Commercial Crew Transportation Capability (CCtCap) SpaceX and Boeing Developments

[Grendal]

Here is a more recent milestone list:
Interesting that SpaceX is doing the in-flight abort test after the uncrewed flight test.

It would be nice if SpaceX could use one of the used boosters for the in-flight abort test. Unlikely for something from NASA. They put in their contracts to use only new equipment. The exception is that SpaceX has negotiated to re-use some of the cargo Dragon in future missions (CRS-11).

 

[adiggs]

They put in their contracts to use only new equipment.

I'm really looking forward to the day when this flips, and contracts get written to make use of properly tested equipment - meaning that it's been flown once already and it's past infant death problems

It's REALLY going to be funny if NASA missions become the vehicle for getting first flights on new rockets out of the way, so everybody else can use the trustworthy and tested gear!

 

[Mike1080i]

Here is a more recent milestone list:
Interesting that SpaceX is doing the in-flight abort test after the uncrewed flight test.

View attachment 188372

It would be nice if SpaceX could use one of the used boosters for the in-flight abort test. Unlikely for something from NASA. They put in their contracts to use only new equipment. The exception is that SpaceX has negotiated to re-use some of the cargo Dragon in future missions (CRS-11).

IIRC The reason for moving the in flight abort demo after the uncrewed flight test is so they can use the same Dragon 2 on both flights.

 

[raysspl]

Even the SpaceX delays far exceed other competitor's relative timelines in terms of deployment. Or to put it differently -- SpaceX's delays are the launch markers for other industry players. They'd probably love to have SpaceX's "delay" schedule than their current haha

 

[Grendal]

Here is the entire NASA presentation:

https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/9-mcalister_status_of_ccp.pdf

 

[Grendal]

Boeing has slipped another six months:

Boeing delays CST-100 test flights by six months - SpaceNews.com

Gwynne Shotwell recently said that SpaceX intends to be on time. We'll see how well they pull that off with the recent loss and damage.

This would give SpaceX some cushion to delay as well because, even with a delay, they will still get there before Boeing.

 

[jaguar36]

I think its far more important that SpaceX resolve any issues and do some extensive testing and analysis to ensure they don't have any more failures than to launch before Boeing. A loss of a unmanned mission is one thing, if the first manned launch goes south SpaceX is going to be in trouble. Boeing understands that its more important to get it right than be on time, I'm not sure SpaceX does.

 

[Grendal]

I think its far more important that SpaceX resolve any issues and do some extensive testing and analysis to ensure they don't have any more failures than to launch before Boeing. A loss of a unmanned mission is one thing, if the first manned launch goes south SpaceX is going to be in trouble. Boeing understands that its more important to get it right than be on time, I'm not sure SpaceX does.

Oh I think SpaceX is taking the manned mission very seriously. Gwynne Shotwell has mentioned this in all of her interviews in the last year. Besides, NASA and the government is over-watching every step to ensure safety.

 

[glhs272]

It's an issue for both Boeing and SpaceX. Boeing will be riding on a new (version) rocket, the Atlas V 422. The 422 version features "a as of yet" un-flown Dual Engine Centaur. Yes Dual Engine Centaur upper stages have flown before, but this one has been redesigned. Don't forget the Atlas just had it's own anomaly recently with the CRS OA-6. That mixture ratio valve issue could have very easily caused the RD-180 to have a RUD. Also the loss of power would have been a failure on most missions for the Atlas. The fact that it was so overpowered for the Cygnus mission was what saved the day (and a lot of luck). This was with a very mature rocket and very mature launch processes. So could SpaceX have another failure? Absolutely. Boeing/ULA? Yep. Never forget, Space is hard. Launch failures can happen to any of these launch providers, and will so again (I can predict this won't be the last orbital class rocket RUD).

Is that a reason to not fly? NO!

 

[oneday]

An article from wsj today indicating crew dragon first crew launch pushed to q2 2018.

SpaceX Has Delayed First Manned NASA Launch to 2018 from 2017

Main highlight from the article imo:

Earlier this year, a report by NASA’s inspector general said agency program officials expected SpaceX to “encounter additional delays on the path” to safety certification of its manned transportation hardware. The report mentioned, among other things, that cracks discovered during fabrication of a tunnel designed to connect the Dragon 2 capsule to the space station already had delayed qualification testing by roughly a year. In addition, the report said the company faced “ongoing issues with stress fractures” in a portion of its propulsion system “that must be resolved prior to flight.”

 

[Grendal]

Additional launches awarded:

Mission Awards Secure Commercial Crew Transportation for Coming Years

 

[Grendal]

Boeing's new spacesuit:

 

[adiggs]

Does this mean SpaceX is also designing a space suit for use in their craft, or will they be using prior designs, or even adopting Boeings design? Any word one way or the other about that?

 

[Mike1080i]

Does this mean SpaceX is also designing a space suit for use in their craft, or will they be using prior designs, or even adopting Boeings design? Any word one way or the other about that?

Yes, they are developing their own.
SpaceX had a superhero costume designer make a spacesuit

 

[Grendal]

These aren't real but they sure are cool. The SpaceX suits are also supposed to be cool.

 

[Grendal]

NASA just posted some cool shots and new details of the Dragon 2 capsule on their website:

ECLSS Systems Put to the Test for Commercial Crew Missions | Commercial Crew Program

 

[ecarfan]

Thanks Grendel, I saw that article earlier today. Love this photo. Interesting how the interior rib pattern varies quite a bit.

 

[Grendal]

Boeing put out a new video of the Starliner. Here is an article with the video:

Animation: The flight of a Boeing Starliner capsule from launch to landing – Spaceflight Now

I didn't realize how many small steps are involved with the Starliner. That has to add a lot complexity that is slowing the development process.

 

[miimura]

Why three sets of chutes? The basket handle action on the last set is a little ridiculous too.

 

[3Victoria]

Different chutes for different velocities. They have a hatch in the centre, so the chutes are attached on the side. But they need to be vertical for the cushions, so the bucket handle lets them do that.
Large amount of waste: booster, nosecone shields and others, second stage, rocket motor and fuel component of the capsule, three sets of chutes. Jeesh.