Connectivity: service plan/upgradability/speed

[mnx]

Tesla has made the mistake of connecting too many of the cars features to the Internet so they need to be very carefully how they handle this. There could very well be a huge pr nightmare when that functionality goes away without paying a monthly fee. And I'm sorry but "You can tether the car to your phone" is not a good answer.

I find wifi tethering to be rather crappy on my phone and phone's I've used in the past. (slow and unreliable). Perhaps that's just my carriers network, I don't know. I wonder if a USB "datastick" would work in the Model S and if you didn't want to buy access from Tesla.

 

[gregincal]

I was also told by local Tesla reps at the "Tesla Gallery" in Scottsdale that connectivity was free. That statement was not qualified in any way.

Unless Tesla included disclaimers in any of its contracts (MVPA) or at the showrooms stating that the car's connectivity is for a "limited time", customers have a right to expect their vehicles to continue functioning as purchased and received. For Tesla to start charging for this service means that they are essentially taking away a feature/function of the car that was represented to be included with the purchase. Indeed, the car cannot even function as advertised or as presented in the galleries without connectivity. By including "free" connectivity with shipping vehicles without qualifying it any way as a non-standard or limited time promotion, that connectivity cannot later be separated from the vehicle. That's like Tesla coming back six months after you buy the car to tell you that you need to pay a monthly fee for your rear view mirrors otherwise they are going to take them away.

Certainly Tesla can do what it wants, but I don't think taking away 3G connectivity that was included without disclaimer in everyone's purchase is going to stand up to legal scrutiny.

Your car's owners manual clearly states that some functionality is only available with the connectivity package.

 

[EKnight47]

Your car's owners manual clearly states that some functionality is only available with the connectivity package.

One would have to own/have one on order to see the owner's manual, no? I think the point was that I was mislead at the gallery. Before I "owned" one. That is all. It's a moot point (for me at least) as I still would have ordered one. It's just disappointing that I wasn't given all the info when I asked the question "it's free?!" I was mislead...it happened....time to move on! :smile:

The Audi plan mentioned sounds more than fair. It would be great if terms of the Tesla plan were similar.

 

[PaceyWhitter]

The Audi plan sounds fair for a stand alone plan, but I can add a tablet to my current Verizon plan for $10 a month (I would not increase my data cap) If tesla had installed a universal chip in thae car like is in the iPhone, the HTC one or many other phones, we would have this option instead of relying on ATT

 

[Stoneymonster]

The Audi plan sounds fair for a stand alone plan, but I can add a tablet to my current Verizon plan for $10 a month (I would not increase my data cap) If tesla had installed a universal chip in thae car like is in the iPhone, the HTC one or many other phones, we would have this option instead of relying on ATT

And we probably would have paid an extra $500 or waited another few months for the car, given the extra engineering time, costs and lower volume compared to a phone. Also, keep in mind that most of the parts for this car were probably pretty fixed a couple of years ago when this was even more difficult to achieve.

 

[brianman]

One would have to own/have one on order to see the owner's manual, no?

Nope, it's online. I downloaded it in September before I got my car (in November).

 

[PaceyWhitter]

And we probably would have paid an extra $500 or waited another few months for the car, given the extra engineering time, costs and lower volume compared to a phone. Also, keep in mind that most of the parts for this car were probably pretty fixed a couple of years ago when this was even more difficult to achieve.

I have trouble believing that, the iPhone 4s had a Qualcomm universal chip two years ago.

 

[EKnight47]

Nope, it's online. I downloaded it in September before I got my car (in November).

Wow. You win, Brian (golf clap). I just took someone's word for it.

 

[gregincal]

One would have to own/have one on order to see the owner's manual, no? I think the point was that I was mislead at the gallery. Before I "owned" one. That is all. It's a moot point (for me at least) as I still would have ordered one. It's just disappointing that I wasn't given all the info when I asked the question "it's free?!" I was mislead...it happened....time to move on! :smile:

The Audi plan mentioned sounds more than fair. It would be great if terms of the Tesla plan were similar.

Um, I wasn't even responding to you. I was responding to AmpedRealtor's comment about taking away 3G without a disclaimer. I was pointing out that in the documentation that spell's out the features of the car it does have one. What salespeople say is another issue entirely.

 

[brianman]

@EKnight47

Here's the link BTW. No need to be logged in.
https://www.teslamotors.com/sites/default/files/blog_attachments/ms_owners_guide.pdf

Your car's owners manual clearly states that some functionality is only available with the connectivity package.

Searching for Connectivity...

If your Model S is equipped with the Connectivity package, internet radio
services* (such as Slacker and TuneIn) have been set up for you and can
be selected using Media Player.

As for how a car behaves with Connectivity disabled, I don't think we know for certain how the implementation behaves in that scenario. For example, does it pop a distinct "You don't have Connectivity" UI if you try to go to Slacker?

What we do know is how it behaves when you lose connectivity because you're in the mountains, etc. and many of us are assuming similar behavior when disabled-because-unpaid Connectivity occurs.

 

[gregincal]

On another note, as I mentioned several months ago and many pages back in this thread, I do believe Tesla has an issue with their Nav system. The Tech option is quite expensive and promises offline maps. The problem is that the offline map feature totally sucks and is far inferior to any other car's built in nav system. I believe that if any reasonable nav experience requires the connectivity package there is an issue.

 

[Rodolfo Paiz]

I have trouble believing that, the iPhone 4s had a Qualcomm universal chip two years ago.

Not sure what you mean by a "universal" chip, especially from two years ago.

We had two AT&T iPhone 4s devices in the house two years ago, and they couldn't talk to Verizon CDMA, they couldn't do high-speed data (aka "4G") and they couldn't connect to GSM in some other countries. Really far from "universal" in my book.

We now have two Verizon iPhone 4s devices, and they still don't do 4G or LTE... these talk CDMA but not GSM. Still not even "flexible" or even "up to date", much less "universal".

 

[EKnight47]

On another note, as I mentioned several months ago and many pages back in this thread, I do believe Tesla has an issue with their Nav system. The Tech option is quite expensive and promises offline maps. The problem is that the offline map feature totally sucks and is far inferior to any other car's built in nav system. I believe that if any reasonable nav experience requires the connectivity package there is an issue.

That's very good to know. With everything the connectivity provides, it would be hard to go without it. Just hope it's not too pricey.

- - - Updated - - -

Um, I wasn't even responding to you. I was responding to AmpedRealtor's comment about taking away 3G without a disclaimer. I was pointing out that in the documentation that spell's out the features of the car it does have one. What salespeople say is another issue entirely.

I know you weren't responding to me. However, Amped and I were both told the same thing at a gallery. I guess it happens.

 

[dirkhh]

When I bought my car (mid July - I skipped the line and took a floor model) the fact that connectivity is "free for now but will become a feature that they will charge for, but allow tethering as alternative" was explicitly pointed out both by the sales manager at Portland Washington Square Mall and again by my DS.
I had also read about it here, but I can understand how people could be upset who were promised something else.
I'd bring that up with Jerome, ideally with the name of the person who told you differently. Worst case he tells you "tough luck, mistake happen". Or you might get some more free time. I think it's worth it.

 

[EKnight47]

When I bought my car (mid July - I skipped the line and took a floor model) the fact that connectivity is "free for now but will become a feature that they will charge for, but allow tethering as alternative" was explicitly pointed out both by the sales manager at Portland Washington Square Mall and again by my DS.
I had also read about it here, but I can understand how people could be upset who were promised something else.
I'd bring that up with Jerome, ideally with the name of the person who told you differently. Worst case he tells you "tough luck, mistake happen". Or you might get some more free time. I think it's worth it.

Agreed...it is now VERY clear (thanks Brianman et al) that there would eventually be a fee. I just hadn't been on the forums and was too excited about a lot of other features on the car to "fact check" what the rep told me.

Sound advice to contact Jerome. Couldn't hurt I guess. Thanks for the advice.

 

[brianman]

Sound advice to contact Jerome. Couldn't hurt I guess. Thanks for the advice.

He also seems quite responsive, based on forum and personal anecdotes. Hopefully he doesn't get overloaded like GB seemed to when we started asking him questions.

 

[dsm363]

We should probably try saving contacting people like Jerome for big issues. Something like a sales person telling you something factually inaccurate should probably be handled at local level first then kicked up the ladder until you get a satisfactory response.

 

[rlang59]

On another note, as I mentioned several months ago and many pages back in this thread, I do believe Tesla has an issue with their Nav system. The Tech option is quite expensive and promises offline maps. The problem is that the offline map feature totally sucks and is far inferior to any other car's built in nav system. I believe that if any reasonable nav experience requires the connectivity package there is an issue.

I mentioned that a few pages back as well. This is the part that I think there is going to be the biggest issue with.

 

[pete8314]

I'll be a little sad when Tesla finally get their act together (I mean that in a nice way) and start to charge for connectivity, but it was inevitable. Allowing the car to tether through a phone is a nice bonus for those that can use that feature (my iPhone is grandfathered into unlimited data, but if I want tethering, the plan will be switched), but honestly, for all the cool stuff that the connection brings, and for all the future cool stuff it'll probably bring, I'll be relatively happy to pay ~$30 a month. I think of that as (almost) half a tank of gas in my old car

 

[Denarius]

Not sure what you mean by a "universal" chip, especially from two years ago.

We had two AT&T iPhone 4s devices in the house two years ago, and they couldn't talk to Verizon CDMA, they couldn't do high-speed data (aka "4G") and they couldn't connect to GSM in some other countries. Really far from "universal" in my book.

We now have two Verizon iPhone 4s devices, and they still don't do 4G or LTE... these talk CDMA but not GSM. Still not even "flexible" or even "up to date", much less "universal".

The reason for that is the restricted space for chipis/antennas. You need a different length of antenna based on the frequency you want it to operate. The Model S has plenty of room for multiple antennas, the iPhone does not. So in the phone they have different antenna lengths, but the same chip.