Dangerous Freeway Autopilot Slowdown

[CheezyNachos]

re: "its a beta"

Autopilot and Full Self-Driving Capability | Tesla Support

Autopilot is an advanced driver assistance system that enhances safety and convenience behind the wheel. When used properly, Autopilot reduces your overall workload as a driver. Learn more about Autopilot.

www.tesla.com

Isn't this just vanilla Autosteer & Traffic-Aware Cruise Control, which is very much not beta?
We aren't complaining about the handling of lane changing, on/off ramps, local roads, stop signs, etc.. this is just.. drive in the lane on the highway.

Re: "it's a beta"

What are you confused about?

 

[sjg98]

Yes. It's beta

Yes, it is "vanilla Autosteer & Traffic-Aware Cruise Control" and it's still beta.


Phantom brakes or what the release notes called "false slowdowns" are still happening so that is why it is still beta.

Did you click the actual Tesla support link?
They enumerate which features are beta, and "vanilla Autosteer & Traffic-Aware Cruise Control" are not shown as beta.

 

[gaspi101]

Yeah this looks bad for AP. GPS was definitely off and thought you were in a completely different spot.

I think it also looks bad for you. Filming with a phone while AP is actively malfunctioning? Why not do the safe thing and disengage it and drive your self instead of endangering others around you?

I appreciate the comment. I had the steering wheel solidly under control and the accelerator held down, in control of any additional heavy breaking. Perhaps not exemplary conduct but in control nonetheless.

 

[sjg98]

Re: "it's a beta"

What are you confused about?

I'm confused by Tesla's own confused messaging. You sent a screen from the owners manual. Did you click through to the support page which does not match?

 

[gaspi101]

I'm confused by Tesla's own confused messaging. You sent a screen from the owners manual. Did you click through to the support page which does not match?

View attachment 749351

Yeah, this is certainly misleading if every single item on the list is technically “Beta.” But TACC has been available since September of 2014. How many years until it’s out of “beta,”? certainly Tesla advertises it as a standard feature of every vehicle…maybe I‘m u reasonable in the expectation that a standard feature that’s been available for more than 6 years should not just slam the brakes on the highway when it suddenly gets the wrong GPS data. But that’s just me.

 

[CheezyNachos]

Yeah, this is certainly misleading if every single item on the list is technically “Beta.” But TACC has been available since September of 2014. How many years until it’s out of “beta,”? certainly Tesla advertises it as a standard feature of every vehicle…maybe I‘m u reasonable in the expectation that a standard feature that’s been available for more than 6 years should not just slam the brakes on the highway when it suddenly gets the wrong GPS data. But that’s just me.

I agree completely. Still, it is listed as beta.

 

[EVNow]

Edit: for clarity, the slamming down of the brakes happened BEFORE I started recording video. The video shows the car rapidly changing max AP speeds from 55/40/15mph while on the highway, and I’m holding down the accelerator to keep the car from doing it again.

You would get better response if you don’t use clickbait titles. The audio sounds like bad acting, too.

This is a serious issue. Present it factually.

 

[sjg98]

Yeah, this is certainly misleading if every single item on the list is technically “Beta.” But TACC has been available since September of 2014. How many years until it’s out of “beta,”? certainly Tesla advertises it as a standard feature of every vehicle…maybe I‘m u reasonable in the expectation that a standard feature that’s been available for more than 6 years should not just slam the brakes on the highway when it suddenly gets the wrong GPS data. But that’s just me.

Yes and I am increasingly worried about Tesla's priorities / peoples attitudes around AP/FSD.
Tesla is attempting to make the car be able to self drive handling highways, local roads, traffic signals, interactions with pedestrians, merges, turns, etc...
But it's really hard so its all beta.
But that beta includes the parts of the system that are common and available on a wide range of competitors - TACC/lane changing/auto-steer ..

So we're just supposed to hold tight with like "hey its just a beta" and not be demanding of at least the basics working while they figure out the moonshot?

 

[Tam]

I'm confused by Tesla's own confused messaging. You sent a screen from the owners manual. Did you click through to the support page which does not match?

You've got the point that the webpage clearly marks that only 2 features are "beta" (Navigation on Autopilot, Traffic and Stop Sign Control), and the rest are not labeled as "beta".

The manual says these are beta while the webpage does not:

1) TACC
2) AutoSteer
3) Summon/Smart Summon

The manual does not say "Auto Lane Change" is beta. Maybe that's because it's part of Autopilot/Navigation on Autopilot which is.

The manual does not say "AutoPark" is beta but historically, when there's an AutoPark accident, Tesla would refuse to cover the damage citing "beta".

So, you are right that it's confusing.

 

[cjxmtn]

Yeah the rapid deceleration/phantom braking events are dangerous, and really need to be addressed.. but couldn't you have just turned AP off? If you're not in AP or TACC, then it won't brake for you.

 

[Tam]

Yeah the rapid deceleration/phantom braking events are dangerous, and really need to be addressed.. but couldn't you have just turned AP off? If you're not in AP or TACC, then it won't brake for you.

Yes. Consumers can certainly drive manually.

But consumers want Tesla to fix it rather than consumers having to fix their behaviors themselves.

 

[TresLA]

This just seems like a GPS error and nothing to do with Autopilot. My old Acura had this issue sometimes, but would eventually get a correct reading to place the car location correctly. Should this happen? No, and Tesla should look into it (you should probably submit a service ticket in the Tesla app). But from even the beginning of the video, it seems like a bad situation made worse by user error. Just cancel Autopilot. Your GPS location is obviously off (from the map), so any car maker's features that depend on location to function correctly (in this case Autopilot) would be expected to not work.

 

[Lloyd]

There are times and places where GPS is purposely degraded. GPS is not full-proof and the car is not at fault.

How about changing the title to: HAD TO TAKE OVER FROM AUTOPILOT ON THE FREEWAY WHEN I DIDN'T WANT TO

 

[jimgardner99]

I've seen this happen with maps that are not updated for road changes on Interstate 75 between Bradenton and Sarasota Florida. Once you see it once, you know it is going to be a problem area, and I disengage Autopilot until it realizes it is back on 75. Safe thing to do is disengage AP.

 

[EVNow]

There are times and places where GPS is purposely degraded.

How is that possible ? Link ?

Or is that a conspiracy theory ?

Yeah the rapid deceleration/phantom braking events are dangerous, and really need to be addressed.. but couldn't you have just turned AP off? If you're not in AP or TACC, then it won't brake for you.

It’s clear to me OP wanted to make a spectacle of it for whatever reason. Normal human behavior would be to disengage when the car does something truly dangerous.

 

[cjxmtn]

Yes. Consumers can certainly drive manually.

But consumers want Tesla to fix it rather than consumers having to fix their behaviors themselves.

of course, but the in the video he makes it sound like it's driving him to his death, and his post is literally "i almost died on the highway [thanks to tesla]" .. we all experience crazy events, but if my car starts decelerating, I naturally hit the gas to keep the car going where I want it to, if it keeps doing it, I turn AP off an manually drive, I don't keep it going and claim that it's super difficult to keep pressing the gas.. same thing if I turn off AP and TACC takes over and accelerates, I sense that it's doing what I don't want it to do and hit the paddle up to turn it off before the car does something I don't want it to do.

 

[Lloyd]

How is that possible ? Link ?

Or is that a conspiracy theory ?


It’s clear to me OP wanted to make a spectacle of it for whatever reason. Normal human behavior would be to disengage when the car does something truly dangerous.

GPS.gov: GPS Accuracy

Information about GPS accuracy

www.gps.gov

Reading,.... Intentional degrading was halted in 2007 by Clinton, but the ability to degrade the system by the military remains. I was told that an area around the president is purposely degraded (not verified). Flights are not allowed.

 

[EVNow]

GPS.gov: GPS Accuracy

Information about GPS accuracy

www.gps.gov

Where does it say GPS is “purposely degraded” ?

I’m well aware of GPS accuracy etc otherwise.

 

[cjxmtn]

GPS Selective Availability has been turned off since the mid 90s, while it COULD be activated during war time, citizenry is far too reliant on it these days. That said, there are exercises where GPS is purposefully made inaccurate for wartime exercises and aviation gets a big warning about it.

IE: GPS Testing Part of Military Training this season |

also: GPS jamming expected in Southeast during military exercise

 

[JulienW]

What I dislike and SOOOOO many (not just the OP) LOVE to say is SLAMMED on the brakes. While a sudden slow down can be disorienting and seem dramatic it is a far cry from slamming on the brakes. If Tesla slams on the brakes YOU WILL KNOW IT. I had it happen to me when a car pulled into the HOV lane in front of me. You will get a Forward Collision Warning and a full size red steering wheel in the display with lots of beeping, seatbelt will tension you back in the seat, you will be thrown forwards with about 1G of force and the antilock brakes will be nosily working.