Charging at New (old) House

[punkndisorderl]

I just moved from a newer home, which was a best case scenario for a charger install into an older house with close to worse case.

The house is 1950's with a detached garage. The panel is currently close to maxed out. So far, the bids I'm getting are in the $14k range. They involve a new panel, trenching across the yard, and installing the charger. A much as I love the car, I'm thinking going back to ICE makes more sense. Charging off 110 is a pain in the ass, and not setting I want to do long term.

Anyone run into this? Anyone find a workaround that I may not have thought of?

 

[Sophias_dad]

Need some more details about your panel/service/loads. Is there no way to avoid the trenching?

How much charge per hour do you really NEED? It seems a bunch of people think the only allowable current for an HPWC is 60 amps, which is just plain wrong. If you aren't going for an HPWC would 240V/15A be enough for you, and just use the appropriate adapter for the UMC.

 

[PianoAl]

Just brainstorming ... Can you get the car closer to the main house and charge outdoors?? Extending the driveway might be cheaper than $14k. See threads on extension cords.

 

[PianoAl]

How many miles do you drive per day and how close is a supercharger?

 

[punkndisorderl]

Wow, good responses! Thanks guys.

Nearest supercharger is about 10 miles, but it's in a direction I rarely go. So it would be an intentional trip every week.

I probably need to pay better attention to my current usage. It's changed a lot with the recent move.

I'd prefer charging in the garage, but outside on the side of the house would maybe save trenching. The panel will still have to be upgraded. It was already peaking out causing flickering until the AC was replaced last week.

Trenching would be mandatory to actually use the garage for charging. And the existing electrical there already has issues (110 charger won't charge due to insufficient grounding).

 

[GtiMart]

On top of what Sophias_dad said, You might be able to dig the trench yourself and pass the proper exterior/underground wire in the appropriate way for your local code. The electrician would simply verify and do the plugging which should cost way less. I've done that for pool installations for example. I had called the electrician beforehand and gotten the proper information from him so I installed exactly to code : wire type and awg, in plastic conduits or not, trench depth etc.

 

[Sophias_dad]

On top of what Sophias_dad said, You might be able to dig the trench yourself and pass the proper exterior/underground wire in the appropriate way for your local code. The electrician would simply verify and do the plugging which should cost way less. I've done that for pool installations for example. I had called the electrician beforehand and gotten the proper information from him so I installed exactly to code : wire type and awg, in plastic conduits or not, trench depth etc.

There's also the Bullet Mole Horizontal Drilling, Boring, Trenching, and Piercing Tools and things like it. Totally avoid trenching except a bit at each end.

 

[Marty3SR+]

FWIW, my wife's work is about 25 miles away, and we have been charging off level 1, 12 amps at 120v for 1.5 years (about 15,000 miles). We can fully recharge overnight, but don't need to because we can usually catch up on weekends. But if we need more, we just make a trip to a nearby supercharger, at a shopping center a mile or two away, and do some walking/shopping for a half hour. So, depending on your schedule/mileage, you might find you can get along OK as long as you plug in whenever you park. We recently went to a time of day plan, and can't start charging til midnight, so we can't really fully charge each night, but it hasn't been much of a problem.

Our house is also 1950s without any more panel capacity, although the panel is in the garage. Unfortunately, a new panel needs to be outside the garage, so it's still not very cheap.

 

[punkndisorderl]

On top of what Sophias_dad said, You might be able to dig the trench yourself and pass the proper exterior/underground wire in the appropriate way for your local code. The electrician would simply verify and do the plugging which should cost way less. I've done that for pool installations for example. I had called the electrician beforehand and gotten the proper information from him so I installed exactly to code : wire type and awg, in plastic conduits or not, trench depth etc.

I'm down in Houston, and not exactly in shape. We're I younger, I'd be tempted. As it is, they'd end up burying me in that trench with the Houston heat.

 

[davewill]

There seem to be two items that are contributing to the big price tag. One is the long trench, the other is the maxed out panel. You might inquire about doing a 240v 20a circuit. If that would fit inside your current panel's capacity, that could be a more economical choice for you. You can expect to charge about three times faster than the regular 120v 15a plug you've been using.

As far as the trench, you be able to save money by hiring some day laborers to dig it rather than having the electrician do it. You can also rent power tools designed to do that specific job.

 

[PianoAl]

might inquire about doing a 240v 20a circuit. If that would fit inside your current panel's capacity, that could be a more economical choice for you.

Right. Let's say you average 100 miles per day. You could recharge in less than seven hours each night. And lower amps means a cheaper extension cord. Even 200 miles per day would be doable.

 

[ambudriver03]

I just moved from a newer home, which was a best case scenario for a charger install into an older house with close to worse case.

The house is 1950's with a detached garage. The panel is currently close to maxed out. So far, the bids I'm getting are in the $14k range. They involve a new panel, trenching across the yard, and installing the charger. A much as I love the car, I'm thinking going back to ICE makes more sense. Charging off 110 is a pain in the ass, and not setting I want to do long term.

Anyone run into this? Anyone find a workaround that I may not have thought of?

I live in a house that was built in 1957 (Southern California), and has/had essentially your same problem

60amp service drop connected to a detached garage, has a 30 amp subpanel on the house which connects to the garage through some #10 in through some pathetic 1/2" metallic conduit.
The garage is about 20 actual feet from the house, but there's about 50' of line that connects through the crappy conduit, and across 18' of concrete patio.



. And for similar work was also quoted $14,000 (about 3y ago) for a similar project. (service change at main to 200 A, 125 A panel upgrade at house, demolition of concrete, trenching and about 50' of #2 THHN through 1.5" conduit (they wanted to do 1" conduit using #4 at lower power), then a concrete repour, etc.
(we also found out there's a buried gas line (to disconnected and capped pool heater) along with a 1" water line for the pool.
If any of those got damaged we were looking at 20k instead of 14k best case.

The only thing we had going for us, is that our house doesn't have central AC due to the 30amp supply constraint and have all gas appliances.

Confirmed with the utility and electrician that we actually have 100 amp supply, so the limitation initially was just mechanical, also did a load Calc, and our peak consumption prior to install of electric car charger was only about 3500W (and that is if pool pump, plus microwave, and all the fans in the house running)

TLDR : Ended up putting a 14-50 on the outside of the garage (connected with #6 romex) to the main panel. And then connect. To the car with 100' 50 amp RV extension cord. All in about $1200. Leaving the patio tear up and trenching for another day.

Even when the tesla is charging full till at 40 amps (corded mobile connector) we only draw 10.5kw from the main service, so not in danger of overloading our 60 AMP main panel. Voltage sags to about 228 when under full load.