The stock 21s will have better performance than the stock 19s. But performance is more a factor of tire compound than tire size. By going aftermarket, there are many tires in 19s that will perform better than the stock 21s. The issues I refer to with 21s is the high tendency for them to blowout on potholes and damage the rims. If you search these threads you'll find a very high amount of owners switching from 21s to 19s. It's probably a combination of how heavy the car is on very very low profile tires on a rim that just is a little soft and bends. Regen probably doesn't help it either. They are very costly to repair. Expect $2k per rim+tire each time you blow one out. Some have blown both on the same side simultaneously when hitting a pothole. It's also occurred on those pavement type changes too. I know there's owners on here that have replaced 2-3 sets within a few months and just gave up on it bc of how expensive they were to replace. Also the treads don't last very long on them anyway so some owners weren't happy with replacing them every 7-10k miles anyway (which is the norm for these low profile performance tires). That's about $2k every 10k miles you drive. Search the threads and read all about it from other owners. If your ok with the cost and don't mind needing to be towed every now and then when you hit a pothole then by all means go for it. I'm sure theres one or two people here that would disagree with my assessment but certainly not the majority. I personally don't know anyone that's kept their 21s. Everyone I know around these parts in MD NJ PA NY etc all switched to 19s. And service centers around these parts are ALWAYS swamped with new owners' cars being towed in from blowouts on the 21s. Most of them didn't have a clue about it when they ordered and just maxed everything out. It only takes a few times before owners wise up and switch to the 19s.
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Configuring P85D, questions on Sound Studio
- Thread starter n2mb_racing
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The stock 21s will have better performance than the stock 19s. But performance is more a factor of tire compound than tire size. By going aftermarket, there are many tires in 19s that will perform better than the stock 21s. The issues I refer to with 21s is the high tendency for them to blowout on potholes and damage the rims. If you search these threads you'll find a very high amount of owners switching from 21s to 19s. It's probably a combination of how heavy the car is on very very low profile tires on a rim that just is a little soft and bends. Regen probably doesn't help it either. They are very costly to repair. Expect $2k per rim+tire each time you blow one out. Some have blown both on the same side simultaneously when hitting a pothole. It's also occurred on those pavement type changes too. I know there's owners on here that have replaced 2-3 sets within a few months and just gave up on it bc of how expensive they were to replace. Also the treads don't last very long on them anyway so some owners weren't happy with replacing them every 7-10k miles anyway (which is the norm for these low profile performance tires). That's about $2k every 10k miles you drive. Search the threads and read all about it from other owners. If your ok with the cost and don't mind needing to be towed every now and then when you hit a pothole then by all means go for it. I'm sure theres one or two people here that would disagree with my assessment but certainly not the majority. I personally don't know anyone that's kept their 21s. Everyone I know around these parts in MD NJ PA NY etc all switched to 19s. And service centers around these parts are ALWAYS swamped with new owners' cars being towed in from blowouts on the 21s. Most of them didn't have a clue about it when they ordered and just maxed everything out. It only takes a few times before owners wise up and switch to the 19s.
FWIW - I know several people in NC that are happy with their 21s and have never had an issue.
And any high performance tire has a short life - so if you go with better aftermarket 19s, they will have a shorter life. Now - there have been talks that the 21s lead to higher negative camber and thus more wear. I'm not sure I buy that but it has been written....
I don't see where regen matters at all. It is very gentle compared to breaking or accelerating but it is on the rear wheels only. The deceleration had to happen anyway but it will bias wear to the rear ever so slightly. But probably an order of magnitude lower than acceleration.
I've blown 2 tires and bent rims simultaneously on a 545 with 18s in NC (Cary no less). So stuff happens and it is definitely a reason to not get 21s (I'm not). But there are people who don't regret the decision - at least around here.
And any high performance tire has a short life - so if you go with better aftermarket 19s, they will have a shorter life. Now - there have been talks that the 21s lead to higher negative camber and thus more wear. I'm not sure I buy that but it has been written....
I don't see where regen matters at all. It is very gentle compared to breaking or accelerating but it is on the rear wheels only. The deceleration had to happen anyway but it will bias wear to the rear ever so slightly. But probably an order of magnitude lower than acceleration.
I've blown 2 tires and bent rims simultaneously on a 545 with 18s in NC (Cary no less). So stuff happens and it is definitely a reason to not get 21s (I'm not). But there are people who don't regret the decision - at least around here.
3s-a-charm
Active Member
Ha! Not true at all... many Canadians didn't get the heated steering wheel (mine included) when they were transitioning the cold weather package to include this. Those who entered production around December 15/16 if I recall were in the transition time. Now all CWP have HSW. Mine was in the transition time and no heated steering wheel (in Canada) where many others including some in San Diego were getting HSW with the same production dates as me. I don't think there really was any order to it at the time. I really hope it can be retrofitted some day as I miss not having it.
As to the rest of your options, I can speak to this somewhat as I have every option but the 3rd row in my P85D including 21" winters.
- Dual chargers is probably the least critical to me and if it weren't for resale and/or the comments on this forum I would have skipped it. The car almost charges too fast for me most of the time... takes about the same time to charge as my iPhone in most cases. I was expecting "overnight" charging but I plug in and by the time I'm done dinner I get the notification that it's finished!
- 3rd row seems to be the least selected option - mainly because it's specific to those with kids out of car seats but under 70 lbs (?) which is a pretty specific time (maybe 2-3 years??) and I not only preferred the extra storage I felt the added reinforcements would add weight but this is unfounded.
- Premium interior was a no-brainer for me as I'm spending $150k (in my case) on a car I want it to fell luxurious as possible inside.
- Black headliner is a must... so nice
- Hi-fi stereo is very personal - again for the price of the car I wanted it to be as good as it can be inside and this was part of that theory. I like the sound system but would prefer a little more depth/bass at low volumes (under 3) as it sounds great over 5. It is also pretty loud in it's minimum setting.
- Spoiler is totally personal... I like it but some like the clean look without. I think it finishes off the rear of the car perfectly
- 21" wheels are a little harsh to be honest. Haven't had the summers on but the 21" winter set is probably the one thing I would change out. I did the 21" because I love the look but they are VERY low profile and the aftermarket cyclone-looking wheels in 19" grey look almost as good and would offer a better winter ride.
- cold weather package is also a must regardless of where you live. Even just missing the HSW on mildly chilly days I haven't turned off my heated seat since it came off the truck 3.5 weeks ago.
Enjoy your car... it's an amazing machine!
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Hey Jon,
For what it's worth, here are my options and opinions:
Upgraded sound> did it because I was able to do a side by side comparison at the store. The standard sound was pretty disappointing, the upgraded was marginally better, but better.
Dual chargers> No, based on my daily drive of less than 50 miles and my occasional trips are near supercharger locations in So. Cal.
Rear facing seats> No need, I also wouldn't get them if you don't have kids yet.
Spoiler and 21" wheels> Yes, I like the look and have been driving for the last several years with low profiles and had only 1 minor curb rash which was fixed for 80 bucks.
Premium and sub zero> Yesterday I was at the Tesla store in UTC San Diego, where I had the chance to sit in the new Executive Rear Seats. Let me tell you, I am so glad I ordered this option! They are SO much more comfortable to sit in and look SO much nicer then the 3 skinny bench seat standard or even the next gen option. This package for Exec. seating includes Subzero and premium interior. Yes, it's a little expensive but now the back seating will look as nice as the rest of the car and your back seat passengers will LOVE the dual seat warmers!
For what it's worth, here are my options and opinions:
Upgraded sound> did it because I was able to do a side by side comparison at the store. The standard sound was pretty disappointing, the upgraded was marginally better, but better.
Dual chargers> No, based on my daily drive of less than 50 miles and my occasional trips are near supercharger locations in So. Cal.
Rear facing seats> No need, I also wouldn't get them if you don't have kids yet.
Spoiler and 21" wheels> Yes, I like the look and have been driving for the last several years with low profiles and had only 1 minor curb rash which was fixed for 80 bucks.
Premium and sub zero> Yesterday I was at the Tesla store in UTC San Diego, where I had the chance to sit in the new Executive Rear Seats. Let me tell you, I am so glad I ordered this option! They are SO much more comfortable to sit in and look SO much nicer then the 3 skinny bench seat standard or even the next gen option. This package for Exec. seating includes Subzero and premium interior. Yes, it's a little expensive but now the back seating will look as nice as the rest of the car and your back seat passengers will LOVE the dual seat warmers!
My mistake - I thought it was geographically based, not random.
That's the key piece of info. Thanks for confirming.
Actually, I would recommend dual chargers for anyone in Canada. There are so many high-current Sun Country Highway stations up there that it seems like a good thing to have if you have any expectation of using public charging.
It goes without saying, that if money isn't that big of an issue, just max that baby out and don't regret it. If you are trying to stay at some sort of budget, here's a fellow Jon's opinion:
1) The sound isn't really a great deal. $2500 goes a long way towards an aftermarket setup. The biggest difference is that the upgraded sounds has a subwoofer and XM radio. I would try and hear a normal one first.
2) With the Chademo adapter costing $450, I see it as a much better deal for "those emergency situations" where you need to charge faster. Assuming your daily, non-road trip, commute is under 200 miles there is no reason to get the twin chargers. I live in Seattle, which is a huge market, and I rarely have a chance to use the twin chargers. If you are looking to save money, dropping twin chargers is one of the first things I would do. The twin chargers will become less useful over time. I've seen the three year plan on superchargers. They will be EVERYWHERE. A lot of us got them because they were very useful in the early days, but I think they aren't worth the money now.
3) If you don't have kids yet, there is no reason. I am recently married, and will have kids eventually, but we are talking 5-6 years before they could use them. By that time, my wife will have a Model X.
4) If you don't like the look of the spoiler, don't get it.
5) Sounds like you don't need this.
I totally disagree on buying any feature for the argument that it will help resale value, except for the tech package. It's not going to be worth the investment. The cold weather package might open you up to selling it in more markets, but even that is a stretch, as pre-warming the car is very effective.
P.S. I bought an inventory car because it allowed me to get a lot of options that were "would be nice to have" for the same price as a new car. I am really happy I did. I wouldn't have paid full price for a lot of things if I were buying new though.
1. 21" tires and wheels are 99% about looks (and profit).
2. Whether the 19" or 21" will perform better depends on what tires are mounted, and also what your performance criteria are.
Everyone gets heated seats -not just CWP. Someone above seemed to not realize that. Sure rear seat passengers don't get heated seats without CWP. So few people "need" this as the reason to use heated seats in the back is partly to save the electricity to heat the cabin - and thus helping range. Well - this is a rare issue for anyone outside the North. You have to be on a family road trip in the winter - when most trips are in the summer. A blanket would go pretty far in this case. Not ideal for a driver but they have the heated seat regardless.
And a steering wheel is not really worth $750 to me...... But if I lived in Canada - sure.
And a steering wheel is not really worth $750 to me...... But if I lived in Canada - sure.
robby
Member
I see lots of people pushing the upgraded sound package. Can anybody comment on whether the overall fidelity is better with UHFS, or whether it just adds more bass? I hugely appreciate high quality audio from a clarity standpoint, but having punchy bass isn't something I care about. I'd appreciate any opinions from folks here, especially but not exclusively from folks who have heard both versions. In case it's useful, I mostly listen to classical guitar and classical and jazz piano while driving.
Hi all, I am looking for other Model S P85D owners who purchased the Sub Zero package and their car’s birthday was after December 9th, 2014.
I have read other P85D owners not getting a Heated Steering Wheel and some who did. I have been given mis information from my SC on several accounts. First, it was my “car was not configured for the Heated Steering Wheel,” then I spoke with 2 people from Tesla Tech Support, who verified that my car WAS configured for the HSW. Went back to my SC who stated they didn’t see any notes pertaining to this issue and asked “who I spoke with” I gave them the names.
I then received a call from my SC saying that my HSW was on order. They stated my car was manufactured before the HSW was a introduced. So it would be a “retro fit??” Then, forwarded me an invoice for over $2,000.00 to have the HSW installed.
I again called Tesla Tech Support, I found out P85Ds manufactured before December 9, 2014 P85Ds were NOT configured with the New Sub Zero Package including (not all 5 seats were heated and no heated windshield wiper/fluid or wired for the HSW)
I was told this would be escalated and the Regional Service Manager would call me in a few days. That was February 13th, 2018...
I emailed all this information back to my SC the same day, February 13, 2018 and included the Two Tesla Techs who did the research and escalated this issue.
My car’s birthday was December 22, 2014. My Sub Zero Package has all seats heated and heated windshield wiper/fluid.
No Heated Steering Wheel.
As of today, Radio Silence.
Anyone have a similar experience?
Thanks for your time and any input you might be able to provide.
MB
robby
Member
What @tga said is correct. The heated steering wheel was introduced gradually into some cars beginning in December 2014. However, it was not advertised publicly or considered part of the cold weather package until January 12, 2015 (this date came from Jerome Guillen, Tesla's VP of Sales & Service at the time, who provided it to me in writing). I interpret this as some pre-1/12/15 owners who had the cold weather package got lucky, but Tesla has no obligation to retrofit the vehicles that didn't.
3s-a-charm
Active Member
I was in this boat with my P85D... produced at the end of Dec and no HSW but others produced a few days before mine (to the best of our knowledge at the time) were coming off the line with the HSW. There was 2-3 weeks of transition time where it was a lottery on who got it and who didn’t.
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