Later in that article they talk about it as being a rather small change, something in the territory of a 10% restriction. It seems people with the substantially slower rates have something entirely different going on.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
islandbayy
Active Member
Thanks for the Tag
Here's some Thermals ^v^First is with my old MS60
I dont seem to have any thermals while supercharging my 90D, But I can this Friday.
Also, anyone have any requests?
I'll be supercharging today for the first time since the fix. I'll of course post my results
navinsiri
Member
My car has the same behavior. Goes up to about 95kW (75kWh battery max) and then quickly goes down to ~50% kW for the rest of the charging session. I've checked and both the louvers are open and the fans are sometimes running at full speed. I brought this up to my service center and they said they can't find anything wrong. I called Tesla support and they claimed that the 4 different supercharging stations I went to have reported power issues (complete BS). These stations I tried spanned over 3 states. I really hope Tesla fixes this soon.
On a side note, I was supercharging yesterday and the car held at 96kW for about 10 minutes which is the most I've ever seen, but it dropped down to 50kW soon after.
As for the hot handle issue, I supercharged today in the heavy rain and with all that water running down the handle and the cable there's no way it could've gotten hot, yet my charging speed never went over 60kW.
On a side note, I was supercharging yesterday and the car held at 96kW for about 10 minutes which is the most I've ever seen, but it dropped down to 50kW soon after.
As for the hot handle issue, I supercharged today in the heavy rain and with all that water running down the handle and the cable there's no way it could've gotten hot, yet my charging speed never went over 60kW.
Supercharged tonight starting at 25% (would rather have tested from 15% but that is the lowest I could get the battery unless I drove in circles).
Both louvers opened up and the charging did not plummet like it has been. It started at 116KW and slowly worked its way down into a nice gradual taper.
The problem is the taper curve was about 12KW less than it was when the car was new back in April of 2015 and it started sooner at like 32% vs 40%. By the time the battery hit 50%, the louvers had closed back up and the battery temperature had dropped from 114F to 106F (average) yet the charging remained 12KW less at each SOC % than it was when new.
This isn't like the hugest deal. It means my charging took about 7 minutes longer than it would have had it held the original curve.
Really starting to wonder if the 85s also have the charge limit counter and if I've hit it.
Also, the battery temperature spread is odd. Every other string was 10F from every other string. i.e. the spread was 10F and all all the odd strings were like 100F and the evens like 110F.
I'll post graphs and screen shots tomorrow. Need to sleep now.
Also, even though it was night, the handle was quite warm. I'll try again when I've got a few cooling packs to put on the handle.
Both louvers opened up and the charging did not plummet like it has been. It started at 116KW and slowly worked its way down into a nice gradual taper.
The problem is the taper curve was about 12KW less than it was when the car was new back in April of 2015 and it started sooner at like 32% vs 40%. By the time the battery hit 50%, the louvers had closed back up and the battery temperature had dropped from 114F to 106F (average) yet the charging remained 12KW less at each SOC % than it was when new.
This isn't like the hugest deal. It means my charging took about 7 minutes longer than it would have had it held the original curve.
Really starting to wonder if the 85s also have the charge limit counter and if I've hit it.
Also, the battery temperature spread is odd. Every other string was 10F from every other string. i.e. the spread was 10F and all all the odd strings were like 100F and the evens like 110F.
I'll post graphs and screen shots tomorrow. Need to sleep now.
Also, even though it was night, the handle was quite warm. I'll try again when I've got a few cooling packs to put on the handle.
These are smart cars. Seems to me that they "know" when something is amiss and it's better/safer to charge slower. Almost all data points here point to temperature being the #1 culprit.
But these recent posts start to point to degraded charging with colder temps. I can't figure it out.
After really studying the cooling schematics in both parallel and series modes, it also seems as if the louvers just don't play a part. They seem to be only affecting the cabin cooling. Weird.
But these recent posts start to point to degraded charging with colder temps. I can't figure it out.
After really studying the cooling schematics in both parallel and series modes, it also seems as if the louvers just don't play a part. They seem to be only affecting the cabin cooling. Weird.
I'm copying what I posted on another similar thread. May or may not be applicable here for some.
Has there been any clarification on Supercharger throttling...
I have a data point to share. I was supercharging my P90D the other day with the pack around 15% full. The rate was 55-60kW and I couldn't get it any higher. Tried several stalls. I wound up just picking a stall and waiting at the slow rate.
At around 30-35% full (still charging at 60kW), an electrician pulled up with a bunch of supercharger stall parts so I asked him what he was doing. He said he was replacing the cables on the superchargers. I told him that all of the stalls are charging slowly right now and he said "these stalls have the original cable design. The ones I'm installing have over 10 revisions internally and this should fix your slow charging rate." I unplugged, moved my car away, and he installed the new cable in my stall. Took about 15 minutes. I pulled back in, plugged in and immediately got 110kW. No other cars there, no other changes except for the cable.
I have a lot of experience at this supercharger and prior to the new cables, I would consistently see low charge rates...sometimes as low as 40kW even with a low battery charge. After the new cables, every single stall gives me >100kW.
Has there been any clarification on Supercharger throttling...
I have a data point to share. I was supercharging my P90D the other day with the pack around 15% full. The rate was 55-60kW and I couldn't get it any higher. Tried several stalls. I wound up just picking a stall and waiting at the slow rate.
At around 30-35% full (still charging at 60kW), an electrician pulled up with a bunch of supercharger stall parts so I asked him what he was doing. He said he was replacing the cables on the superchargers. I told him that all of the stalls are charging slowly right now and he said "these stalls have the original cable design. The ones I'm installing have over 10 revisions internally and this should fix your slow charging rate." I unplugged, moved my car away, and he installed the new cable in my stall. Took about 15 minutes. I pulled back in, plugged in and immediately got 110kW. No other cars there, no other changes except for the cable.
I have a lot of experience at this supercharger and prior to the new cables, I would consistently see low charge rates...sometimes as low as 40kW even with a low battery charge. After the new cables, every single stall gives me >100kW.
The system diagram shots are from an active diagnostic session and show different flows depending on the state.
Folks are confusing the passive radiator in the middle which coolant passes through during passive cooling and the condenser radiators that refrigerant passes through.
Those radiators are part of the HVAC system for cooling but that system serves the cabin AND/OR the coolant chiller. i.e in active cooling of other vehicle systems, the valves in the system can be turned or directed in many many combinations. The coolant can be isolated in multiple ways so that some systems can be passively cooled, actively heated, or actively cooled independently. For instance, the stator could be actively heated while the battery is actively cooled, or passively cooled. It all depends on what each system needs.
It's all actually very clever without being too complicated.
Folks are confusing the passive radiator in the middle which coolant passes through during passive cooling and the condenser radiators that refrigerant passes through.
Those radiators are part of the HVAC system for cooling but that system serves the cabin AND/OR the coolant chiller. i.e in active cooling of other vehicle systems, the valves in the system can be turned or directed in many many combinations. The coolant can be isolated in multiple ways so that some systems can be passively cooled, actively heated, or actively cooled independently. For instance, the stator could be actively heated while the battery is actively cooled, or passively cooled. It all depends on what each system needs.
It's all actually very clever without being too complicated.
Huh. Bend seems like a fairly new one, opening in June 2016. I'm surprised the cables/handles are considered that old and were having problems already.
islandbayy
Active Member
It doesn't just need to be the car thats hot, it can also be the supercharging cabinet. It also seems to be completly random. I get the same issue here. Move over a stall and it's fine, go back to problem stall the next day and it's fine, or the fast stall and it's slow, move to the problem stall from the day before and it's fine again....
Some more that might be helpful.
Some more that might be helpful.
This is consistent with my findings after completing over 6000 miles of supercharger travel in the past month and a half. During the hottest times I had some success with cooling of the handle providing better duration of higher charge rates but found that the more worn the handle the more likely the charge rate would fall rapidly. It seemed to me to be totally related to contact wear, even though the handle itself did not feel hot I found that the contact area was heating up very quickly.
These results were very clear at Catoosa, OK. I was the only person there and my charge ramped up to 110 kW but started falling rather quickly into the 50's so I switched to the next stall. Ramped right up to around 110 but quickly fell into the 30's! In both cases the contact area of the handle was hot in minutes. I started looking at all the handles and found the handles on the rear row of charges looked brand new as opposed to the worn, scuffed handles of the front row. I moved back to a new handle location to get a charge rate of over 100 kW for as long as I have ever seen that rate.
Even when my car was new, the most it would charge at 60% was 72KW:
59% - 74 KW
60% - 72 KW
61% - 70 KW
62% - 68 KW
63% - 66 KW
64% - 65 KW
65% - 64 KW
Got distracted for a minute or two
67% - 60 KW
68% - 59 KW
70% - 58 KW
71% - 56 KW
72% - 55 KW
73% - 54 KW (2 KW more than before)
74% - 53 KW
Then last night after my cooling louvers were fixed, this is what I charged at (battery was 106F most of the time), I only got 60KW at 60%. At least I'm not dropping to 65KW within 2 minutes of plugging in which I did when my louvers were broken and the battery climbed to 115F and charging dropped like a rock. I lived with it like that for months before I finally wised up and realized it wasn't just degraded superchargers in california. I wonder how much damage I've done to my battery heating it up a dozen or so times to 115F while charging.
Anyways, the data from last night. Didn't drop like a rock but this curve is way less charge than when the car was new.
26% - 116KW
27% - 116
28% - 116
29% - 114
30% - 112
31% - 109
32% - 108
33% - 106
34% - 104
35% - 102
36% - 101
37% - 99
38% - 97
39% - 95
40% - 93
41% - 92
42% - 90
43% - 88
44% - 87
45% - 85
46% - 84
47% - 82
48% - 80
49% - 78
50% - 77
51% - 75
52% - 74
53% - 72
54% - 70
55% - 68
56% - 66
57% - 65
58% - 64
59% - 62
60% - 60
61% - 59
62% - 58
63% - 57
64% - 56
65% - 55
66% - 54
67% - 53
So at 67%, I'm pulling 53KW at 106F and you're pulling 78KW at 112F. That's a huge difference.
navinsiri
Member
I stopped at a different supercharger (Allentown,PA) today at night while it was nice and cool outside. I arrived with 15% and the car charged at 95kW and stayed there until it began to taper down normally. So definitely an issue with some stations or their inability to keep cool. I noticed that the handle at the Allentown charger only got slightly warm even after charging at 95kW for a while, meanwhile the car was cooling the battery at full speed. At the chargers where I experienced the slow charging, the handle was almost too hot to touch even when just charging at 50kW and the fans were not needed to keep the battery cool.
Either new cables with better thermal management were installed or the handles simply get too hot by being in the direct sunlight.
Either new cables with better thermal management were installed or the handles simply get too hot by being in the direct sunlight.
Similar threads
- Question
