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Complaints on ordering and customer service

Discussion in 'Hong Kong' started by cyrushk, May 22, 2014.

  1. cyrushk

    cyrushk Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2014
    Messages:
    63
    Location:
    British Hong Kong
    I am a customer from Hong Kong, and this is the second time I decided to send you email directly as I feel no one can help and give a positive response in Tesla Hong Kong. I feel depressed, being deceived and being left on the basket.


    Before starting my long story, please forgive my poor English.


    In 2013, I had my first approach to Model S by having a test drive in Cyberport, Hong Kong. I was attracted and anticipated by the advanced technology and concept of future car would be. I decided to have my own Model S and raised many question to the staff who cares my test drive.

    During the test drive, I had the following questions raised and they replied as follows:


    =================================================
    Q1. Will Internet browser still exists after delivery of HK market? Transport Department in Hong Kong should not allow the screen to display the information other than driving information.


    A. Internet browser do not have video play back capability, which should pass the type approval. What TD is concerning is video playback feature on a vehicle. Don't worry about this feature will be disappeared after HK delivery.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Q2. When will vehicles being delivered?


    A. We scheduled we will deliver the first car in Q3 2013.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Q3. Will there any UK spec. mobile connector come along with the Model S?


    A. UK spec. mobile connector will be available along with car delivery.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Q4. Will Model S compatible with mainstream charging standard?


    A. Model S will follow the spec. from US. The only difference from US is RHD version. All features will be as same as US variant. Owners can easily charge their cars with Mobile connector come along the car or use public charging station easily all over Hong Kong. While using normal charging stations, you can plug your Mobile connector in and start charging your Model S. If you are next to quick charging station, you can just simply plug in the cable installed on the charger.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Q5. How about Google Maps? Will it come along with the car?


    A. Google Maps is an international map, which should be fine in HK and even in China.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Q6. How about pricing?


    A. Tesla is planning to sell the cars in same price all over the world. There may be additional cost for shipping and delivery. But for confirmation of price will be updated afterwards.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Q7. Will 5+2 rear-facing child seats available in Hong Kong?


    A. It will available as an option. You can choose this option when you order your own Model S.
    =================================================



    After understanding the questions I concerned with information search online, I decided to make reservation on Model S which is the first time to reserve my own Model S.


    However, after a long wait over 8 months, there are nothing updated me and no one cares about my reservation. There were no calls, no events, nothing! I was so disappointed and requested for refund. The schedule of delivery was already delayed for months, which already broke the promise when I had my test drive!


    After 5 months away, in 12 FEB 2014, the pricing in Hong Kong was officially launched. The prices are similar to US variant and which makes me feel comfortable to reserve my own Model S again.


    When the order was confirmed at 25 FEB 2014, the nightmare has just begun. As I mentioned in another email, I had very bad experience on booking my test drive, being ignored by Hong Kong staff and many promises were broken and makes me feel depressed and being cheated.


    The browser was removed due to Hong Kong law and being rejected by TD in type approval. As I mentioned before, there are strict limitation on information display on dashboard and driver viable area. Video and other non-driving information are strictly prohibited.


    The rear-facing seat was facing the same issue and being removed. TD explained that there were no previous case having a 5+2 and rear-facing setting. The seat number should be front-facing, fixed and keep unchangeable in a standard private car.


    Google Maps was being removed with no reason. HDD offline maps will take place on navigation. There will be no live-time traffic available, location information search and satellite maps available on offline maps. I called the hotline for Hong Kong owner, asking the reason for no Google Maps, and they just explained Elon Musk decided to remove the Google Maps in Hong Kong and China spec. Model S. If there are any updates, and they will let me know. I was really disappointed. I don't think it is a reasonable answer to everyone. This is TOTALLY UNBELIEVABLE.


    For charging, the charging standard is now different from US variant and basically NOT compatible with mainstream charging station in Hong Kong. While Model S in Hong Kong takes IEC standard, CHAdeMO and SAE plugs are more common and being used in many charging stations. Users cannot use the public charging stations easily as promised in quick charging station and there are no UK type mobile connector come along with the car, which means I cannot charge my car up with normal charging stations. I called to Hong Kong officce again and asking for solution, the just suggesting me to install the 40A wall connector which come along with the car. There are difficulties for a Hong Kong user to install a 40A wall connector in car park.


    Hong Kong is a small city and there are limited space for living. Most people in Hong Kong are living in tall building and they park their cars in a large car park nearby. While we rent a car parking space, which is usually floating space, with only permission to use a space to park the car. Users do not really own a space for parking. Charging, waxing and car wash and more are usually strictly prohibited. (Please ask Trista for real situation in Hong Kong, she really helps me a lot and talked with me and trying to help me. However, I know she DO NOT have permission and authority to do much for me! Or you can call me directly and I can explain it to you directly.) In this case, I cannot install the wall connector to charge my car up. If there are no UMC coming with the car, basically I have NO ways to charge my car. For superchargers, there are also nothing. I don't see anything your company will do in Hong Kong. I am depressed and disappointed.


    For those description and claims by Hong Kong officials from your company, which is already commits an offence in Hong Kong, the Trade Descriptions Ordinance, Chapter 362. The Ordinance is aimed to prohibit false trade descriptions in respect of services made in consumer transactions. If any person who in the course of any trade or business applies a false trade description to any goods; or supplies or offers to supply any goods to which a false trade description is applied; or has in his possession for sale or for any purpose of trade or manufacture any goods to which a false trade description is applied, commits an offence. Reference links as follows:


    http://www.customs.gov.hk/en/whats_new/tdspg/
    http://www.customs.gov.hk/en/consumer_protection/trade_desc/unfair/index.html

    Emails were sent to the management and I am looking for positive reply.
     
  2. NoMorePetrol

    NoMorePetrol Member

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Location:
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    I think many of us here can share your frustrations. The main issue is that the sales in HK promised too many things way too early before Tesla HK had clearance from the HK Gov and TD. I personally blame more on TD than on Tesla HK.
    Whenever I get frustrated over the whole Tesla sitation, I step back and think how I felt when I test drove the car. Just think about that surge of torque, it should be enough to put out the anger in you.
     
  3. mchk

    mchk Member

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    Location:
    Hong Kong
    Sorry to hear about your situation.


    For me the home charging seems to be the biggest issue. Losing the rear seats and google maps and browser, it sucks, but still isn't a deal-breaker to buy the car in my opinion.

    However, not being able to charge the car?? That's a major issue.

    There should be an easier way to plug in and go. Something standard or simple. Even if it's a simple adapter plug or cord we carry in the trunk if we encounter an NON-Tesla EV charger, there needs to be something simple to maximize our charging options.
     
  4. ck1116

    ck1116 Member

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    Location:
    Hong Kong
    Tesla is new company and small in car industry, I won't expected they can do everything perfectly; but so far I feel their service and isn't worse then other car dealers', my personal experience is that they are already better attitude than Benz and BMW sales persons.
     
  5. markwj

    markwj Moderator, Asia Pacific

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    Location:
    Hong Kong
    Sorry to hear your disappointment.

    As this was a pre-order, a year or more in advance, I thought it would have been clear that specifications were subject to change. I personally put down money 3 years ago.

    If you really don't want the car without those features (in particular the charging issue), then surely you can cancel your reservation?
     
  6. Lerxt

    Lerxt Member

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    #6 Lerxt, May 22, 2014
    Last edited: May 22, 2014
    I would not trust anything that Tesla's Hong Kong staff tell you. A few days ago I was told that there are no RHD cars in Hong Kong for test drive. This was after the video DITB posted of his RHD test drive. You need to talk to the US staff.

    I have no doubt that paying a deposit and not getting equipment advertised at the time would require a refund on the price, which I intend to get. People have a right to get the product they expect, telling someone effectively if you don't like it then get a refund, is not good enough. He wants the car with the advertised features, as far as it is legal.

    Tesla is, much more importantly, disappointing people in HK, and I'm pretty sure that they will struggle to overcome it, since there is nothing to either compensate it or at the very least explain it. If it was good enough for Elon to go to the mainland and kowtow there, why didn't he visit Hong Kong and talk to his customers?
     
  7. Vmax

    Vmax Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2014
    Messages:
    585
    Location:
    Hong Kong
    ck1116,
    Totally agree with you. Tesla can't keep some of their promises due to external factors and not to max their profits. Still very much believe in the car and EV concept, but can only give my final comment about the car and company after I took delivery of the it.
    Situation reminds me a bit when getting my first Mac in 1984 :)
     
  8. Electric700

    Electric700 Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Florida, United States
    In the US, the Tesla Model S comes with adapters that you can use with the SAE J1772 type chargers:

    -J1772 charger: http://m.eet.com/media/1200053/sae-j1772c.jpg
    -J1772 adapter that comes with the Model S (you can purchase additional ones here): Shop Tesla Gear SAE J1772

    Others:
    -CHAdeMO is coming soon; the date has not been announced yet: Shop Tesla Gear CHAdeMO Adapter
    -List: Shop Tesla Gear Charging and Adapters

    Another option would be for you to talk to or write a letter to your building's management; perhaps they can dedicate one or more spaces to EVs and install charging stations for you.
     
  9. DITB

    DITB Charged.hk co-founder

    Joined:
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    #9 DITB, May 22, 2014
    Last edited: May 22, 2014
    I am sure Henry Ford and Ford Motor Company faced similar scenarios, when they were making the Ford model T.

    Sure it isn't satisfactory, yet having met numerous Tesla employees in Hong Kong and the US, I have felt a burning spark in each of them. They are doing their utmost, to get the most of it.

    Too bad they don't always have enough time for customers.

    Too bad they some times cannot predict the future, and what customs and TD in HK can come up with of obstacles, but I know they do what they can.

    I also know that Elon Musk is focused on NOT delivering a product which is sub-par.

    Delays? Well, I rather have a delay, and get a good product, rather than something like a Windows which is released for a deadline, but it doesn't work, isn't complete, full of bugs.

    Who would want a car that crashes every other day?

    Sure, the model S also has bugs, and challenges, and I know the team is doing what they can to correct and improve as required.cyrushk, I can understand your frustration, also if you decide to cancel. Hong Kong is conservative in many ways, and indirectly rules by tycoons in many ways. And they like fossil fuels and fossil fuel cars, there is a lot of money at stake here.I for one will persist, even when I cannot get the rear facing seats that I wanted, and even if "my" parking garage decides NOT to get chargers. I'll manage somehow, because this car is amazing, and it must succeed.
     
  10. cyrushk

    cyrushk Member

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    Location:
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    I just wanted to express what I see and my feelings on Tesla. Quite disappointed to its service and management, but really amazed by the product. I really wanted them to follow and understand what people thinking in Hong Kong. If I decided to quit and refund, I don't think I need to type such long to its management.
     
  11. moarfish

    moarfish Member

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    Is it confirmed that there will be no Google Map? When I having my test drive in Disneyland Hotel last week, I were told it is not confirmed yet.
     
  12. CCT

    CCT Member

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    Location:
    Hong Kong
    Since the laws regarding EVs in HK are basically a mess (not really laws, practically just guidance at best), hence, and as expected, most building managements and/or owners' committees are reluctant to change the status quo, in the worst case one possible last solution for those who live in apartments and cannot install their own EVSEs is to:

    1) get their cars first (so that there are a significant number of Model Ss on the street)
    2) record/document the plain stupid difficulties and frustrations they face when trying to charge the vehicle in real-life situations i.e. those 13A super slow EVSEs available in public or mall car parks that are normally occupied by ICE cars
    3) collectively sign a formal petition to the Government (to both Environment Bureau and Home Affairs Bureau) seeking for mandatory approval by building management/owners' committee upon EVSE installation requests at private car parks subject to EMSD's inspection and approval
    4) make use of the LegCo's Redress System and lodge a complaint to LegCo
    5) tell stories to mass media such as HKEJ, Ming Pao, SCMP, Apple Daily & Next Magazine, and maybe those free ones
    6) write stories on HK Golden forum and create a Facebook page
    7) wait a year or two and hope for the best
     
  13. techmaven

    techmaven Active Member

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    Put it this way, Tesla is a the very forefront, blazing the trail for truly competitive and amazing electric cars. There will be battle scars. But these things are part of the experience. The very bleeding edge is both the most exciting and the most excruciating. When you look back, you'll see that you were part of an amazing global transformation and your battle scars are but the proof of your early pioneering spirit.

    :smile:
     
  14. ekwng

    ekwng Member

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    Remember it is the first time ever TD is facing a Model S. TD will definitely approve everything with caution and stick with the rules.

    For a completely new product coming into HK, I'm not at all surprised by all these last minute changes due to local regulations.

    I understand the frustration of not getting what you expect, and if you really think you need those missing features, the best way is to get a refund.
     
  15. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    Your first post made it seem like you thought you were addressing Tesla Motors here. While they may read it, this isn't the official route to contact them. Just want to make sure you realized that.
     
  16. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    +1000 many times over. Cancel your reservation, get your money back, and when the car is available and you know each feature, then buy it. If you signed the same deposit pre-order contract that everyone else did, Tesla made it clear that things might change.

    Cyrushk, since you are communicating directly with Tesla, then you're posting the same information here to embarrass them before you have resolution? Or? One thing to vent, but if it were me, I'd wait until I heard back from Tesla and knew what their answer was. Why get everyone upset if there is no need?

    Btw, what you're NOT going to get by coming on the forum and being upset are any free upgrades. I've heard that some people think that is possible. It's not. Not saying that is what you're doing at all.
     
  17. cyrushk

    cyrushk Member

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    Already sent emails to officials
     
  18. Lerxt

    Lerxt Member

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    I don't think anyone is asking for free upgrades or being unreasonable. Consumer laws require companies to deliver the product specified,it's as simple as that.

    I'm also not so sure I see a burning spark in any HK Tesla employee that is anything different to the same poor HK service you get anywhere. All of the developments and changes in HK specs have been revealed on these forums first, before any official announcement. Where is the communication to the buyers? How hard is it for Tesla HK to keep people up to date?

    Once again, the "if you don't like it , cancel" attitude is simply wrong. People expect Tesla to deliver what they promised. Clearly cyrushk wants the car with the features advertised and communicated to him by employees, this is reasonable and the minimum standard required by law and expected by customers.
     
  19. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    I don't think anyone said 'if you don't like it, cancel'. The suggestion is that IF you do not feel comfortable with the fact that your deposit agreement with Tesla allowed for changing features, then 1) get your deposit refunded, and 2) buy the car when the design for the HK market is stabilized.
     
  20. cyrushk

    cyrushk Member

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    +1, this is exactly what i am saying

    - - - Updated - - -

    I don't see any reasons to hide Tesla's fault here. Refund is not a correct attitude to handle this thing. Tesla should have a good communocation between customers and themselves. As Lexert said, basically all news is released here rather than official release by TM HK
     

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