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charging with 240v / 60A, J1772 connector

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by bellwilliam, Feb 18, 2013.

  1. bellwilliam

    bellwilliam Member

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    buying a L2 charger for my office. I have an option of buying either a 240v/40a or 240v/60a, both with J1772 connector (We have other EVs). would Tesla S accept a faster charger of 60a ? I do have twin charger option.

    for ones with single charger, my guess it should also charger a little faster, not much, but ~25% ?

    think it should, but didn't see 60a as an option on Tesla's charging web page.
     
  2. bluetinc

    bluetinc Member

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    Yes, it will charge 50% faster. The S with twin chargers will charge up to 80A at 250V. Personally I think that all J1772's installed from now on should be 80A, but that's a bit OT :)

    Peter
     
  3. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Having spent "quality time" with 8 J1772 stations (Burlington, Bellingham, Sultan, Skykomish, Leavenworth, Wenatchee, Ellensburg, Snoqualmie Pass) this weekend, I can say with confidence "30A sucks" for roadtrips. AeroVironment and ChargePoint need to seriously consider upgrading those stations.

    Sidnote: Tesla PLEASE solve the "I'm sitting at a Roadster HPC and/or CHAdeMO while on the road and it's utterly useless for my Model S" problem. Over this same weekend, there were at least 3 of those that made me cry inside.
     
  4. GeekGirls

    GeekGirls Kid in Candy Store

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    When I took delivery a friend asked about getting an adapter for his Roadster HPC to use when I visit. We were told that Tesla engineering makes them by hand to order as a cable rather than a simple unit like the J1772 adapter, and that they're $500 each. Presumably this is what the Tesla retail sites use, though I never wind up at Santana Row when a charger is available so I have yet to see one firsthand. It doesn't sound entirely practical for what you have in mind. Hopefully the CHADeMO situation is more straightforward.
     
  5. jomo25

    jomo25 P4398

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    So, to confirm, a MS with single charger will still only draw 40A from a 60A capable J1772 station, right? Only a MS with twin chargers can use the full 60A?
     
  6. Lloyd

    Lloyd Active Member

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    That is correct
     
  7. Jason S

    Jason S Model S Sig Perf (P85)

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    Somebody in another thread suggested using the ??? (I don't remember the name) cable replacement for the Roadster HPC to J1772. I've used one and it is very nice.
     
  8. Sparrow

    Sparrow S105/ Roadster 189

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    Are you quoting these EVSEs by their breaker size or by their actual output. A ClipperCreek CS40 is wired with a 40 amp breaker but only puts out 32 amps. So my initial thought while seeing your 40 and 60 amp units is that they ou put 32 and 48amps respectively. Thus on the 60 amp unit the single charger car would charge at 40 amps while the dual charger car would charge at 48 amps.
     
  9. bellwilliam

    bellwilliam Member

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    that's what I also asked in the original post. it seems double charger only charges 20% faster than a single charger with a 60 amps.
    my plan is to purchase a ClipperCreek CS60 with 60 amp breaker (for my office, which also charges another EV at 32amp). which should charge at 48 amps in my double charger S.

    I could also just use the standard Tesla UMC....but at 40 amps ?
     
  10. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    That's correct. Using your UMC would limit you to 40A but using the CS60 with the twin chargers and your J1772 adapter would get you the 48A.
     
  11. Trnsl8r

    Trnsl8r Blue 85kwh since 12/8/12

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    There is also one next to the supercharger at Harris Ranch. I used it for opportunity charging while the sole supercharger there was busy. I was seeing 60-70A on the dashboard, but still only get about 31-35mph charging. I do have twin chargers. Seemed slow to me... :confused:
     
  12. bluetinc

    bluetinc Member

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    Did you note the voltage that you where charging at? If it was say 200V (rather than an ideal 250V), you would see between 35-45 mph charging without losses.

    Peter
     
  13. Trnsl8r

    Trnsl8r Blue 85kwh since 12/8/12

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    This was a while back, but I want to say no more than 200V. (I really should read up on volts and amps...)
     
  14. bluetinc

    bluetinc Member

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    This sounds like you are seeing exactly the correct numbers for what they are providing. (Personally I hope that charging station apps start listing both the available voltage and current to provide people a good sense of how fast they are going to charge when they get there).

    The total power available to charge from is Volts * Amps, so low voltage from a charger station really slows you down. The best analogy I can give is that if you think of a waterfall, the amps is the amount of water flowing, and the voltage is the height of the waterfall. If the waterfall is twice at tall, there is twice the energy available from it.

    Peter
     
  15. RDoc

    RDoc S85D

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    Ugh, the provision of mainly 208V - which makes perfect sense - really limits the utility of twin chargers doesn't it? In the above circumstances, the twin chargers only buys about 7 mph, roughly 12 minutes per hour of charging.
     
  16. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    #16 Robert.Boston, Feb 19, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2013
    Depends on what amperage is available. 208v @ 80A is over 16kW, so the twin chargers get a 60% premium. If you have 240v @ 80A, you get nearly double the energy with the twin chargers. 208v @ 48A is a fairly unusual configuration to find in the wild.

    If you want a CS-60, there's a refurbished unit for sale on eBay: Clipper Creek CS 60 J1772 60 Amp EV Charger Level 2 Charger | eBay
     
  17. Sparrow

    Sparrow S105/ Roadster 189

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    In the old days of EVs, the chargers were limited by amps no matter what the voltage. I am thinking the S is still the same way, because the wiring is usually sized for the amperage. If you have a single charger in your S, your car is limited to pulling 40 amps regardless of the voltage. So at 208 volts you would have an approximately 8kW maximum charge rate. I certainly could be wrong.
     
  18. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    #18 Robert.Boston, Feb 21, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2013
    The UMC is limited to 40A, but I'm reasonably sure that it (the Model S's internal charger) could charge @ 208v at 48A (=10kW). The only way to find out is if someone has a HPWC on a 208v circuit.
     
  19. smorgasbord

    smorgasbord Active Member

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    If you look at the J1772 Signaling protocol, you'll see that it's amperage based, not power based. I suspect the UMC is the same, and so will not let more than 40 amps in no matter what the voltage.
     
  20. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    Sorry, I worded my response poorly. The UMC is absolutely limited to 40A, regardless of voltage. I was speculating that the CAR could accept 48 A @ 208v, even with a single charger in the car.
     

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