I hope you are correct, but my interactions with the nieces and nephews (20s and 30s) have caused me concerns. They view that this pandemic is over since none of their friends are getting real sick.
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Coronavirus
- Thread starter Wenche
- Start date
Very interesting website.
For the < 50 years old crowd, it's 30% hard-no.
Other significant factors that trend towards higher vaccination rates (looking at the will I get vaccinated answers other than "No"):
Education level: ~9/10 postgrads will get vaccinated compared to ~7/10 non-college grads.
Political party: ~9.5/10 Democrats will get vaccinated compared to ~7/10 Independents and ~6/10 Republicans.
Race: ~7/10 White people will get vaccinated compared to ~8.5 Black or African-American
The lowest likely group of people to get vaccinated?
~7 out of 10 18-34 year old, White, Non-college educated, Female, Republicans will NOT get vaccinated.
In the beginning my wife wished she could drag the COVID deniers through her ICU to see what COVID could do to people. Now the hospitals here are pretty well cleared out, but now it is her office that is full of long haulers. And now the deniers think because few people are being hospitalized that COVID isn't a problem. And only about 50% of the hospital staff has taken the vaccine. These people should all know better. What's the solution if people who have seen what COVID can do won't take it?
COVID vaccine acceptance is roughly equivalent to age in my practice, ie, 90yo almost 90% and 50 yo about 50%. Most of those 90 year olds that have not been vaccinated don't even realize they have missed their invites and with little nudging accept future invites, with some coaching on the how to navigate the system. The 50 year olds, unless by occupation, have yet to get an invite and I hope will change with time. I expect vaccine acceptance to increase with time but oncologists are very optimistic.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
J&J curves.
This one is going to be an interesting sell. Obviously I’d probably take it, and fortunately they are also looking at a two-dose version which will hopefully close the gap a bit. Might be a couple months though.
It’s pretty mediocre - and with the mRNAs out there just a difficult case to make. Way better than nothing though!
https://www.fda.gov/media/146217/download
Makes me consider how lucky we are that the mRNAs are the lead vaccines and continue to work so well. Not clear exactly how well they would work against the same set of variants as J&J, but I would suspect still better.
Maybe they should consider giving it only to younger people. And maybe also to people with prior confirmed PCR positive infection, for now.
Basically no doses available for a while, so kind of a non-issue until the end of March (only 20 million by then).
This one is going to be an interesting sell. Obviously I’d probably take it, and fortunately they are also looking at a two-dose version which will hopefully close the gap a bit. Might be a couple months though.
It’s pretty mediocre - and with the mRNAs out there just a difficult case to make. Way better than nothing though!
https://www.fda.gov/media/146217/download
Makes me consider how lucky we are that the mRNAs are the lead vaccines and continue to work so well. Not clear exactly how well they would work against the same set of variants as J&J, but I would suspect still better.
Maybe they should consider giving it only to younger people. And maybe also to people with prior confirmed PCR positive infection, for now.
Basically no doses available for a while, so kind of a non-issue until the end of March (only 20 million by then).
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Maybe require vaccination as a condition for employment in any job that involves interacting with the public, or working in a group setting, and for traveling on public transport.
I know several people who won't get the vaccine because they believe things that are demonstrably false or because of illogical reasoning. We've been getting so many lies on social media and right-wing media and from the previous federal government that a lot of people are scared of it. That's on top of a largely left-wing crowd of science-deniers that have mistrusted doctors since even before Dr. Wakefield published his fraudulent paper.
The solution to that would be a very long-term educational program that will be strongly opposed from crackpots on both sides. If 500,000 American dead and counting, and correspondingly large numbers elsewhere won't change their minds, I don't see what will.
BTW, I got mine. Pfizer because that's what was offered.
tmoz
S85D, Y LR, ex Prius PiP
I've heard the opposite. But yes, lots of opportunities to sigh ...
bkp_duke
Well-Known Member
Tell them to google "COVID Long-hauler" and ask if they want to take that chance.
A recent report (should be googleable, I didn't bookmark it) I read this week showed that >50% of people that had COVID in the past continued to have some degree of cardiac damage well after recovery. That's not something I would want to take a chance on.
New analyses show Johnson & Johnson’s one-dose vaccine works well.
The one-shot coronavirus vaccine made by Johnson & Johnson provides strong protection against severe disease and death from Covid-19, and may reduce the spread of the virus by vaccinated people, according to new analyses posted online by the Food and Drug Administration on Wednesday.
The vaccine had a 72 percent overall efficacy rate in the United States and 64 percent in South Africa, where a highly contagious variant emerged in the fall and is now driving most cases. The efficacy in South Africa was seven percentage points higher than earlier data released by the company.
The vaccine also showed 86 percent efficacy against severe forms of Covid-19 in the United States, and 82 percent against severe disease in South Africa. That means that a vaccinated person has a far lower risk of being hospitalized or dying from Covid-19.
The vaccine had a 72 percent overall efficacy rate in the United States and 64 percent in South Africa, where a highly contagious variant emerged in the fall and is now driving most cases. The efficacy in South Africa was seven percentage points higher than earlier data released by the company.
The vaccine also showed 86 percent efficacy against severe forms of Covid-19 in the United States, and 82 percent against severe disease in South Africa. That means that a vaccinated person has a far lower risk of being hospitalized or dying from Covid-19.
dhanson865
Well-Known Member
State investigation uncovers 2,400 vaccine doses expired in Shelby County, other issues with vaccine management
* The investigation uncovered seven instances of vaccine waste amounting to the loss of more than 2,400 doses. Previously, the health department reported the loss of about 1,300 vaccine doses.
* TDH personnel found six different expiration events between Feb. 3 and Feb. 12 and a seventh Feb. 15. Piercey said only the last incident was weather-related.
* Piercey said the waste incidents occurred when an entire tray of vaccine was defrosted but was more than needed. Instead of deploying the doses for distribution, they were allowed to expire.
* Piercey also said the investigation found 51,000 doses in inventory -- an excess of about 30,000 doses -- set to expire March 6.
* The investigation uncovered seven instances of vaccine waste amounting to the loss of more than 2,400 doses. Previously, the health department reported the loss of about 1,300 vaccine doses.
* TDH personnel found six different expiration events between Feb. 3 and Feb. 12 and a seventh Feb. 15. Piercey said only the last incident was weather-related.
* Piercey said the waste incidents occurred when an entire tray of vaccine was defrosted but was more than needed. Instead of deploying the doses for distribution, they were allowed to expire.
* Piercey also said the investigation found 51,000 doses in inventory -- an excess of about 30,000 doses -- set to expire March 6.
Interesting read (IMO) on/with Hilda Bastian
The scientist who’s been right about Covid-19 vaccines predicts what’s next
with some info on other vaccine developments.
The scientist who’s been right about Covid-19 vaccines predicts what’s next
with some info on other vaccine developments.
Some jurisdictions have such strict rules about who may get the vaccine that at the end of the day they find themselves with thawed doses and nobody to give them to. It's a case of unintended consequences. I don't know if that's what happened in the above case. But it can be difficult to exactly match the number of available doses to recipients without inviting extra people who then get turned away, or ending up with extra doses and nobody to give them to.
One of my sisters up in VA got it recently. Her husband, too. They're both microbiologists (and are retired from big pharma, etc.). Anyway, they had a somewhat different course through the thing from other people I've known. Their main symptom was extreme fatigue. No fever, no dry cough, no low pulse ox, no loss of taste/smell, etc. Her husband, who has several comorbidities, was got an offer by his doctor to be in a trial of Bamlanivimab through UVA. He had his infusion recently and reports no issues from it.
One thing I don't understand is this extreme fatigue. What causes it? I could understand how low oxygen could cause it but that isn't the case. For example, her husband was getting over the thing and decided to take his dog for a walk. A short time into the walk, he couldn't go any farther and turned around and went home straight to bed! I heard the same thing from a friend of my wife who had it months ago. She was ten days post infection and took the dog for a walk. Almost could not make it back home. Neither one had pneumonia or other lung involvement.
PS. I'm a computer programmer and, basically, allergic to Biology (I just don't get it!).
One thing I don't understand is this extreme fatigue. What causes it? I could understand how low oxygen could cause it but that isn't the case. For example, her husband was getting over the thing and decided to take his dog for a walk. A short time into the walk, he couldn't go any farther and turned around and went home straight to bed! I heard the same thing from a friend of my wife who had it months ago. She was ten days post infection and took the dog for a walk. Almost could not make it back home. Neither one had pneumonia or other lung involvement.
PS. I'm a computer programmer and, basically, allergic to Biology (I just don't get it!).
My wife and daughter both had it recently and had more "classic" symptoms. Main was fever, aches, some tiredness, and runny nose. My wife lost her sense of taste/smell and was hospitalized due to trouble breathing and low oxygen sats. Neither had any kind of bad cough. Both got back to normal fairly quickly after a rough week+ Yeah, it seems to hit people differently. Other than age and co-morbitities, I don't think we know well how to predict how it will affect a particular person.
By the way:
Add Gum Disease to List of Risk Factors for Severe COVID-19
By the way:
Add Gum Disease to List of Risk Factors for Severe COVID-19
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
You said no low pulse ox. Hmm. Did he measure pulse ox while walking? It seems to me it could drop transiently if things are out of whack but not “admit to the hospital” bad. Seems from the Wikipedia silent hypoxia page there is some evidence of this:
“A tool used to diagnose silent hypoxia is the "six-minute walk test," (6MWT), wherein a patient walks at a normal pace for six minutes, in order to monitor their physiological response.[19] It has been proven that, after performing the 6MWT, COVID-19 patients were more likely to develop exercise-induced hypoxia without symptoms than non-COVID-19 patients who suffered from idiopathic pulmonary fibrosis.[20] The condition can also be first detected by using prehospital pulse oximetry.[21][22]”
You say no pneumonia or lung involvement either though...did they get X-rays, etc, I guess? It does sound like it is perhaps hard to see some more “minor” damage via standard imaging, though (see below).
I don’t know about general fatigue, but the issues with exertion might be due to that silent hypoxia (even when recovering?). If you start exercising you quickly hit the limits and go anaerobic if your lungs are damaged. No hiding that you have no oxygen to work with at that point.
From OPINION EXCHANGE | What I learned during 10 days of treating COVID pneumonia
Three reasons why COVID-19 can cause silent hypoxia: Biomedical engineers use computer modeling to investigate low blood oxygen in COVID-19 patients
In the end it sounds like they don’t completely understand it but have gotten better at treating severe cases. Early intervention is key too - which is why seeking medical care in “mild” cases might be advisable. It may also be why Trump survived (or at least did not have more severe lung damage).
I don’t know though. Maybe the fatigue is something entirely different. Weird vascular disease. Don’t want to get it. 0.1% chance of death (for me) is really really bad! And considerably higher risk of lung damage.
I guess if pulse ox was normal while exercising that kind of rules that out.
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bkp_duke
Well-Known Member
Most likely due to cardiovascular involvement. The ACE2 receptor (the receptor that the S-protein binds to in order to enter the cell) is on most cells in the body, and early on in this pandemic it was discovered that heart involvement is VERY common.
If your heart is weakened, you cannot pump enough blood to the body, and you get extremely tired very quickly.
Even after this pandemic is over, this story won't be. There will be a lot of people with lasting heart conditions due to this, sadly.
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bkp_duke
Well-Known Member
You can still be "cardiac insufficient" with a normal pulse ox. You see it all the time in heart failure patients.
Their blood is oxygenated, but the pump (heart) is not pumping sufficiently to meet demands of the tissues.
Oxygenation = lung O2/CO2 exchange.
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