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Could the Model 3 autopilot HW support up to Level 5 autonomous driving?

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by coupedncal, Sep 22, 2017.

  1. coupedncal

    coupedncal Member

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    Do we know if the Model 3 autopilot HW will support up to Level 5 autonomous driving? EAP is currently at Level 2 as far as i know.
     
  2. lunitiks

    lunitiks ˭ ˭ ʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽ ʭ ʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼ ˭ ˭

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    Short answer: No.

    Long answer: No.
     
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  3. coupedncal

    coupedncal Member

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    What about levels 3/4?
     
  4. lunitiks

    lunitiks ˭ ˭ ʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽ ʭ ʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼ ˭ ˭

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    Good question
     
  5. Phrixotrichus

    Phrixotrichus Member

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    Considering the sensor arrays we see in the development cars of basically everyone except Tesla my bet is that the current hardware will already have big problems with reaching level 3 and level 4 being completely out of reach for most situations.....
     
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  6. SlicedBr3ad

    SlicedBr3ad Member

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    If your read carefully, you'll realize they never promised lvl 5. They started fsd will work in most situations which is level 4.
     
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  7. lunitiks

    lunitiks ˭ ˭ ʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽ ʭ ʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼ ˭ ˭

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    SAE: "The full-time performance by an automated driving system of all aspects of the dynamic driving task under all roadway and environmental conditions that can be managed by a human driver."

    Tesla: "In almost all circumstances (...) no action required from the person in the driver's seat (...)"

    Forget L5. Never going to happen with AP2.0 or 2.5. Tesla hasn't even claimed that it will. (Well, except for the man himself.)

    My biggest concern in terms of L3+ HW, is actually the request to take over signalling (L3/L4).
    Audi, GM rattles and shakes your seat/seat belt in addition to light and sound. Tesla merely flashes something on your screen and beeps... Not that SAE defines how this request must be done, but I think Tesla's request could be stronger
     
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  8. Bebop

    Bebop Member

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    The assumption is yes of course. It says on the website plain and clear that it (along with the Model S and X) has the hardware for full self driving. It's been there since 2.0/EAP was introduced and since the Model 3 popped up on the website.

    In order for the Tesla Network to work, one would assume L5.
     
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  9. alseTrick

    alseTrick Active Member

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    Tesla is being misleading. No chance the current model 3 hardware is ever fully autonomous. But people will be suckered into buying "full self driving" package anyways.
     
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  10. Nuclear Fusion

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    Of course it would be level 5.
    Tesla would be sued into oblivion otherwise
     
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  11. anonim1979

    anonim1979 Member

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    No.

    There will be a CPU upgrade, to the one that Tesla is making with Samsung.

    Develop FSD *first* - then deploy hardware upgrade with enough power.

    Anyone that bought FSD now will get it for free, it is the software that is costly not the hardware if you are the owner of all the patents, etc. like Tesla will be in a deal with Samsung.
    Those that buy it later might pay more and not only 1000$ if they decide for it after delivery but before FSD will be ready.

    If LIDAR will be needed (govenment requiments for example) the mirrors could be replaced too - with ones with integrated LIDAR when that technology matures enough. And gets cheap enough.
    [​IMG]
     
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  12. diplomat33

    diplomat33 Member

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    The cameras, radar and ultrasonic sensors part of the hardware are enough for L5 autonomy which is why Tesla and Musk have said that Tesla cars have the hardware necessary for full self-driving. The unknown part is the computer power and the software. I think the current Model 3s will be able to do L3-4 autonomy with the right software. L5 will require further software updates and maybe a computer chip upgrade as well.
     
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  13. omgwtfbyobbq

    omgwtfbyobbq Member

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    I doubt it. The current description for FSD could be as low as really good SAE Level 2. As long as they deliver what they state on their website, they're good, independent of any puffery by salespeople/others.
     
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  14. MotoEvCA

    MotoEvCA Member

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    I was told by a Tesla representative the company would install the necessary hardware (as a retrofit) should the FSD option require it to meet the stated goals. Not a contractual obligation but a commitment from Tesla.
     
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  15. MotoEvCA

    MotoEvCA Member

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    How do you figure? There is no contractual obligation to provide Level 5 autonomy with anything currently on offer from Tesla.

    Most consumers do not understand contract law and are too arrogant to admit it. The forward-looking statements on the Tesla site regarding FSD are nothing more than marketing language.
     
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  16. SlicedBr3ad

    SlicedBr3ad Member

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    Level 2 is far cry from fill settle driving.
     
  17. SlicedBr3ad

    SlicedBr3ad Member

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    Thank you for digging this up. This is exactly what I was referring to in my post. There isn't even a promise of lvl 5. Always remember, sales and marketing always oversell vs actual/promised functionality and here, they're clearly promising SAE lvl4.
     
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  18. lunitiks

    lunitiks ˭ ˭ ʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽʽ ʭ ʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼʼ ˭ ˭

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    Picture time :)

    01 Hill tops summer.jpg

    02 Hill tops winter.jpg

    03 Dirt roads.jpg

    04 Blind spots.jpg

    05 Snow.jpg

    06 Snow.jpg

    07 Snow.jpg

    08 Extra careful.jpg
     
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  19. voip-ninja

    voip-ninja Member

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    Based on the number of executives and engineers working on FSD who have quit over Elmo's promises on self driving I think it's pretty clear the answer is no.
     
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  20. omgwtfbyobbq

    omgwtfbyobbq Member

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    They aren't promising level 4 based on the line I've underlined/italicized from their FSD description, outside of summoning in parking lots/driveways of course. With level 4, you can be anywhere in the car during the drive. It might promise level 3, but I'm not sure about that. Being designed to conduct trips with no action required could be really good level 2 depending on how they define an action.

    My guess is they intend to provide level 4 summoning in driveways/parking lots, level 3 in the specific situations they referenced, urban and freeway driving, better level 2 on suburban and rural roads, and who knows what offroad. But... because they don't use the same technical language SAE uses, I don't see anything that legally requires them to provide level 3 in urban/freeway driving.

    https://www.sae.org/misc/pdfs/automated_driving.pdf

     
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