contaygious
Active Member
Does this mean even if I drive away with the car in dec that I might not get the tax benefit because the title could take longer? If so I'm going to try to pay and get title way before I pick it up.
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Delivery and tax implications
- Thread starter JRP3
- Start date
Does this mean even if I drive away with the car in dec that I might not get the tax benefit because the title could take longer? If so I'm going to try to pay and get title way before I pick it up.
artsci
Sponsor
That's a bummer. You'd think all buyers would be given the privilege and honor of a tour. It penalizes those of us who don't live in California or within reasonable distance of the factory, and if we do arrange delivery at the factory (even the hybrid approach suggested) exposes us to tax possible tax losses.
That's my understanding from the IRS quote that has been posted to the forum (and which I can't find now, grrrr). It makes sense in that you aren't the official owner until the date on the title, and only the first owner can claim the credit.
Local incentives may be different in every state. The federal tax credit is the same across all states and relates to the 'date vehicle was placed in service'. Take a look at Form 8936.
The date the vehicle was placed in service does not require title to be in your name. The transaction had to have occured and the vehicle had to be working.
Here in California, I purchased a vehicle on Wednesday, December 28, 2011 and did not receive the title until late February 2012. I paid the registration fee in 2011. The transaction occured in December 2011 and vehicle was placed into service in 2011.
I think it would be hard to claim the vehcile was accepted and placed into service if you did not inspect the vehicle in person and 'accept' it, especially if the vehicle was still at the factory.
How would the IRS know if you were in physical possession of the vehicle or not? Can't see how it would matter, you can buy something and own it without ever seeing it or taking physical possession, land is a prime example.
Krugerrand
Meow
Did you get a tour or have an opportunity of a tour of the factory of the last car you purchased?
It's a courtesy, not a privilege, to get a tour.
That's incredibly disappointing. I can't take delivery in CA, but I do visit the area every year or so and really wanted to do the tour.
artsci
Sponsor
I do agree that it's a courtesy. But Tesla is not just another car company, and given how it's customized the entire car buying process I would argue that a factory tour should be a courtesy extended as an option to anyone who buys the car. We are Tesla's very own marketing and sales force and I think Tesla knows that.
The irs information about the credit here says: "For purposes of the 30D credit, a vehicle is not considered acquired prior to the time when title to the vehicle passes to the taxpayer under state law."
And at least in California, the law here says that tile is considered transferred when:
The transferor has delivered to the department or has placedin the United States mail addressed to the department the appropriatedocuments for the registration or transfer of registration of thevehicle pursuant to the sale or transfer except as provided inSection 5602.[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]By my (non-legal) reading the important date in California is the date when they send off the title paperwork (which is presumably when you pay for the car). I would imagine that generally you don't want to take title to the car until it's delivered, because otherwise if something happens during delivery it's already your car.[/FONT]
And at least in California, the law here says that tile is considered transferred when:
The transferor has delivered to the department or has placedin the United States mail addressed to the department the appropriatedocuments for the registration or transfer of registration of thevehicle pursuant to the sale or transfer except as provided inSection 5602.[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]By my (non-legal) reading the important date in California is the date when they send off the title paperwork (which is presumably when you pay for the car). I would imagine that generally you don't want to take title to the car until it's delivered, because otherwise if something happens during delivery it's already your car.[/FONT]
Form 8936 instructions refer to section 30D for specific details. And the IRS code has this to say:
SCW-Greg
Active Member
That's not right. It seems *any* Tesla Owner should be able to get a factory tour. I'm sure if you were press you could get one. Keep the pressure up, and I'm sure they'll have a change of heart.
Right, so no physical possession of the vehicle is necessary, Tesla just sends you the title and you own it.
True, I did not press. I was heading down to California earlier this month (from Seattle), and called ahead to see whether I could arrange a tour. The person I spoke with was pretty definite. He said Tesla did not yet have a program for giving tours to the general public. I got sort of snippy and said, "I just signed an agreement to pay Tesla over $100k. I think that should make me more special than the general public." He simply repeated that tours are not available. I suppose I could have asked to speak to his supervisor. Perhaps we all should send a note to GB?
In California, the DMV answers the following question:
These conditions are must be met before Tesla gives you the keys. If you give the keys to the transport driver so your vehicle can be delivered to another state then you have fulfilled the requirements for the credit.
So then it is your position that I as a none CA resident have met this requirement even if I have none of the paperwork to register and title said vehicle in my state? Would this be the position of a tax accountant?
If you wanted to accelerate the transaction (purchase) so you could claim the $7,500 tax credit in 2012 then you could accept the car in California and then have it shipped to your state.
You would have a signed purchase agreement, paid the full purchase price, and 'accepted' the vehicle in a bona fide transaction. Registration of the vehicle in your state could be after the purchase of the vehicle.
I don't believe that accepting the vehicle triggers CA tax. You could accept the car and even drive it on a dealer plate (Tesla employee required). As long as the car leaves the state on a common carrier, no tax is due.
Similar threads
