TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC

Cost to recharge Model 3

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by Oyinko, Aug 7, 2017.

  1. Oyinko

    Oyinko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2014
    Messages:
    34
    Location:
    San Francisco
    I would like to discuss cost of recharging a Model 3.

    I read on another thread that it needs 89kw to recharge fully a LR Model 3.

    I live in San Francisco and subscribed to CleanPowerSF to get 100% renewable energy. Last month my electricity bill was $25.70 for 115kwh used in one month:
    • $15.05 for P&G Delivery Charge
    • $10.65 for CleanPowerSF Generation charge.

    So it's about $0.22 per kWh.

    If my math are correct, this means that to fully charge a Model 3, the cost will be 89kw x$0.22 = $19.58 for 310 miles of range = $0.063 per mile.

    If I compare it with my BMW M235i, a full tanks cost about 12 gallons x 3.39 (premium) = $40.68 for about 350 miles of range = $0.116 per mile.

    I know that I probably do more like 22mpg with my M235i on average rather than the 30mpg that I calculated but I also expect to not get the full EPA range estimation with the Model 3.)

    I drive about 8000 miles per year so the savings will be about $424 per year. It's way below what Tesla advertise on their website and much lower than what I thought I would save by driving electric and with 100% renewable energy.
    Let's discuss :)
     
    • Like x 1
  2. TexasEV

    TexasEV Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2013
    Messages:
    5,119
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    The average American drives 12,000 miles/year. If you drive much less than that, your fuel expenses are less, so there's less to save by going EV.
     
    • Like x 2
  3. Oyinko

    Oyinko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2014
    Messages:
    34
    Location:
    San Francisco
    That would be $636 of saving with 12'000 miles.
     
  4. TaoJones

    TaoJones Beyond Driven

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2014
    Messages:
    1,353
    Location:
    The Americas
    There's no advantage in California at the current per kW rates at the SCs ($0.20/kW) or via a number of rate plans - versus a decent hybrid. A lot of Model 3 owners will be unpleasantly surprised at this.

    On the other hand, there are some plans that approach $0.10/kw and some will have solar, so there's that.

    Just another reason why I currently advocate the purchase of a higher mileage CPO AP1 Model S instead of a Model 3 at this time. Same money, more features, lower running costs over time. Once again, on the other hand, if you don't drive much, then never mind.
     
  5. gregincal

    gregincal Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2012
    Messages:
    2,742
    Location:
    Santa Cruz, CA
    That's expensive electricity. Do they have a time of day plan? I pay PG&E 8c per kWh overnight (what I don't produce myself with solar panels). Also, I think you'll find you get a lot closer to EPA around town with an EV than you currently do with your BMW.
     
  6. gregincal

    gregincal Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2012
    Messages:
    2,742
    Location:
    Santa Cruz, CA
    Lower running costs over time???? The Model 3 gets more miles per kWh, so it will have lower running costs.
     
  7. tracksyde

    tracksyde Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2013
    Messages:
    173
    Location:
    So Cal
    Lets not forget gas prices tend to rise over time. I'd like to believe electricity costs could go down over time. But thats probably not true with PG&E (or the other investor owned utilities).
     
    • Like x 2
  8. socbrian

    socbrian Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2017
    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Jersey
    Here in South Jersey, it is about $0.18 per kWh for I believe natural gas and nuclear mix. Also about $2.80 gallon of premium gas.
    Using your formula just my local prices..
    89kWh x $0.18 = $16.02 for 310 miles = 0.051 per mile = $413.42 per year (@8k miles per year)
    12g x $2.80 = $36.60 for 350 miles = 0.105 per mile = $836.57 per year (@8k miles per year)

    $423.15 savings pretty close to you.

    If I do 12k miles per year
    Tesla - $620.13
    ICE - $1254.86

    Savings - $634.73
     
  9. Brian Minick

    Brian Minick Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2016
    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    South Florida
    Geez...Florida electricity (FPL) is $.12kwh and I'm getting regular fuel for $2.25 a gallon...
     
  10. Stolz25

    Stolz25 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2017
    Messages:
    335
    Location:
    Tulsa, ok
    It's your electricity prices. Here I pay .08 per kW in prime time.
     
  11. SageBrush

    SageBrush Active Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2015
    Messages:
    3,685
    Location:
    Colorado
    #11 SageBrush, Aug 7, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2017
    Get solar

    Now, here is the real point:
    In 10 years you drive 80,000 miles and spent ~ $40k for the car, so about 50 cents a mile before maintenance, repairs, and insurance.
    Why are you agonizing over a couple missing pennies per mile in fuel charge savings ?
     
    • Like x 2
  12. Stolz25

    Stolz25 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2017
    Messages:
    335
    Location:
    Tulsa, ok
    There are plenty of reasons to live in California. Living cheap isn't one of them. To do that, you have to go somewhere no one else wants to live, like Oklahoma.
     
    • Funny x 2
    • Disagree x 1
  13. Oyinko

    Oyinko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2014
    Messages:
    34
    Location:
    San Francisco
    Are you also taking into account cost of generation and cost of delivery?
     
  14. Oyinko

    Oyinko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2014
    Messages:
    34
    Location:
    San Francisco
    I would tend to disagree with that. There is no reason that cost of electricity will decrease and I've also read that some state or countries are considering adding more taxes for EV drivers because they are not paying taxes on gas which is supposed to help maintain roads.

    So maybe we might see additional taxes on electricity if you plug your car at home...
     
  15. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2013
    Messages:
    12,567
    Location:
    San Mateo, CA
    I am on the SF Peninsula on PG&E's EV rate plan and I charge at night at less than $0.11/kWh.
     
  16. Oyinko

    Oyinko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2014
    Messages:
    34
    Location:
    San Francisco
    Not agonizing :) I don't need to buy a Model 3 so the 40K I will spent are only because I want a new toy. I had in mind, and I'm sure many more people too, that driving an electric car was a lot cheaper compared to ICE.
     
  17. tracksyde

    tracksyde Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2013
    Messages:
    173
    Location:
    So Cal
    Well, you could personally decrease your electricity cost by installing solar, as SageBrush suggested. But there are efforts to lower electricity costs for end-users, such as this one: L.A. County creates a lower-cost alternative for Southern California Edison customers

    Additionally, the increased "tax" on EV owners, as far as I know, is through vehicle registration. California recently moved to implement this, I believe. However, they ALSO increased gas taxes (California gas tax increase is now law. What it costs you and what it fixes)
     
  18. SageBrush

    SageBrush Active Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2015
    Messages:
    3,685
    Location:
    Colorado
    It is, if you find similar cars to compare one to another.
    And even in your case EV fueling is ~ 60% of petrol. You may not consider that a lot but ask your friend if they could buy petrol at a 40% discount for the next 10 years if they would consider that a lot cheaper.
     
  19. TexasEV

    TexasEV Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2013
    Messages:
    5,119
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    It is a lot cheaper with the proper time of use electric rate. As someone noted above he pays half your rate in that part of the state. But there's a limit to how much you can save if you're not spending much on gas to begin with. Anyway there are better reasons to drive an EV than the cost savings in electricity vs. gas.
     
  20. oktane

    oktane Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2016
    Messages:
    1,209
    Location:
    USA
    Agreed. Justifying the purchase of an electric vehicle by saving money on fuel is a silly argument. You are paying a huge premium on the cost of the car which easily wipes out any fuel savings.
     
    • Like x 2
    • Love x 1

Share This Page