Chelsea's opinion

[Yggdrasill]

Chelsea has definitely rubbed me the wrong way. Her view for the future just seems so small and dull.

1. EVs can be sexy and cool. It's not a bad thing for them to be so! Even if they do end up expensive.
2. You don't need fast chargers if all you want is for EVs to attain maybe 50% market share. But personally, I'm not happy until you have 100% EVs, and for that, you need fast chargers.

 

[vfx]

... I agree with Tesla's stance of meeting their perception with a reality of a car than can go 300 miles on a charge and fill up quickly at a SuperCharger station. Is it a waste of time for Tesla to invest money in such an infrastructure? Chelsea says it is. On paper it probably is a bad investment. But, if it can shift the perception that EV's can never compete with ICE cars then I think the investment will pay off in the end by changing the perception to meet reality.

Activists try to convince car owners that their driving patterns are small and that they don't need the range they think that do.
Tesla solves the range anxiety problem by making a long running car and giving a free place to plug in on trips.

Elon approaches the problem as a an engineer not an activist.

 

[DaveVa]

Activists try to convince car owners that their driving patterns are small and that they don't need the range they think that do.
Tesla solves the range anxiety problem by making a long running car and giving a free place to plug in on trips.

Elon approaches the problem as a an engineer not an activist.

Whole heartedly agree +1

 

[TEG]

(stating the obvious, but)
There is a difference between doing things the best possible way and making compromises to get to a price point that more people can afford.
Many LEAF buyers could not afford any Tesla right now, as much as they might want one.
Chelsea acts as an advocate for the more average consumer.
I think she personally likes Tesla products for what they are, but continues to push for the industry to produce mainstream products that can sell in high volumes and make a real difference in terms of the mass benefits society can receive from reduced oil consumption.

 

[Doug_G]

Activists try to convince car owners that their driving patterns are small and that they don't need the range they think that do.
Tesla solves the range anxiety problem by making a long running car and giving a free place to plug in on trips.

Elon approaches the problem as a an engineer not an activist.

Hit the nail on the head. Chelsea has done more than anyone here to push the movement forward, but I can't agree with her on this one.

Re engineering - a couple of fixable glitches does not in any way take away from this incredible engineering achievement. And I've bought a car from a major manufacturer, which wasn't even a year one vehicle, which had MANY more problems both minor and dead-on-the-side-of-the-road serious (more than once).

Third point - a reporter quoted her. He might have cherry-picked a comment, misquoted, or took her out of context. I have a low opinion of some reporters, solely due to experience with them. Some of them simply don't care about accuracy whatsoever; they only care about deadlines.

 

[Arnold Panz]

(stating the obvious, but)
Many LEAF buyers could not afford any Tesla right now, as much as they might want one.
Chelsea acts as an advocate for the more average consumer.

OK, but what about the fact the plan all along for Tesla has been to go from the Roadster to Model S to GenIII, which should be in most LEAF-owners price range? Tesla has consistently stated that the best way to get a truly great affordable EV on the road is to go through the typical process of going from crazy expensive to not quite as expensive to (eventually) affordability. I think at the MT event (or perhaps it was on Fallon's show), Elon once again reiterated that what he's truly excited to do is GenIII, because he recognizes that there's a limited market financially for the Model S (or X).

Chelsea, I presume, knows all of this, but chose not to acknowledge it, or still approach this from her own perspective. Again, given what happened with her husband I think it is unwise for reporters to rely on her to provide quotes in an article specifically about Tesla or, if they want to use her quotes, should reveal her potential conflict of interest so that it is clear to a reader that she does not necessarily view Tesla through an impartial lens as she might another company making EVs.

 

[Krugerrand]

Chelsea talks.

Elon does.

 

[jcstp]

Please try not to presume something about someone based on something said by someone else!
Even more difficult to presume what someone said, based on what someone else said!

Else it ressembles too much as gossiping!

 

[gg_got_a_tesla]

It appears (to me) that Chelsea was quoted out of context. I hope she speaks up here on TMC. Would any of you who know her reasonably well be able to encourage her to do so?!

 

[efusco]

(stating the obvious, but)
There is a difference between doing things the best possible way and making compromises to get to a price point that more people can afford.
Many LEAF buyers could not afford any Tesla right now, as much as they might want one.
Chelsea acts as an advocate for the more average consumer.
I think she personally likes Tesla products for what they are, but continues to push for the industry to produce mainstream products that can sell in high volumes and make a real difference in terms of the mass benefits society can receive from reduced oil consumption.

Bingo!

- - - Updated - - -

It appears (to me) that Chelsea was quoted out of context. I hope she speaks up here on TMC. Would any of you who know her reasonably well be able to encourage her to do so?!

I have, she said she'd respond later today.

 

[TEG]

OK, but what about the fact the plan all along for Tesla has been to go from the Roadster to Model S to GenIII, which should be in most LEAF-owners price range? Tesla has consistently stated that the best way to get a truly great affordable EV on the road is to go through the typical process of going from crazy expensive to not quite as expensive to (eventually) affordability. I think at the MT event (or perhaps it was on Fallon's show), Elon once again reiterated that what he's truly excited to do is GenIII, because he recognizes that there's a limited market financially for the Model S (or X)...

That is all good, but I think the emphasis is on what is currently available.
The landscape will be very different when GenIII arrives.
Hopefully Tesla will continue to show the established industry what a small up-start company can do when it doesn't have the legacy bureaucratic baggage slowing it down.

 

[strider]

I agree w/ Arnold Panz. There is not a single technology in history I can think of that started cheap and for mass consumption in its first incarnation. Swords, horses, ICE's, TVs, microwaves, cell phones, etc, etc all started as expensive "toys for the rich" and then moved downmarket. You can't rush this step.

Also, it sounds like the Leaf meets her desires (73-mile range, inexpensive, J1772 connector...) so she's done right?

 

[vfx]

... Swords, horses, ICE's, TVs, microwaves, cell phones, etc, etc all started as expensive "toys for the rich" and then moved downmarket....

Would it be safe to say ALL technology starts this way?

 

[Norbert]

Also, it sounds like the Leaf meets her desires (73-mile range, inexpensive, J1772 connector...) so she's done right?

She said at least 3 times on different occasions that the range below some-number-higher-than Leaf (I think it was below 80 miles) is "sketchy".

It needs to be around 100-120 miles "real world" range.

She also isn't too fond of the Leaf for other reasons (I'm not sure if she ever specified which those are).

The Volt is still to expensive, but I think she likes it otherwise. Except it should have more torque (I guess we can identify with that one).

AFAIK she hasn't said much (in terms of liking or disliking) about the Model S except, repeatedly, that she thinks it is too expensive (to be relevant, or so, in some sense), and she didn't mention the MT award on her Twitter account at all. I know of no public attempt to correct any misquoting so far, but she made several appearances in this year which are behind pay walls (or require registration) and I don't know what she said there, plus I might have missed a few as I am only occasionally checking what is new from her. Though I am still usually watching TransportEvolved, not always anymore. But in a recent one Nikki asked her of her take on that Model S received the Yahoo!Autos CarOfTheYear award, and in response she only made fun of that Coda brags about being a Motor Trend candidate.

 

[TEG]

Would it be safe to say ALL technology starts this way?

[Rhetorical I gather...] Basically yes...

But, I think Nissan's position is that they are already on something like GenIII with the LEAF. They had other EVs before, including the Li-Ion Altra in the late 1990s. They sort-of said "Why wait for Tesla to get their technology down to mass market, when we can get you there sooner?" Some of this debate ends up being about timing. By the time Tesla gets to GenIII, the cost per kWh of auto cells will be to the point where a useful range doesn't command such a premium over a comparable mid-range ICE car. Undoubtedly the ~2015 future gen LEAF (or successor) will have better range (than the current LEAF) at a similar (or lower) price point by then too. We shall see how the two converge. It will be interesting to see how the Tesla GenIII compares to Nissan/Infiniti EVs in 2015, when looking at things like price, range, features, etc.

 

[strider]

She said at least 3 times on different occasions that the range below some-number-higher-than Leaf (I think it was below 80 miles) is "sketchy".

It needs to be around 100-120 miles "real world" range.

Wait, this is seriously hurting my head. So she wants a unicorn. Closing your eyes, stomping your feet, and wishing for something doesn't make it happen. I want an airplane that can cruise at 300mph for 12 hours and only costs $100k. Wait, you mean no one makes such a thing? Well then every current aircraft manufacturer is wrong and I will badmouth them at every opportunity. Nevermind that what I want isn't technically possible with today's technology.

If you believe your vision is technically possible then build it yourself. That's how innovation happens.

...and in response she only made fun of that Coda brags about being a Motor Trend candidate.

Which amuses me because the Coda is actually the closest thing on the market to what it sounds like she wants. Yes, the accoutrements are spartan but if you want to keep the cost down there's no free lunch.

 

[Larry Chanin]

There is not a single technology in history I can think of that started cheap and for mass consumption in its first incarnation. Swords, horses, ICE's, TVs, microwaves, cell phones, etc, etc all started as expensive "toys for the rich" and then moved downmarket. You can't rush this step.

Yes, in 1908 when Ford's first Model T was released, if you compare the initial price of a Model T with the US average annual salary it was actually proportionally more expensive than a Model S when compared with today's average annual salary.

Larry

 

[Tommy]

Although of course, under no obligation to do so, I hope Chelsea finds time to post her vision of the path to greater public EV acceptance on this forum. It would be a great opportunity to clear any misconceptions and also provide a single information source point for her take on what would be the ideal EV.

 

[Arnold Panz]

There is not a single technology in history I can think of that started cheap and for mass consumption in its first incarnation. Swords, horses, ICE's, TVs, microwaves, cell phones, etc, etc all started as expensive "toys for the rich" and then moved downmarket. You can't rush this step.

What you are generally referring to is how disruptive new technologies accelerate. People who come from automotive backgrounds instead of technology backgrounds sometimes don't get how this type of thing works because cars never really faced disruptive technologies (although lots of things in a car did, like auto doors/windows, ABS, air bags etc., which started out in high end cars as expensive options and ended up as standard features in most cars). Tesla has been clear about its plan (leading to GenIII) from the beginning, and yet people still complain that the cost of the Model S!

 

[vfx]

[Rhetorical I gather...] Basically yes...

I think it will be a good line when someone says about a Tesla, "That's too expensive!". Retort. Can you name one piece of new technology that did not start ourt expensive?"

... By the time Tesla gets to GenIII, .... We shall see how the two converge. It will be interesting to see how the Tesla GenIII compares to Nissan/Infiniti EVs...

It will be interesting. More because Elon pushes so big. Anyone thinking Tesla will ever do anything incrementally is going to wake up on the floor. My conversations with Tesla engineers and designers have a common theme of Elon asking for things greater than they had every imagined possible. And these are the guys who have been in the car business all their lives. Safe is not an option!