Charging strategy in cold climate?

[SSedan]

I live near Green Bay, 2014 P85 charged at 24amps on 30amp circuit, parked outside and work is completely exposed to winds, commute is all of 7miles each way, sometimes a lunch trip or errands after work.

I hate the way the car drives with Range Mode on in winter, the power limited and lack of regen defeat the joy of driving this car.

I try to set the car to finish charging before I leave but on the 30amp circuit outdoor temperature makes this hard to plan. Outdoor temp and how much heating needs to happen has a BIG effect on charging time with the small circuit.
How big a difference will I see installing a 50amp outlet? I have most of the parts but not eager to tackle this project this time of year when the 30amp is functioning.

Anyone think it would be better to just turn off scheduled charging and let it charge while the pack is warmish from evening errands and the drive home, and just have the morning preheat to make the car comfortable? Think this might actually be more efficient than letting the evening errand heat go to waste, then heat the battery middle of the night to charge, then sometimes have it heat again before leaving. Would get me down to just two warming events per day before and after work instead off trying with mixed success to get the middle of the night heating to carry over to before work

 

[Chaserr]

Anyone think it would be better to just turn off scheduled charging and let it charge while the pack is warmish from evening errands and the drive home, and just have the morning preheat to make the car comfortable?

Do this. Charging is better on a warm battery, and then just preheat the car so it's both comfortable and the battery is warming up as well. Turn off range mode, it hurts winter driving by lowering the temperature of your battery's heater.

 

[JHWJR]

A couple thoughts.

First, you don't have to use range mode on a 7 mile commute. Heat your car, heat your seats, heat your steering wheel, heat your windshield, heat your wipers, heat your rear window while turning of "range mode." It's 7 miles.

Absolutely charge when you get home while your battery is warm. That will give you the fastest, most efficient charging. Charge to 70 percent or maybe 80 percent. Then, first thing when you wake up, from your phone, turn your charging up to 90 percent to warm your battery and turn on climate control to warm the interior and take your shower. Your car should perform outstanding by the time you get in it in an hour.

A 50 amp outlet will do all these things better, but I'll bet that it's unnecessary. Entirely unnecessary. I'd be interested in hearing back from you, though, as Green Bay is a rather extreme use case.

 

[ReddyLeaf]

WTF, why bother charging to 80% or 90% when you’re driving 7 mi????? Charge to 50% and you will have regen And plenty of range. Crazy, I charge my 2011 Leaf between 50-80% for my 8 mi commute.

 

[SSedan]

WTF, why bother charging to 80% or 90% when you’re driving 7 mi????? Charge to 50% and you will have regen And plenty of range. Crazy, I charge my 2011 Leaf between 50-80% for my 8 mi commute.

I don't think you quite understand what the cold does to range on short trips. If I charge to 80% when I get home which is about 202miles it will be maybe 196 when I get up in the morning part from overnight power use and part from just the battery being cold.
Today it was single digits in the morning but is 30f now(warming trend starting today). 15minute warmup 7 miles to work, 30minute phone call/lunch in parked car, and15minute warmup and 7 mile drive straight home 161 miles left, had it been colder out or had I actually left on lunch can easily be down into the 140s, and if I have errands can go into the 130s without driving 30miles. Easily consumes double rated miles in cold weather.

I was thinking it would be wasteful to start warming the car when I get up in the morning, but I think all I am doing by warming for just 10minutes is draining the battery, will be more efficient for me to warm it up on the wall rather than let the heater drain the pack while driving in to work.

Sort of wish there was a middle ground between range mode on and off, I have seen it said range mode can compromise battery longevity via reduced thermal management and have been presuming that was on both ends of the scale. Is that right?

Guess what I am asking is is the extra discharge cycling of using the heater when not plugged in better or worse than running the battery cold? Range mode discussion is about not running the pack heater and needlessly consuming discharge cycle, more worried about long term battery health than a few bucks on my electric bill.

I figured with 90% being the high end of "daily" going to 80 I was treating the battery well, is there advantage to lowering that to 70% or lower?

 

[kg7jo-]

I don't think you quite understand what the cold does to range on short trips. If I charge to 80% when I get home which is about 202miles it will be maybe 196 when I get up in the morning part from overnight power use and part from just the battery being cold.
Today it was single digits in the morning but is 30f now(warming trend starting today). 15minute warmup 7 miles to work, 30minute phone call/lunch in parked car, and15minute warmup and 7 mile drive straight home 161 miles left, had it been colder out or had I actually left on lunch can easily be down into the 140s, and if I have errands can go into the 130s without driving 30miles. Easily consumes double rated miles in cold weather.

I was thinking it would be wasteful to start warming the car when I get up in the morning, but I think all I am doing by warming for just 10minutes is draining the battery, will be more efficient for me to warm it up on the wall rather than let the heater drain the pack while driving in to work.

Sort of wish there was a middle ground between range mode on and off, I have seen it said range mode can compromise battery longevity via reduced thermal management and have been presuming that was on both ends of the scale. Is that right?

Guess what I am asking is is the extra discharge cycling of using the heater when not plugged in better or worse than running the battery cold? Range mode discussion is about not running the pack heater and needlessly consuming discharge cycle, more worried about long term battery health than a few bucks on my electric bill.

I figured with 90% being the high end of "daily" going to 80 I was treating the battery well, is there advantage to lowering that to 70% or lower?

Battery will have best lifespan when stays at 50%, it's unnecessary to charge to 80% or 90% when you only have 7 miles commute. even when the consumption triples in cold weather, there isn't much need to charge it to 80%. my commute is 10 miles each way, and I usually charge it to 60%. in hot summer day, i get back home with 50% left. in cold winter days, I usually come home with about 47% left. that way, your battery will stay around 50% for the most time. i usually charge my car an hour before I leave home, cuz it usually takes about 55 min to charge it used for commute. and my battery is warm enough to have full regen.

 

[SSedan]

Thank you, I didn't realize there was benefit to keeping it lower. Figured since 90% was listed as cap for daily 80% was solidly below.

Only bought in August so this is my first winter.

 

[Evbwcaer]

It is my understanding, which is not coming from any sort of expert, that driving on a cold battery is fine...because the car limits how much charge can go in or out accordingly.

It’s totally possible that the charge restrictions lead to “less” degradation, vs, “no” degradation.

Is it correct that having range mode on reduces the amount of energy going into heating the battery?

Just one data point, my 2014 S85 with 56,000 miles charges to 256/7miles, and was 262 when new. I live in Minneapolis, the car lives in an unheated, attached garage. I don’t know if we’re colder than GB but it’s cold either way, the car goes through long stretches below freezing, just coming off two weeks, as well as fairly extreme events, like 150 miles drives at -20f that terminate in the cold garage.

I have always just tried to reduce heating cycles by either charging asap when I get home at night or timing it in the AM. For the AM charging, which I do less often, I just kind of take a guess at what the rate will be. For my situation it is not important if I have 180 vs. 200 miles, for example.

I hope my ramblings are helpful.

 

[SSedan]

My sister lives in Coon Rapids climate is identical for the sake of this conversation. I lowered daily charge limit to 70% and will keep charging soon as I get home. Only charged 100% once and got about what you have, might have been 257 and my car was over 65K at the time and best I know lived in Madison WI before I bought it so again same climate.