Degradation of the Community...

[JRP3]

Did I say there was a problem? I simply provided an example contrary to your claim, i.e. "I can not think of any group of non-Tesla owning fans of other brands that were here making "backhanded comments about Tesla"."
I would suggest that attacking Tesla products on a Tesla forum is questionable behavior. I don't spend time on other product forums attacking products which I don't own.

 

[Doug_G]

Look through the Chevy Bolt thread and you'll find at least two consistent posters doing exactly that.

If it's a Bolt owner posting pro-Bolt comments in the Bolt thread, I suppose that's reasonable.

But if someone comes here posing as an enthusiast for another vehicle, and his only contribution is to make negative comments Tesla, then he's probably a troll.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Did I say there was a problem? I simply provided an example contrary to your claim, i.e. "I can not think of any group of non-Tesla owning fans of other brands that were here making "backhanded comments about Tesla"."

Fair.

I would suggest that attacking Tesla products on a Tesla forum is questionable behavior. I don't spend time on other product forums attacking products which I don't own.

In a Chevy Bolt thread, though?

I guess this just wasn't the problematic behavior I had in mind when I wrote about non-Tesla owners making "backhanded comments about Tesla". I was thinking more along the lines of Tesla related threads being full of BMW owners. Not about Chevy Bolt thread being filled with Chevy Bolt owners.

Interestingly, the same Chevy Bolt thread also has a lot of non-Chevy Bolt owners making backhanded comments about it.

 

[JRP3]

n a Chevy Bolt thread, though?

Occasionally they pop up in other threads as well. Again, not a big deal, but it exists, contrary to your claim.

 

[JRP3]

Interestingly, the same Chevy Bolt thread also has a lot of non-Chevy Bolt owners making backhanded comments about it.

Usually provoked. And again, this is a Tesla forum.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Usually provoked. And again, this is a Tesla forum.

I kind of see your point... but then again... hmm. I'm really considering your point, though, trust me.

There are, for example, a lot of threads on TMC talking bad about dealerships of competing brands. Completely unprovoked.

I guess for me this comes down to: I don't consider negative comments a problem. Any context usually has negative comments, because any topic has pros, cons and likes and dislikes for different people...

One person's positive commenter is another person's negative commenter. On TMC there are a lot of "Tesla positive" people who say a lot "negative" things about other car brands, for example - that's of course part why they chose/are choosing Tesla. But at the same time, these are not "positive" people objectively speaking, they are negative.

I wonder if you are sort of advocating bubbles where people choose a brand and then stay positive within that bubble - and negative against things outside of that bubble? Would that be sort of accurate what you consider OK?

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Occasionally they pop up in other threads as well. Again, not a big deal, but it exists, contrary to your claim.

I'm more wondering/pondering than claiming anything, to be sure.

 

[JRP3]

I guess for me this comes down to: I don't consider negative comments a problem.

Again, as I clearly stated above, did I say it was a problem? And once again, I will clearly state, as I already have, that I am simply pointing out that your claim was wrong. I would suggest you simply accept that you were wrong, stop trying to find ways to make yourself right, and move on.

 

[bro1999]

There is way more dumping on the Bolt in the Bolt thread than any "sniping" of Tesla. This being a Tesla forum, that is to be expected.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Again, as I clearly stated above, did I say it was a problem? And once again, I will clearly state, as I already have, that I am simply pointing out that your claim was wrong. I would suggest you simply accept that you were wrong, stop trying to find ways to make yourself right, and move on.

I think we have different goals on this one, I am trying to understand @stopcrazypp's and @anticitizen13.7's points and see if they are large or small problems - or even non-existent problems. I probably worded myself poorly, I thought the comment "But I genuinely can't think of many that fits @stopcrazypp's description." suggested that I'm not saying there aren't any... if that's how it reads, obviously I wrote wrong there. I think that goes without saying.

But this is harping on a detail of a wider conversation, which was does TMC have a problem of other brand fans disturbing Tesla talk here. And I am still not convinced - certainly not by your example of a Chevy Bolt thread - that there is such a prevalent problem. To me it seems most "negative-on-Tesla" posters are actually Tesla owners. And this results from disappointing experiences with Tesla, such as with the Performance model limitations or AP2. And that should be fair enough by any standard.

If someone disagrees, I would love see some counter-points on that - I don't claim to follow the entire forum for example - but I can't think of this type of phenomenon happening here at this time.

(Now, as an additional point, I don't find Chevy Bolt owners contributing problematic at all. It provides context and insight. But that's a separate conversation.)

 

[Krugerrand]

IMO, this is over-simplification of how communications work.

Of course you think it's an oversimplification. That's the whole point. That's why you continue to believe there are communication problems between people on this forum when in fact for the most part there are not, and any true ones I've seen have all been quickly resolved.

Communication is not hard. You purposely make it hard. I've told you many times to use the KISS method particularly to converse with me and yet you straight up refuse. I say it's a cat and you say well it could be a cat and I don't doubt you think it's a cat but it might be a donkey, we just don't have enough evidence to confirm it's a cat so we need to leave the possibility open that it's a donkey or maybe even a giraffe. You do that every time you post. You just did it to Bonnie and to me yet again.

You do convolute and I'm not the only one who's told you that. It's not explaining and you know it's not. There's nothing to explain, it's a cat.

As said, one of my great regrets here are the several prominent posters who do not "get" me. That is my failing as well as, I guess, in part theirs. If attempts at explanation are seen as hostile from the get-to, they will never reach the listener - and that is IMO unfortunate.

It's because you refuse to hear what they've told you time and time again, so intent are you to explain it all away as something entirely different rather than simply taking what they've said at face value and stop doing it. I can only assume then that you're being purposely obtuse and doing it to irritate people. There's no other logical 'explanation' because I don't believe you're slow.

I have literally told you how to communicate with me and instead you want to insist I don't know how I want to be communicated with. It's a cat. Just that simple.

 

[Krugerrand]

Fair enough. Though what's the problem in a Chevy Bolt thread in a relevant all-brand sub-forum. I'd assume we'd welcome Chevy owners there?

Another example of you not taking a poster's words at face value and turning the discussion into a convoluted mess.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Another example of you not taking a poster's words at face value and turning the discussion into a convoluted mess.

I acknowledged the poster with fair enough and expressed a follow-up question. The answer could have been "No problem IMO" and that would have been that, too.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Of course you think it's an oversimplification. That's the whole point. That's why you continue to believe there are communication problems between people on this forum when in fact for the most part there are not, and any true ones I've seen have all been quickly resolved.

Communication is not hard. You purposely make it hard. I've told you many times to use the KISS method particularly to converse with me and yet you straight up refuse. I say it's a cat and you say well it could be a cat and I don't doubt you think it's a cat but it might be a donkey, we just don't have enough evidence to confirm it's a cat so we need to leave the possibility open that it's a donkey or maybe even a giraffe. You do that every time you post. You just did it to Bonnie and to me yet again.

You do convolute and I'm not the only one who's told you that. It's not explaining and you know it's not. There's nothing to explain, it's a cat.



It's because you refuse to hear what they've told you time and time again, so intent are you to explain it all away as something entirely different rather than simply taking what they've said at face value and stop doing it. I can only assume then that you're being purposely obtuse and doing it to irritate people. There's no other logical 'explanation' because I don't believe you're slow.

I have literally told you how to communicate with me and instead you want to insist I don't know how I want to be communicated with. It's a cat. Just that simple.

We can agree to disagree on communication being hard. I still continue to think it is one of the hardest things of the human condition, not just for me, but objectively speaking.

As for using a more direct method of communication with you and some other members, that may well be good advice. I will certainly consider it. Lenghty, pondering responses are certainly not suited between all people.

 

[Krugerrand]

I acknowledged the poster with fair enough and expressed a follow-up question. The answer could have been "No problem IMO" and that would have been that, too.

No you didn't. You straight up told the original poster what they observed on the forum didn't happen and went into a huge 'explanation' why they had it wrong. Then they had to 'explain' why your explanation of why they had it wrong was wrong. Then you asked a loaded question.

Convolution at its best.

 

[Krugerrand]

We can agree to disagree on communication being hard.

You can agree to disagree but I won't. It's a cat.

As for using a more direct method of communication with you and some other members, that may well be good advice. I will certainly consider it. Lenghty, pondering responses are certainly not suited between all people.

'May well be'?! Are you for real? There you go again. I'm telling you point blank the truth of the matter and how to resolve your 'regret' and you say 'may well be'.

You regret nothing. Anyone who regrets an outcome makes different decisions and incorporates different actions so the outcome changes to their liking. You've made no attempt and therefore contribute to the degradation of the community. Acknowledging one's role isn't enough either, you actually have to change and be part of the solution.

 

[bonnie]

You can agree to disagree but I won't. It's a cat.



'May well be'?! Are you for real? There you go again. I'm telling you point blank the truth of the matter and how to resolve your 'regret' and you say 'may well be'.

You regret nothing. Anyone who regrets an outcome makes different decisions and incorporates different actions so the outcome changes to their liking. You've made no attempt and therefore contribute to the degradation of the community. Acknowledging one's role isn't enough either, you actually have to change and be part of the solution.

Haha.

I used to tell my ex, when he was rabid on a point & I didn't want to discuss further, "You may well be right." It satisfied him, but I knew I wasn't agreeing with a thing. He MIGHT be right, but he might not be. And I knew exactly what I was doing, as does anyone who uses that particular wording.

Good times.

 

[AnxietyRanger]

No you didn't. You straight up told the original poster what they observed on the forum didn't happen and went into a huge 'explanation' why they had it wrong. Then they had to 'explain' why your explanation of why they had it wrong was wrong. Then you asked a loaded question.

I misunderstood @JRP3 the first time. My bad. Once he re-explained, I acknowledged with: "Fair."

You can agree to disagree but I won't.

OK.

'May well be'?! Are you for real? There you go again. I'm telling you point blank the truth of the matter and how to resolve your 'regret' and you say 'may well be'.

I do consider it going forward - any ambivalence is just me processing it.

You regret nothing. Anyone who regrets an outcome makes different decisions and incorporates different actions so the outcome changes to their liking.

Regret is independent of change IMO.

I didn't want to discuss further, "You may well be right." It satisfied him, but I knew I wasn't agreeing with a thing. He MIGHT be right, but he might not be. And I knew exactly what I was doing, as does anyone who uses that particular wording.

Not everyone is the same - and I added that will consider it. I am thinking about what Krugerrand said going forward.

 

[Carl]

As the late Tom Magliozzi of Car Talk would say about arguments with your spouse: you know you're right, of course you're right, but isn't it better to be happy?

BTW: @AnxietyRanger's post were just now getting considerably shorter and more to-the-point . OK, not yet as @Krugerrand would like, but give him/her a break.

 

[brianman]

It's a cat

I want to learn more about this cat. (The one in the profile pic, not the Goldilocks poster.)