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Contesting a Speeding Ticket

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If speeding tickets were just speeding tickets, and you get a ticket for $100, pay it, and be done with it, I'd totally do that. But it's the 3 (or more) years of insurance surcharges that can turn a $100 speeding ticket into several thousand dollars. And god help you if you get another ticket during that period, the penalties get even worse. This is why I use radar and laser protection and, more importantly, situational awareness to avoid getting caught speeding. But if I do get a ticket, I'd certainly fight it within the scope of what the system allows (which has only happened once in 15 years).
 
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I will "play" the game the way the system allows.
In my opinion the issue is mostly about points. I fight to get rid of points. I'd pay the fine gladly to avoid the points.
In Brazil, where the points do not affect insurance rates I pay the fines when I receive the notice, even though the cameras do make mistakes sometimes, and there are easy ways to fight.
Of course, I have never received enough citations to make much difference.
 
Everybody has excuses. Everybody has reasons why the law does not really apply to their situation. Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

I don't think anyone here said or implied that the law doesn't apply to them. The same system that allows the tickets to be written is the same system that allows them to be challenged. Nobody is shirking responsibility or think they're above the law. I'm certainly not. But if I can use the legal system, as designed, to limit my financial exposure, I'm going to do that, in much the same way some towns and law enforcement agencies use the law to levy fines on you, whether they are valid or not.
 
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I don't think anyone here said or implied that the law doesn't apply to them. ...

Of course not. Nobody ever says that. But people act as though the law didn't apply to them. They do it all the time. Traffic laws, parking laws, fudging (lying) on your tax return. All sorts of things.

The system indeed provides procedures for challenging accusations when you feel they are wrong. But I'm seeing above (and very often elsewhere) people who admit (in person, or anonymously on the internet) that they were speeding, but they'll challenge it because they know they can game the system.

In 2015, thirty-five thousand people died in traffic accidents in the U.S. That's well over ten times as many people as were killed on 9/11. And failure to obey traffic laws is a significant part of that. If you are given a speeding ticket when you were not actually speeding, by all means contest it. Cops can make mistakes like anyone else. But if you were actually speeding, or running a red light, or otherwise driving dangerously, and were caught fair and square, it's just low to try to get out of it by gaming the system.
 
Unfortunately traffic tickets are part of the money game. Many, if not most courts want the $ and could care less about the points. Just showing up to court is enough to lower the points and/or fine amount. Just the way it is. I don't begrudge the ones who show up to fight the ticket. Play the game. :)
 
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And I clearly said above, that if I was caught speeding and got a ticket, and I could just pay the ticket, I would. It's the racket between insurance companies, towns, and police departments that keep the "speeding ticket" ball rolling, and the massive surcharges insurance companies get with points. I believe a large portion of funding for radar and laser guns to police departments comes from insurance company kickbacks...err, I mean, grants.
 
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"It's not the fine, it's the points." "It's not the fine it's the insurance rates." "It's not the fine it's the money-making scam of towns soaking drivers." "It's not the fine, it's the principle of the thing."

But it's not really any of that. It's how fast you were driving. And whether you feel entitled to squirm out of it when you get caught. And it's the thirty-five thousand people who die every year in traffic accidents, many of which are due to all the various forms of careless and distracted driving, including speeding.

"I'm such a good driver that I can flaunt the speed limit and I'll never cause an accident."

No, you're not. Studies have demonstrated that people over-rate their own abilities. And all it takes is one moment of distraction. The energy of a collision increases exponentially with speed. Speeding kills people. Speed limits are intended to reduce that, and tickets are intended to enforce the limit, and the fines and points are intended to get people to stop and think about how they drive. And the insurance rates are because the insurance companies know that habitual speeders cause more accidents. If you speed you're a hazard to everyone on the road: yourself, and me, and everyone else. That's why they fine you, and put points on your license, and raise your insurance rates.

If you get a ticket and you were not actually speeding, buy all means contest it. That's what the courts are for. If you were speeding, pay your fine and slow the f*@% down so you don't kill somebody next time.
 
OMG... Nobody here even said anything close to that. Please stop putting words in our mouths.

What? You can't hear me? Try climbing down from the high horse you're on.

Of course nobody actually says that. But plenty of people (habitual speeders especially) act as though they believe it. If you're not a speeder, then none of this applies to you.

And what high horse? All I'm saying is, if you're caught speeding, pay the damn fine instead of trying to game the system and squirm out of it.
 
I do agree that if you are guilty, just pony up the money and move on. I have received one speeding ticket since 1969, and that was in 1981. I was driving an unfamiliar vehicle (Lincoln) and my speed got away from me. I paid the fine.

Fast forward to two incidents in the past 10-12 years that I have personal knowledge, because I was a passenger both times:

(1) Friend was driving 65/55 on a rural highway. We round a bend, and he sees a CHP has pulled over another motorist. I suggest that he slow down, because often here where there is one, there are more than one. Just past the officer, he drops his speed to 57/55. About 3 miles later, still driving 57ish, a CHP zooms up behind him and pulls him over. He pulls over, and gets cited for speeding--62 I think. I had noticed the tags on the first CHP vehicle (I wrote them down) and the tags on the vehicle driven by the officer who pulled him over did not match. My friend decides to fight the citation. He gets discovery on both vehicles and the officers who were assigned to them and the citations they issued that day. The second officer pulled my friend over two minutes after the time of day that was recorded on the citation issued by the officer that we passed originally.

The officer who issued the citation told a story to the judge about how he had clocked my friend at 64-65 while getting back into his patroll car. Once my friend showed the judge the discovery about the two different officers and the other citation issued to the other motorist, the judge cleared the courtroom. When we returned the officer was gone, and the judge dismissed the citation due to perjury.

(2) Another friend and I were driving back from the Bay Area one night. On a rural road he kept his speed at 54-55 (55 is the limit.) Out of the blue a car races up behind him and tailgates. My friend slows to 50 to let the driver pass, but the driver continues to tailgate. (The road was deserted; plenty of space to pass safely.) My friend then speeds up to 58, and the car behind speeds up too. This goes on for about 90 seconds to two minutes. Finally, my friend is tired of this jerk behind us, so he accelerates to 64. Wham! The red lights go on.

He pleads not guilty. The officer testifies that observed a speeding vehicle back down the road and gave chase. My friend cross-examines him like Perry Mason with a question like, "Officer, suppose I were to show the Court my video camera's recording of the three minutes leading up to your traffic stop. What conclusion would the judge come to about your entrapment?" The officer recanted everything, and my friend's case was dismissed. The judge called my friend up to the bench and told him off the record that this was not the first time this sort of entrapment technique had been revealed in his courtroom.

Yes, both my friends were speeding. In the first story he is clearly guilty of speeding, but the CHP did not play by the rules established in our criminal justice system. While two wrongs do not make a right, the burden of proof is always on the prosecution, and the CHP did not meet the burden of proof. In the second story, the old police chestnut of entrapment was unfairly used to goad a driver into committing a driving infraction.

This is just my opinion--if we are to have a reasonably efficient functioning legal system for all crimes, whether infractions, misdemeanors, or felonies, the individuals charged with enforcing the laws must be above reproach in performing their duties. Anything less weakens the system and erodes the public's perception of law enforcement's credibility.
 
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Where did I claim to be morally or otherwise superior to other people? I just said if you're guilty, pay the damn fine.

I get where you are coming from but the way it's set up in most states is: fight the ticket,get a lower fine and decrease the points. That's just for showing up. Sure i'm guilty but it's a game. Cops for the most part don't care what you do with the ticket after it's handed out. This is from personal experience watching the court in action for many years.