Coronavirus

[dhanson865]

This is what the hospital systems collapsing into a critical state of crisis looks like. Care isn't ending, but people are dying because there isn't enough capacity to save everyone.



TN is in the lower 50% of states. At one time WA was #2, but it's now #8.
How High are Gas Taxes in Your State?

Per the tables the gas tax is only ~20 cents a gallon difference between TN and WA yet the price difference we were discussing was $2.75 vs $3.41 or ~65 cents a gallon so the state taxes aren't covering that gap. Something else has to explain the majority of that price difference.

For that matter AAA Gas Prices has the average price almost a dollar higher, so ~21 cents tax difference vs 97 cents price difference leaves a gap of ~75 cents that isn't explained by state taxes.

 

[bkp_duke]

I talked to a friend the other day who thought there "probably" was no chip in the vaccine, but he insisted it was possible. I pointed out to him that the syringe inner diameter is about the size of a hair. He apparently thinks that chips can be microscopic because he insisted that it was possible. I figure the only way to deal with people like that is to tell them that it would be a cheap way to get streaming video for free. At least he is vaccinated and supports vaccination because he figures there's "probably" no chip in the vaccine.

I'm always AMAZED by the mindset of these people. Clinical psychologists must honest to goodness have a field day with these people.

They are so anti-big Pharma, anti-Gov that they will HONESTLY believe this stuff . . . but when they are sick they want everything including the kitchen sink. Big Pharma produces those meds . . . and more than half the time Gov pays for their hospital stay.

Oh the irony.

 

[Doggydogworld]

Some waning of Moderna. This is a comparison of the original trial group vs. the unblinded control group, vaccinated later, during the Delta surge only. Be careful not to interpret this as 36%/46% improvement in absolute efficacy. This is a ~36%/46% improvement in efficacy, relative to the efficacy of an older Moderna vaccination. So for example if efficacy was 90% originally against infection, it would be something like 85% now for older vaccinations. Or if 95% effective against hospitalization, it would be 92-93% effective now. I think those would be the approximate numbers, anyway.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1440687378285219860

Anyway, time for boosters. It's important we keep elderly and at-risk people out of the hospital! With all the unvaccinated people filling the hospitals, we need to make sure the vaccinated people don't end up there (they don't want to be there, unlike the others). Need all the beds we can get! We'll accomplish ~90% of this goal or so by vaccinating the elderly again, probably.

(And of course we have to re-vaccinate front-line workers, so we have them fully protected, with no fear of working - and minimal sick time.)

Did this study include all in the original group, or did they exclude those who previously tested positive? Because there should be ~20x more people in the placebo group who acquired immunity the natural way and were thus less likely to test positive during this study period.

 

[daniel]

As @bkp_duke has said, mandating vaccines will get people shot. We can make it very painful to not be vaccinated, but mandates will likely not work in the current political climate.

BTW, gas is cheap there. I just looked and the cheapest gas around here is $3.41 a gallon (I had to look it up). Washington has a high gas tax. Between the high gas tax and cheap electricity owning an electric car is attractive in this state.



You can tell him that an engineer in the IC industry (me) told you that making chips that small is way beyond our current technology. The grain of rice chips put into animals is the current state of the art and the range of the chips is a couple of millimeters. You need to put the reader on the skin over the chip to read it.

Anything capable of transmitting any distance requires a battery and the further the distance, the larger the battery. If we had batteries that could power a transmitter for any length of time that could be made small enough to go into a syringe, we could scale that up and make Tesla's with 10,000 miles range on a single charge.

Another point my partner likes to make to people. Why would anyone want to go to all the trouble to develop a tracking chip to put in vaccines when people are allowing themselves to be tracked 24/7 with their cell phones? It's possible to not be tracked via your cell phone, but it takes work to change all the settings. I would expect that at least 95% of the people who think the vaccine has microchips in it are easily tracked via their cell phones.

I told him that stuff basically. He just doesn't believe it. People have watched enough movies where everything is possible that it's gotten into their heads that if you can imagine it, it will be possible some day, and maybe the government has it now. He's a Trumper, BTW.

And when I pointed out that Facebook and the government can track everybody right now through their cell phone, he said he doesn't have a cell phone. He often brags about being unable to use a computer. (And yet he is certain that he knows what's "possible.")

I'm always AMAZED by the mindset of these people. Clinical psychologists must honest to goodness have a field day with these people.

They are so anti-big Pharma, anti-Gov that they will HONESTLY believe this stuff . . . but when they are sick they want everything including the kitchen sink. Big Pharma produces those meds . . . and more than half the time Gov pays for their hospital stay.

Oh the irony.

On the positive side, he is vaccinated and supports a vaccine mandate for the canoe paddling club we both belong to (which is why I know him). And he's one of the people who are always there when there's work that needs doing at the club.

I've decided it's better to remain on friendly terms than to press an argument he's unable to hear.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Did this study include all in the original group, or did they exclude those who previously tested positive? Because there should be ~20x more people in the placebo group who acquired immunity the natural way and were thus less likely to test positive during this study period.

"Participants not considered at risk in the open-label phase were excluded from this analysis including those who (i) were Covid-19 or SARS-CoV-2 infection cases during the blinded phase, (ii) did not enter the open-label phase or received off-study Covid-19 vaccine, or (iii) became a case prior to the first dose of mRNA in the open-label phase."

It's not clear how they would exclude asymptomatic cases, but it's also not clear how common those are (people in these study groups probably have easy access to PCR testing though I'm not sure). Doesn't sound like they're doing antibody testing or anything.

Also note the two groups are not randomized, since receiving vaccination during the open-label phase was voluntary so that would introduce selection biases in the group who chose to be vaccinated (more old people and healthcare workers in the follow-up open-label group chose to be vaccinated).

In any case, it seems to me this waning (against infection; not clear it will be significant for severe disease) is expected for Moderna (just as it is for Pfizer), it's just the way things work, so probably there is some real signal here. Is this the appropriate magnitude of the signal? Who knows.

 

[EVNow]

They are so anti-big Pharma, anti-Gov that they will HONESTLY believe this stuff . . . but when they are sick they want everything including the kitchen sink. Big Pharma produces those meds . . . and more than half the time Gov pays for their hospital stay.

Oh the irony.

The same way people don't like lawyers.

BTW - it is possible to not like some of the things and yet forced to use those because there is no other choice.

Ofcourse people who hold placards asking the government to get the hell out of Medicare are a special breed. So are people who denounce "socialism" in meetings held in public school buildings.

 

[JRP3]

BTW - it is possible to not like some of the things and yet forced to use those because there is no other choice.

Not taking a vaccine because you don't trust big pharma but willing to take Ivermectin and other drugs made by the same big pharma?

 

[jerry33]

Not taking a vaccine because you don't trust big pharma but willing to take Ivermectin and other drugs made by the same big pharma?

It's either the lead in the water or the mercury in the fish.

 

[daniel]

Not taking a vaccine because you don't trust big pharma but willing to take Ivermectin and other drugs made by the same big pharma?

That's because, for the present, there are no YouTubers claiming there's a 5G chip in horse de-worming medicine.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Interestingly ACIP did not recommend boosters for healthcare and other frontline workers today; the vote failed. They may change their mind, but it is odd. In any case, most Pfizer-vaccinated people can get boosters after six months, because anyone over 18 with underlying conditions is recommended to get one on an “individual benefit” basis.

 

[ReddyLeaf]

Interestingly ACIP did not recommend boosters for healthcare and other frontline workers today; the vote failed. They may change their mind, but it is odd. In any case, most Pfizer-vaccinated people can get boosters after six months, because anyone over 18 with underlying conditions is recommended to get one on an “individual benefit” basis.

Unfortunately, or fortunately, most of the healthcare workers that I’ve seen in our area are clinically obese and could qualify on that technicality.

 

[wdolson]

The same way people don't like lawyers.

BTW - it is possible to not like some of the things and yet forced to use those because there is no other choice.

Ofcourse people who hold placards asking the government to get the hell out of Medicare are a special breed. So are people who denounce "socialism" in meetings held in public school buildings.

A lot of people don't actually understand the terms they throw around. Many times they sound like a toddler repeating things their parents said.

Not taking a vaccine because you don't trust big pharma but willing to take Ivermectin and other drugs made by the same big pharma?

Ivermectin is endorsed by the cult leader where the vaccine isn't.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Unfortunately, or fortunately, most of the healthcare workers that I’ve seen in our area are clinically obese and could qualify on that technicality.

As suspected might happen, the director of the CDC has overruled and allowed healthcare worker vaccination. Makes sense. My understanding is the only reason the vote went that way anyway was because of various technicalities of how it was phrased (included others as well as healthcare workers).

 

[daniel]

Ivermectin is endorsed by the cult leader where the vaccine isn't.

I thought the baboon actually had told people to get vaccinated and that he takes credit for developing the vaccine. Admittedly, I studiously avoid reading any news about him and don't watch tv news (I don't have tv) and I never look at Twitter.

 

[FlatSix911]

As suspected might happen, the director of the CDC has overruled and allowed healthcare worker vaccination. Makes sense. My understanding is the only reason the vote went that way anyway was because of various technicalities of how it was phrased (included others as well as healthcare workers).

Other factors were involved... including significant resistance by the largest healthcare workers' unions.

In California, a Mix of Support and Resistance to New Vaccine Rules

Some of California’s staunchest vaccine resisters are state employees and health care workers, all of whom will be required to get vaccinated or undergo testing starting next month.

www.nytimes.com

"But pockets of vaccine resistance have been stubborn, even in liberal-leaning California, where the vaccination rate is relatively high and where many people take the virus so seriously that they choose on their own to wear masks indoors or outdoors. Like the state as a whole, where about 52 percent of the population is fully vaccinated, the government and health care workforces and their unions include a striking number of vaccine resisters. Take S.E.I.U. Local 1000, which represents 96,000 state workers."

Here’s What’s Wrong With These Unions’ Vax Resistance

For those of us who don’t believe in forcing anyone to get the vaccine, their position is especially galling.

www.thedailybeast.com

"Health-care worker unions have, surprisingly, been at the forefront of protests against requiring members to be vaccinated. After California Governor Gavin Newsom announced last week that California would require its workers to be vaccinated, Service Employees International Union, which, according to the Wall Street Journal “represents 43% of California approximately 238,000 state employees” including health-care workers, said he was “appalled” at the move."

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Other factors were involved... including significant resistance by the largest healthcare workers' unions.

In California, a Mix of Support and Resistance to New Vaccine Rules

Some of California’s staunchest vaccine resisters are state employees and health care workers, all of whom will be required to get vaccinated or undergo testing starting next month.

www.nytimes.com

"But pockets of vaccine resistance have been stubborn, even in liberal-leaning California, where the vaccination rate is relatively high and where many people take the virus so seriously that they choose on their own to wear masks indoors or outdoors. Like the state as a whole, where about 52 percent of the population is fully vaccinated, the government and health care workforces and their unions include a striking number of vaccine resisters. Take S.E.I.U. Local 1000, which represents 96,000 state workers."

Here’s What’s Wrong With These Unions’ Vax Resistance

For those of us who don’t believe in forcing anyone to get the vaccine, their position is especially galling.

www.thedailybeast.com

"Health-care worker unions have, surprisingly, been at the forefront of protests against requiring members to be vaccinated. After California Governor Gavin Newsom announced last week that California would require its workers to be vaccinated, Service Employees International Union, which, according to the Wall Street Journal “represents 43% of California approximately 238,000 state employees” including health-care workers, said he was “appalled” at the move."

Sorry, lost context on my post (should have said boosting, not vaccination). This was about a third dose booster. I guess that is a separate battle; if you are fighting over the third dose, I think the anti-vaccination crusade has already been lost.

 

[EVNow]

Not taking a vaccine because you don't trust big pharma but willing to take Ivermectin and other drugs made by the same big pharma?

It seems there is a set of people who are so conspiracy-theory minded - they do exactly opposite of whatever the experts tell. They take their cue from some hacks who now have bigger reach than ever before (thank you Zuckerberg). Its like they are in a cult - nothing you do will make them come out of the cult.

 

[shinytop]

There are many with good reasons not to trust what the government says. How many time did Trump tell us we were going to have an new health policy soon. Ya, not in four years of a Congress his party controlled. I am a Vietnam veteran who is bitter about the government knowing in 1968 that the war was unwinnable yet we lost over half our casualties after that. Or the infection of black men with syphilis without their knowledge.

But I don't know of any public health issue where responsible people (I exclude Trump from that group) misled the entire country about how to fight the spread of a communicable disease.

 

[EVNow]

But I don't know of any public health issue where responsible people (I exclude Trump from that group) misled the entire country about how to fight the spread of a communicable disease.

Biden was fine with in-person voting in Florida during the primary because a quick, in-person voting benefitted him in the primary. (edit : I should say pushed hard for in person voting)

Politicians from both parties have made a lot of wild statements about Covid (since Feb '20). Some were reckless and some were blatant lies.

If we were as serious as - say NewZealand - we wouldn't have had 650k deaths.

 

[wdolson]

I thought the baboon actually had told people to get vaccinated and that he takes credit for developing the vaccine. Admittedly, I studiously avoid reading any news about him and don't watch tv news (I don't have tv) and I never look at Twitter.

He did in a speech about a month ago, but the message now is being driven by the Pillow Guy ad Fox News hosts.

Other factors were involved... including significant resistance by the largest healthcare workers' unions.

In California, a Mix of Support and Resistance to New Vaccine Rules

Some of California’s staunchest vaccine resisters are state employees and health care workers, all of whom will be required to get vaccinated or undergo testing starting next month.

www.nytimes.com

"But pockets of vaccine resistance have been stubborn, even in liberal-leaning California, where the vaccination rate is relatively high and where many people take the virus so seriously that they choose on their own to wear masks indoors or outdoors. Like the state as a whole, where about 52 percent of the population is fully vaccinated, the government and health care workforces and their unions include a striking number of vaccine resisters. Take S.E.I.U. Local 1000, which represents 96,000 state workers."

Here’s What’s Wrong With These Unions’ Vax Resistance

For those of us who don’t believe in forcing anyone to get the vaccine, their position is especially galling.

www.thedailybeast.com

"Health-care worker unions have, surprisingly, been at the forefront of protests against requiring members to be vaccinated. After California Governor Gavin Newsom announced last week that California would require its workers to be vaccinated, Service Employees International Union, which, according to the Wall Street Journal “represents 43% of California approximately 238,000 state employees” including health-care workers, said he was “appalled” at the move."

I would bet that most of this is regional. It's probably pretty low in the Bay Area and Los Angeles area, but very high in the San Joaquin Valley. There is a clear cultural divide between those living on the coasts and those inland in California. The same divide exists in Oregon and Washington too. I live very close to the edge of this zone and we have a very contentious municipal election coming up. The mayor's race was very heated until the pro-Trump guy got arrested for DV a week ago. We still have a similar dynamic going on for the school board elections.

I came across this video about the legality of Biden's vaccine mandates

We had a big discussion here about it a week or so back.