etc.

    416 volts (99 cells in series) - Tesla Roadster

    ***********
     
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