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Charger at Condo

Discussion in 'Hawaii' started by Richard Maui, Apr 28, 2016.

  1. Richard Maui

    Richard Maui Member

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    Just signed up. My Model S is being built, delivery June-early July on Maui. It took a year to get my condo association to agree to an EV charging station. The parking lot is outside, no assigned spaces, all common element. The AOAO agreed to a dual station ChargePoint Level 2 charger. Expected installation the end of May.
     
    • Like x 2
  2. spleen

    spleen Active Member

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    welcome!
     
  3. Akikiki

    Akikiki A'-Lo-HA ! y'all

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    Welcome. Sorry you had to wait so long. What did you learn about that process that you can share here? Was it that the HOA was completely against it? Did any Hawaii statute support your effort?
     
  4. Richard Maui

    Richard Maui Member

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    Hawaii statute 196-7.5 guarantees multi-family residents the right to install an EV charging station on or near their parking stall. At my condo, however, parking is outside and unassigned - all common element. The board did not believe the owners would approve installing the station since I was the only one requesting it at a 104 unit condo. I offered to pay for installation but that raised the question of who owns it and how I might be reimbursed when a second EV comes along, or a third, etc. The board decided to approve the installation at my expense subject to approval by the owners at our annual meeting in February. But the first person to discuss it at the annual said she didn't believe I should have to pay for it. After some discussion, the owners voted about 2-1 that the AOAO pay for the installation!

    Since the meeting Feb. 27 the wheels are in motion. Rising Sun Solar will install a Charge Point CT4021 Dual-stall EV charger which I believe is on its way by sea, as well as handle Maui County permits. They expect to have it in by the end of May. I ordered my Model S 70D on March 30 and have been advised delivery will be June-early July.

    I'm holding my breath that this will all go as planned and the installation will beat the delivery.

    By the way, Maui rents twice as many cars annually as Oahu but none are EV. When enough of the condos where people stay have charging stations, perhaps there will be EV rental cars.
     
    • Like x 4
  5. TaoJones

    TaoJones Beyond Driven

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    Congrats for prevailing! Nicely done, and welcome to the family.
     
  6. Akikiki

    Akikiki A'-Lo-HA ! y'all

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    Wow. I think you are lucky to live in an AOAO that is so generous and understanding. EV and support are new to so many people its refreshing to see a group of owners willing to be on your side.
     
  7. StephenM

    StephenM Active Member

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    That's an amazing story with fantastic result! Congratulations. I'm sure many future owners of EV's at your condo will have you to thank for your work. I'll bet it raises the prospects for future homeowners when shopping at your apartment complex and they may have to install more chargers to meet demand.
     
    • Like x 1
  8. dsmith2189

    dsmith2189 Active Member

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    At least someone is having luck getting a charger installed at their condo.:) It's been over three years since the board "approved" my charger installation and still no charger.:( (except for one unused and still in the box)
    since I live in a 40 story high rise that would require a new feed from HECO and new transformer for the entire building, it's not something I am going to pay for out of my own pocket. (unless someone has about $50K or $60K they want to give me;))
     
    • Informative x 1
  9. crikescrikes

    crikescrikes Member

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    Richard Maui
    Glad to hear you got approval for the charger. Did you request a Destination Charger from Tesla Motors? I believe they're still offering the hardware at no charge (free!!) to places of business (installation not included) -- not sure a condo unit would qualify, but it's worth asking. Rising Sun did a great job installing my DC in my carport and solar panels on my roof in Kahului -- very reliable company. (I would have preferred Solar City to do the install, but they're no longer on Maui.

    BTW, you're welcome to get a free charge in my carport (if your Tesla is delivered before the install of your ChargePoint) as a "welcome to the Maui Tesla Family gift". If you ordered the dual charger on your Tesla, you'll get about 1 mile per minute charge (59 mph) in my carport.
     
    • Like x 1
  10. Richard Maui

    Richard Maui Member

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    No, I never thought about asking for a Destination Charger. I believe the only one on Maui is at the Four Seasons Wailea.

    Rising Sun is apparently still waiting for county electrical permits before installing the charger which has now arrived from the mainland. My latest estimated delivery of the Tesla is June 21-July 5. It's going to be a race! (Thanks for the offer of a free charge - I may take you up on it!)
     
  11. Akikiki

    Akikiki A'-Lo-HA ! y'all

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    Its none of my business, but I don't understand how the Wall Connector (Destination Charger) is going to be connected or useful if Richard is having a Charge Point unit installed.
     
  12. crikescrikes

    crikescrikes Member

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    I mentioned it because a lot of businesses don't know of Tesla's free offer.

    A Destination Charger can be connected and could be useful....

    Tesla's Destination Charger comes with a 20' cord and could possibly reach to a 3rd parking spot, or even used as a back-up if the ChargePoint malfunctions (as it sometimes does).

    Also, in the future when Richard's AOAO members see his Tesla -- they'll be envious and it won't be long before they trade in their ICE for a Tesla. And those owners will soon be having another meeting to request approval of more charging stations. Keep in mind that a Destination Charger (at 59 miles of range per hour) is faster than some ChargePoint models - and unlike a DC, I can't imagine the ChargePoint hardware being free.

    I envision a future when Richard's condo will have a 3rd EV charging spot -- so it's good to let the Rising Sun electricians know about future plans so they could prep for future breakers & circuits, or install larger underground conduits to make future installs less costly.

    Another point to consider is that if other owners at that condo buy Leafs, it may cause inconvienent waiting lines for Richard. FYI: Leaf owners cannot connect to a Tesla Destination Charger (like Teslas not allowed to use Leaf's fast chargers on Maui). With EV's, especially Tesla, it's good to be proactive.

    Richard, your next assignment is to convince your association to get approval for PV panels above the parking stalls (similar to the one at Maui Humane Society, Hope Chapel, Maui Lani Industrial Park). :) Depending on the situation the PV system could be installed at no or low cost (ask Patrick Merril at Rising Sun).

    Richard, when your MS arrives, please respond to the thread "Maui Meet-up".
     
  13. Galve2000

    Galve2000 Member

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    This is my favorite part of the story. Everyone benefits from the placement of an EVSE, even if you don't have a car to charge. maybe your in-laws/friends do when they come visit. maybe the next owner will when you decide to sell. maybe you will AirBnB your place to a BEV driver. who knows...

    one thing not mentioned is who will pay for the electricity consumed in your case. i'm just curious.
     
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  14. crikescrikes

    crikescrikes Member

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    Dsmith2189: I'm curious which EV charger you have in the box that requires a new feed from HECO and a new transformer.

    A Tesla Destination Charger can be installed on a 50 amp circuit, but 100 is best (basically same as a clothes dryer outlet). Are you sure the board made the correct assessment? I'd consider getting a 2nd opinion -- maybe get advice from Tesla's Destination Charger Team (they are eager to get DC's installed throughout Hawaii, but just need businesses/parking lot owners to agree)

    I don't have all of the info, but a new feed from HECO and new transformer to serve the entire 40 story building seems extreme -- simply to add a circuit to handle a single clothes dryer?? Could the board president be jealous of your Tesla and is making it difficult for the install, or is a Tesla/EV hater -- cause he/she owns an ICE and hates paying the high cost of gas?

    If any electricians are reading this, please chime in. Thanks.
     
  15. Akikiki

    Akikiki A'-Lo-HA ! y'all

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    crikescrikes, You said to DSmith You were curious which EV Charger he had in the box. I am curious why you think we need EV Chargers. We only need electricity and/but the higher the amperage the better.

    I suspect you already know this, but this is one of those times - for other folks reading - where a little clarity is useful. A Destination Charger site might charge at 59 miles per hour. But only if the Wall Connector is connected to a 100 amp circuit. FYI, Destination Charger is the name given to a location that has a Tesla Wall Connector installed (formerly called a HPWC). By design the Wall Connector can be jumpered down so it can be used on a 50 amp or even 30 amp circuit - which of course is not going to charge at 59 miles per hour.

    The Destination-charging page on Tesla.com says: "Attract Tesla drivers to your property by joining the destination charging network. Qualified properties will receive their first two Tesla wall connectors free of charge as long as they are installed in visible or convenient locations". But anyone that didn't want to become a destination charging partner could simply buy their own Wall Connector and install it.

    During yesterday's annual stockholder meeting, 31 May, a question was asked 2:50:20 about wouldn't it make sense to have destination chargers at restaurants or some place to engage people. JB's reply was that Tesla would give Wall Connectors to businesses and places that would install it for use. And another person asked 3:17:00 Elon if a Destination charging location or company is permitted to charge for the electricity to recover the cost. Elon said that we don't have any issue with someone wants to get the Wall Connector and charge to use it.
     
  16. Galve2000

    Galve2000 Member

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    I have seen one of these destination charger agreements and the language used (forgive me I am paraphrasing here, I do not have a link to this agreement handy, but i will try to get one...) states that the destination will offer free or LOW COST use of the chargers. it does not specify what low cost means but it does leave the choice up to the establishment that provides the destination charger.

    in the typical agreement, Tesla provides 2 HPWC and 1 J1772 EVSE and I believe up to $1500 in installation costs per unit. -- now let me go find that link.

    here is some of the language from the agreement. Thank you google

    QUOTE

    Thank you for taking the time to write me. I’d be happy to have a call with you, just let me know what days and times are best and we’ll setup something up. In the meantime though, let see if I can address some of your questions. In supply stations through our Destination Charging, Tesla is not requiring any sort of contract or agreement to be signed. If the host property requests it, we can have a memorandum of understanding or a letter of intent drafted up, but it’s not anything that’s necessary on our end. Below you can find a little more information on the program as well as the offer that we typically extend to a qualified destination. Feel free to review it at your convenience and let me know if you have any questions at all.

    What Tesla is Offering: -
    Free Equipment:
    o Tesla is happy to provide as many free Tesla Connectors (“charging stations”) as you would like to host. These are Tesla-specific stations and are the best, quickest way to charge Tesla vehicles at your property.

    o We can also provide a universal connector for every two Tesla Connectors installed on site. While having the advantage of charging all electric vehicles, Tesla does not make these stations and they are roughly 2x slower at charging our vehicles than the Tesla Connector.
    o A normal installation would consist of two Tesla Connectors and the optional Universal Connector. We are happy to support a larger installation if you are interested in that.

    - Subsidy:
    o Tesla will provide up to $1,500 per connector toward the cost of installation. In most cases, this will cover 100% of the up-front costs to install the equipment. If you install the 3 connectors, as above, that would be a total subsidy of up to $4,500 from Tesla.
    - Publicity:
    o We are actively directing our owners to our partner locations through our Find Us page and on the 17" Touchscreen and Navigation in every vehicle.

    What the Host Property Contributes:
    - Access to the connectors for your patrons as a free or low-cost amenity
    - Ongoing electricity costs (about $1.00 for each hour of active charging).


    How to Start:
    - To start things off, we’ll need to get a quote from your local electrician to do the installation.

    o If you don’t have an electrician you normally work with, we may have one in your area we can recommend

    o If you’d like, we can speak directly with your electrician to explain the scope of work and electrical requirements. - Once the quote is ready, all of the information can be submitted through the following link:

    END QUOTE

    Sorry if the formatting is off.
     
  17. crikescrikes

    crikescrikes Member

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    Akikiki, that shareholder's meeting was great, wasn't it. I hope all future ones are that long.

    I only asked about dsmith2189's charger because "he" mentioned that he had a "charger" in a box unused. And I found it unusual that his charger required such an extreme upgrade. He mentioned he's been waiting 3 years since approval and "his charger" is still sitting in a box. I'm just trying to help.

    I'm aware Tesla's have single and dual chargers built into their cars, so technically you are correct to say we only need a source of electricity as you mentioned, not chargers. I'm aware Tesla calls them "connectors", but I was just calling it a charger because most people in the Tesla EV community refer to connectors as "chargers".

    Also, for those considering a HPWC or DC, keep in mind that you will only get the 59 MPH rate of charge if your Tesla is equipped with a dual charger AND the HPWC is on a dedicated 100 amp breaker AND the internal DIP switches are set accordingly (all 3 are required).

    Also for those considering buying a Tesla in Hawaii, I suggest the dual chargers - if it is still an option. Reason: Hawaii may never get a Tesla SuperCharger (which by-passes onboard chargers), so we need to rely on other sources of electricity. With a single charger I believe the max rate of charge is 29(?)mph regardless of the incoming amperage - amperage over 50 won't increase the rate of charge on a Tesla equipped with a single charger. <50 if fine for home, but not great for public chargers.

    RE: Charging a fee to use a DC -- The DC's don't have a lock, so it's basically an honor system if a place of business charges for electricity.

    IMO, chargers in public areas on a less than 50 amp circuit is almost a waste of time for a 70-90kwh battery. Fine for a non-Tesla, but not good for Teslas. If anyone is planning an install in a Public place I suggest you do whatever it takes to have a 100 amp dedicated circuit for each Destination Charging unit. You won't regret 59 mph (better than 5-9 mph charging rate -- which is what some public chargers offer). As Akikiki mentioned, the higher the amperage the better. (but higher than 50 for a Tesla equipped with a single charger is useless)
     
  18. David29

    David29 Member

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    Congratulations to the OP for his success in obtaining a charging facility at his condo! I also live in a condo and have been working on getting a charging station or outlet since last summer. I have tentative approval, but we are working through some legal and insurance issues. So i hope to share in your success soon!
     
  19. crikescrikes

    crikescrikes Member

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    Also for more clarity, I think it's important that owners know that just because a Destination Charging station is on a 100 amp circuit doesn't mean a 59mph rate of charge. The station needs to be on a dedicated 100 amp breaker AND ALSO HAVE DUAL CHARGERS onboard the Tesla -- which can be installed as an add-on after delivery if duals were not ordered with the car.

    I've heard comments from owners who were puzzled because their display during charging wouldn't exceed 30 mph when plugged into a wall connector on a 100 amp circuit. Solutions included correcting the DIP switch settings or installing a dual charger.

    Well informed buyers and well planned installations =Happy Charging!
     
  20. dsmith2189

    dsmith2189 Active Member

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    ok here is the short story.
    I got a Tesla charger when I bought my car 3 years ago. the board approved my installation even before I got my car.
    there is a 5 story parking structure (I park on the 4th floor) for my recently built condo.
    the only electrical for the parking garage is lighting and 110V plugs (common use) with a small electrical room on each floor.
    (all power that comes into the building runs through a large panel in the ground floor electrical room.)
    a SolarCity electrician and one from another company came to do a site survey. they monitored all possible power sources for an EV charger for 48 hours.
    the only circuit that had enough available power was the pool circuit. that was obviously not going to happen.
    the electrical capacity for the entire building was designed around the living units and there was no requirement for EVs when the building was designed.
    to safely upgrade the electrical capacity of a 5 story parking structure for X number of EVs (not just mine) needs a new feed and transformer as recommended by HECO, Solar City and the other electric company I spoke with.
    the building has also said they wanted to install public chargers (probably not free) for the commercial units as well.
     

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