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Cruise and autopilot not being used!
- Thread starter IanMcL
- Start date
If I were a betting man..... I'd bet that the system is technically capable of reading road signs but that Tesla have run into Patent / Contract / Licencing issues with the Mobileye system they used previously (AP1). That can read road signs on AP1, and all the other cars it's fitted to....
Fossil Fool
Member
There are almost no roundabouts in the US. Read into that what you will.
Lots of roundabouts in rural Arizona where I live. No electricity to power lights in many areas. This is the Wild West! Just got back from 3 weeks in UK driving an Audi A4. I hated that car compared to my M3. And yes, particularly for Yanks like myself, roundabouts with 6 or 8 exits are a challenge and I'll be amazed if technology ever handles them properly.
MrBadger
Badger out
The Mobileye patent is pretty specific - more than one way to skin a cat so to speak.
I think Tesla were playing catchup after Mobileye split and it was easier/quicker to do the GPS solution as a stop gap and let a more flexible visual solution fall out in the wash later, possibly to augment the GPS system and hopefully, one day, a v2i solution - connected to infrastructure.
Accepting that neither of us knows for sure and we're just speculating... I can believe what you're saying about the development timelines, but we know now that AP2/AP3 is reading STOP signs and traffic lights (in the US), so it's the tiniest of stretches to believe it's also capable of reading speed signs[1].
I confess I got my hopes up in the latest software update that had a whole paragraph about "temporary or changeable speed limits". Except a closer reading revealed this is the Autoroute-goes-slower-in-the-rain-and-that's-a-permanently-posted-restriction thing than we're-reading-sign-limits-on-overhead-gantries.
I mean I'm just soooo tired of pushing the AP lever down a few times to match the current limit on our "Smart" motorways instead of having Timmy the Tesla just pick it up and adjust for me.......
[1] = I remember a review I read of the first car I heard of with the Mobileye system (think it was a Ford Focus but that's not important), Journo heading down to Goodwood gets behind a coach in the middle of Midhurst (posted speed limit: 30. Actual speed limit: walking pace due to traffic and pedestrians). Car read the phone number on the back of the coach and set the speed limit to 100MPH......
A well-developed camera based system should have no trouble navigating a complex roundabout system PROVIDED it's well marked out.
The challenge comes when the markings are faded, or obscured by vegetation or a car blocking the way. And don't get me started on the 3-way junctions they've turned into mini-roundabouts that are impossible for anything bigger than an (original) Mini to use as intended so you just drive over the (painted) central reservation anyway....
...Sooner or later someone's going to post a link to Swindon's Magic Roundabout here, I can feel it in my water....
Turns out I was wrong, you've got about 5000 but that's in the whole country !! I've driven about 80k miles in the US and the only one I encountered was "the circle" in Washington, it was a tourist attraction at the time (admittedly about 20 years ago)
Whereabouts in Arizona do you live, been there a couple of times, great place to visit.
I'm adding my vote for the option of a dumb cruise control. I love almost every other aspect of the Model 3 but the Autopilot has been possibly the only area of disappointment so far. It often adds stress rather than reduces it! I can only think that part of the issue is down to our narrower lanes on motorways and other roads in comparison with US. Plenty of others have described the issues so I won't repeat them again but the unnecessary backing off and then accelerating back up to speed must reduce the overall efficiency of a long motorway journey.
I've got a Ford Fiesta that when driving along an A road and come to a village 30 limit I can click on the cruise to ensure I don't speed whilst I pass through for a mile or so. There are occasional cars parked at the side and traffic islands between lanes, neither of which the Tesla can cope with without having a panic.
I have a feeling that fully automated driving is going to be like the computing experience of accurate speech recognition. It was supposed to be a great thing in the mid 1990s but it took another 15 to 20 years before it overcame most of the flaws and benefitted from 1000 fold increases of computing power over the period in question.
I've got a Ford Fiesta that when driving along an A road and come to a village 30 limit I can click on the cruise to ensure I don't speed whilst I pass through for a mile or so. There are occasional cars parked at the side and traffic islands between lanes, neither of which the Tesla can cope with without having a panic.
I have a feeling that fully automated driving is going to be like the computing experience of accurate speech recognition. It was supposed to be a great thing in the mid 1990s but it took another 15 to 20 years before it overcame most of the flaws and benefitted from 1000 fold increases of computing power over the period in question.
I absolutely love TACC on my AP1 car. Its such an amazing stress reliever. I take every single opportunity to use especially on highways (doesn't matter whether its busy or not) and on some city streets where I'm not the first car in the line as it won't stop at a red light or Stop sign.
A couple of weeks ago I drove to New York City (a distance of 450 miles or 750 km) and at one point I had TACC on for about 2 hours straight. It was absolutely flawless. When I disengaged it to get off the highway, it felt very strange having to use my feet again.
AP1 on the other hand, I love it, but don't use it as much as it seems to add more stress to the driving compared to me steering the car.
A couple of weeks ago I drove to New York City (a distance of 450 miles or 750 km) and at one point I had TACC on for about 2 hours straight. It was absolutely flawless. When I disengaged it to get off the highway, it felt very strange having to use my feet again.
AP1 on the other hand, I love it, but don't use it as much as it seems to add more stress to the driving compared to me steering the car.
I've only had a test drive in an M3 so far. For me, ap was great on the motorway but, when I tried to engage TACC on a normal road it scared the **** out of me by accelerating wildly towards the car in front and a sharp corner (I was doing about 20 in a 30 zone at the time). I'm not looking forward to learning it's foibles....
I'd love it to have a dumb cruise option, or at least an option to engage at the current speed (or even just accelerate gently rather than full power)! It seems ridiculous that it engages at what it thinks is the posted speed limit.
As for roundabouts, I've never understood why people have such a problem with them. They are one way roads with junctions all on one side, looped back onto themselves and, for me, one of three simplest types of junction that exist.
I'd love it to have a dumb cruise option, or at least an option to engage at the current speed (or even just accelerate gently rather than full power)! It seems ridiculous that it engages at what it thinks is the posted speed limit.
As for roundabouts, I've never understood why people have such a problem with them. They are one way roads with junctions all on one side, looped back onto themselves and, for me, one of three simplest types of junction that exist.
MrBadger
Badger out
But they aren't though. They are a spiral where you may have to cross into the centre then spiral back out as you get closer to your exit point. Then you have small and large roundabouts, which behave very differently. Or the entry may be at an oblique angle (would like to see how cameras handle that), or exit may have a merge, or a blocker, or slow moving cyclist, or a keep clear box, or priority lanes... Roundabouts come in all different shapes, sizes, priorities etc and behave differently at different times of the day/week.
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What is your distance setting set to and what was your speed when it "accelerated wildly"? I find that when I am slow stop and go traffice, it works best when it is set to 3 and then at faster highway speeds I set it to 4. I don't experience any wild accelerations any more.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Not my experience at all. I use it all the time on dual carriageway, very occasionally on a major A-road; I drive 30,000 miles a year and arrive far more refreshed, on longer journeys, than ever I did "Before AP". And I've had AP "avoid incident" on 3 occasions, one of them which I might not have detected (traffic in front braked heavily just at the time I looked down at dashboard) and two of them moving in lane to avoid someone intruding into my lane in blindspot (I expect other driver would have sorted that out ... but maybe not)
I get some phantom braking when i am in contraflow with narrow lanes, but I'll forgive it that as some of the gaps between Juggernaut and concrete temporary median are a challenge ... but other than that I only have very occasional phantom-braking (not every trip, so I would guess once every 400 miles) , never once had it "lunge off the lane". I wonder if calibration of your sensors could be improved?
AP does waver when going over a crest, but that is predictable, and there are some edge conditions to be aware of - for example car in front changing lanes to reveal a parked-vehicle, which AP may not see.
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
Until fixed that's a flaw on the model-3. Can only engage TACC at "current speed limit", so if you are doing 30 MPH on a "national speed limit" road it will accelerate up to 60. You can change the speed up/down, but only on the screen, which isn't very "slick"
Model-S/X have a dedicated TACC/AP stalk, and one of its "movements" signals "Engage TACC at current speed" and it is also capable of "Engage at previous set speed" to resume after a disconnection (e.g. braking).
That's been my experience of TACC in other cars too ... so Model-3 needs that IMHO - perhaps: Press talk down AND HOLD (for a second or two) to engage at current-speed
In absence of that the easiest way is to engage TACC when following another vehicle, thus preventing "wild acceleration"
I have read that if you keep your foot on accelerator, when engaging, that will override TACC and you can change speed (on screen) before releasing accelerator. I've not tried it though, so don't know if it actually works. Even if it is a work-around its far from ideal ...
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