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Charging Anxiety Log

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It's a chicken/egg thing, and I disagree with your expectation. Today if I'm running a company putting in chargers, why would I put in more expensive chargers that only Teslas can use when they will obviously prefer SuperChargers? Then, why would Ford or BMW owners want higher chargers when the stations only deliver 30 amps?
See the new strong of EVSE's going in up in Canada - all 70A. Because the marginal cost of installing a 30A EVSE vs a 70A one is tiny. The reason we have so many 30A ones is because of our stupid government putting 30A in the tax credit/grant thing they had the last couple years. So yes, free 30A vs paying for a 70A is a no-brainer but if you're paying for both the costs are not much different.
 
See the new strong of EVSE's going in up in Canada - all 70A. Because the marginal cost of installing a 30A EVSE vs a 70A one is tiny. The reason we have so many 30A ones is because of our stupid government putting 30A in the tax credit/grant thing they had the last couple years. So yes, free 30A vs paying for a 70A is a no-brainer but if you're paying for both the costs are not much different.

Why are they doing 70A and not 80A ? Are there too few 80A offerings on the market ? I know Clipper Creek has one, the CS-100.
 
Show me one non-Tesla non-exotic EV "on the horizon" that can charge at higher than 10kW/hour.

I don't believe there is going to be a high amperage AC charging network in the US.

If there is truly a market for BEVs with 300 mile range, then Tesla will not be the only supplier of such vehicles. Otherwise, the Model S will be perceived as an expensive niche product, and consumers who are not early adopters will be reluctant to buy.
 
If there is truly a market for BEVs with 300 mile range, then Tesla will not be the only supplier of such vehicles. Otherwise, the Model S will be perceived as an expensive niche product, and consumers who are not early adopters will be reluctant to buy.

Almost every one I talk to indicates that it's the 300 miles that turns the Model S into a real car and makes it worth considering. My take is the big hold up with EV acceptance is that you can't go on a trip, and an EV is a bit expensive for a "second" car (which is what short range EVs are).
 
A commuter car is often thought of as a "second" car.

However, people who own EVs find out that the EV is the "first" car, and the seldom used highway car is the real "second" car.

GSP
 
A commuter car is often thought of as a "second" car.

However, people who own EVs find out that the EV is the "first" car, and the seldom used highway car is the real "second" car.

Agreed, but I don't want to have to use an ICE car to go on trips, and no way will I rent a car for trips either. If I have to do either of those, then the EV is a second car (or worse, a substandard car)--even if I drive the EV more often.
 
It's simpler than that - they don't want to strand the Roadster owners. Even though there's only 57 of us, one of them is the founder of Sun Country Highway...

To hopefully clarify: The issue with the CS-100 (and other J1772 EVSE's that output 80A) is that there is a flaw in the Roadster that prevents it from "seeing" a pilot signal on a feed above 70A. I have this on good authority from @TomSax. So I checked with the aforementioned founder of SCH and he explained that they are aware of this, and have modified the firmware of all the CS-100's they have installed to accommodate Roadster owners for now. Eventually they expect to double up at many sites, and provide both CS-90's for Roadster owners and CS-100's for Model S owners, giving the maximum to everybody. Cool, huh!?

As a Roadster owner of 2+ years who has taken many road trips of much more than 300 miles (my in-laws live 450 miles away), I did order the twin chargers. I expect to road trip the Model S even more, since it is SO comfortable! Living on the west coast AND in Canada, our Model S will sit at the junction of the first two great electrified superhighways, I-5 and the Trans-Canada, so for BC owners, we have got LOTS of viable long road trips to take.

I also ordered the HPWC for really only two reasons-- 1) convenience of the wall hung appliance with the mobile charger ALWAYS in the car; 2) being hospitable to visiting Model S and X cars. We live in a very beautiful place and get lots of visitors. Increasingly, I expect those to include day visits from Tesla owners (ChadS, you know you are invited). :smile:
 
Club to get more chargers?

For instance, installing an HPC to share with fellow Tesla travelers is a great idea if you live in the right spot.
You know, I don't. :) Ithaca isn't actually on the most direct route from anywhere to anywhere, and I'm not in downtown Ithaca.

After realizing that I'll *never* want a fast turnaround at home from a long trip (I will always need to sleep for 10 hours!) I'm planning to install dual 14-50s -- one in my garage and one in my outdoor space -- so that I can take the car out of the garage when I'm using the garage for a painting project or something. But this also makes it easy to share the 14-50 with fellow Tesla travellers.

But it doesn't seem worth it to get an HPC just to share. It would make more sense to pay to have it installed somewhere more useful.... except, see below.

installing twin chargers "just in case" when there are no public charging stations putting out more than 50 amps in your state maybe aren't such good reasons.
This is indeed what I was thinking about. But if there seem to be rumors of planned high-amperage charging stations coming to Ontario... which I would use if they were in southwestern Ontario. And if *other* Tesla owners upstate installed HPCs which I could use, that would be most valuable to me.

Again, someone with an HPC willing to charge fellow Tesla owners on the road should start a sticky thread with approximate (not exact) location, and suggest contact via PM to schedule. I don't have an HPC and I'm far enough from main roads, or I'd start it. A private Tesla Owner HPC network would be a great thing, and eventually might become a reason to get the twin chargers.

Perhaps we should really consider starting this.

I sort of feel that I wouldn't be willing to install an HPWC as a pure act of charity, but I might be willing to do so as part of a *club*. That is, I'd consider installing an HPWC if:
(a) I knew other people would use it;
(b) other people installed HPWCs which *I* could and would use.

I'm already willing to let people use my NEMA 14-50, but on a long trip, an 8-10 hour stop to recharge could seem a bit... imposing, shall we say. A 4-5 hour stop is much more, shall we say, polite.

I see *just barely enough people* on the map to start creating a charging network for the trips I'd want to take. And I don't see fast charging, or public 60+ amp charging, coming to my area any time soon. I could get to Columbus, OH with stops in Oil City, PA (one pin on the map), Cleveland (5 pins), and Columbus (1 pin); or to Lansing, MI with stops in Rochester, NY (1 pin), the vicinity of Burlington, ON (5 pins), and the vicinity of Detroit (5 pins). If there were a deal between Model S owners which created a network which would make these trips possible, I'd do my part by installing an HPWC for the use of the other people.

I think I'm too antisocial to take the lead on starting such a club, even though I would find it valuable.

Though on the other hand (sigh), if we had such a club, it might make more sense to get public charging stations installed.

There seem to be no public chargers planned at more than 30 amps anywhere near where I am, unless Sun Country starts planting them in southwestern Ontario. (I emailed them to ask.)
 
I sort of feel that I wouldn't be willing to install an HPWC as a pure act of charity, but I might be willing to do so as part of a *club*. That is, I'd consider installing an HPWC if:
(a) I knew other people would use it;
(b) other people installed HPWCs which *I* could and would use.

I'm already willing to let people use my NEMA 14-50, but on a long trip, an 8-10 hour stop to recharge could seem a bit... imposing, shall we say. A 4-5 hour stop is much more, shall we say, polite.

<snip>

I think I'm too antisocial to take the lead on starting such a club, even though I would find it valuable.

Take a look at PlugShare, this basically does what you're suggesting. I've been registered there for a year or so. It works well except for the lady who asked if she could just park her Prius at my house while she walked to the local tourist spot (all the carparks were full).
 
Neroden, I'm from just NW of Pittsburgh, just where I-76 and I-79 meet, less than 2 miles from the exit. I travel up to Ithaca at least once a year, and hope to do so in Model S. You are welcome to use my HPC if I can use yours! Trouble is, I will likely need a Supercharger to make it up there, or an overnight stay at my Uncle's farm south of Buffalo, where he has a welder's NEMA 14-50.

Like most, I was really hoping to hear the Supercharger network news before I finalized...and am currently holding out until the end of Sep and my 30-day finalization window before doing so.
 
Neroden, I'm from just NW of Pittsburgh, just where I-76 and I-79 meet, less than 2 miles from the exit. I travel up to Ithaca at least once a year, and hope to do so in Model S. You are welcome to use my HPC if I can use yours! Trouble is, I will likely need a Supercharger to make it up there, or an overnight stay at my Uncle's farm south of Buffalo, where he has a welder's NEMA 14-50.
If we find the fellow on the map from Seneca, PA, we might be able to assemble something. :)

Like most, I was really hoping to hear the Supercharger network news before I finalized...and am currently holding out until the end of Sep and my 30-day finalization window before doing so.

Yep. I currently expect nothing from the Supercharger network. Even though I have told Tesla repeatedly that the place we need chargers is the big gap between Chicago and the East Coast, they seem intent on placing them uselessly on the coasts. Oh well.
 
Not to be a rumor-monger, but I explained the exact same thing to several Tesla reps, as I drive inter-city for business trips in the midwest, as opposed to a daily commute. I specifically explained that a network up and down both coasts was not helpful to me, and could even be a showstopper. While of course they didn't reveal anything about the network (and I don't even know what they might have known at the time), several responded with cryptic comments like "I think you will be pleasantly surprised when you hear the announcement".