Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Discussion of NOAA Regulation affecting SpaceX

Nikxice

Active Member
Oct 31, 2014
1,117
1,890
Hudson, NH
From NOAA's website for Commercial Remote Sensing Regulatory Affairs, "It is unlawful for any person who is subject to the jurisdiction or control of the United States, directly or through any subsidiary or affiliate to operate a private remote sensing space system without possession of a valid license issued under the Act and the regulations." What a bunch of red tape. I took a look at the licensing application process. It looks worse than standing in line at the DMV.
 

HVM

Savolainen
Oct 30, 2012
1,157
2,030
Finland
DZjEN9pWkAAYFMX.jpg

Eric Berger @SciGuySpace
Eric Berger on Twitter

Ha Ninja!
 
Last edited:

Cosmacelf

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2013
8,640
20,985
San Diego
I'm pretty liberal in my politics, but this is symptomatic I think of why a lot of people hate government.

Yes. Bureaucracies cannot move fast enough to make intelligent decisions. They must rely on rules that have been approved beforehand. So they are always behind the curve. Always. Other reasons why we hate the government include cost plus contracting which incentivizes cost overruns, and generally poor execution of core mandates no matter how much money you throw at them (witness the Model X crash fatality that should have been prevented if cal trans had done their job). Add in politicization of supposedly independent agencies and you almost have an explosive mix.

This is why privatization of government agencies is usually a good thing. Imagine how much better cal trans would operate if you relied on a private company to replace safety barriers. You’d have same day replacement.
 

S'toon

Knows where his towel is
Apr 23, 2015
3,702
3,644
AB
Yes. Bureaucracies cannot move fast enough to make intelligent decisions. They must rely on rules that have been approved beforehand. So they are always behind the curve. Always. Other reasons why we hate the government include cost plus contracting which incentivizes cost overruns, and generally poor execution of core mandates no matter how much money you throw at them (witness the Model X crash fatality that should have been prevented if cal trans had done their job). Add in politicization of supposedly independent agencies and you almost have an explosive mix.

This is why privatization of government agencies is usually a good thing. Imagine how much better cal trans would operate if you relied on a private company to replace safety barriers. You’d have same day replacement.
That's not actually true. The first thing privatized public companies do is cut maintenance. This save the new private owners money, and service degrades. Always.
 

Cosmacelf

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2013
8,640
20,985
San Diego
That's not actually true. The first thing privatized public companies do is cut maintenance. This save the new private owners money, and service degrades. Always.

Really? UPS doesn’t maintain their trucks? Amazon doesn’t maintain their warehouses, or server buildings?
 

HVM

Savolainen
Oct 30, 2012
1,157
2,030
Finland
SpX can be easily claim that camera showing the engine bell or satellites are for telemetry; it's not so easy to say same for this:

40143096241_0324643b5e_o.jpg
 

HVM

Savolainen
Oct 30, 2012
1,157
2,030
Finland
"The National and Commercial Space Program Act requires a commercial remote sensing license for companies having the capacity to take an image of Earth while on orbit.


Now that launch companies are putting video cameras on stage 2 rockets that reach an on-orbit status, all such launches will be held to the requirements of the law and its conditions.


SpaceX applied and received a license from NOAA that included conditions on their capability to live-stream from space. Conditions on Earth imaging to protect national security are common to all licenses for launches with on-orbit capabilities."

http://www.noaa.gov/media-release/noaa-statement-on-todays-broadcast-of-spacex-iridium-5-launch

I think Starman images triggered this, and SpX didn't have time to file all the paper work for this launch.
 

Cosmacelf

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2013
8,640
20,985
San Diego
^^ Another thread, perhaps? While I love a great discussion on this, that's not the point of this thread.

As far as Iridium, I believe they should be pleased they get bonus advertising and recognition simply because they chose SpaceX as their transit provider. I even watched their propaganda video and walked away impressed that they analogized computer devices to Dr. Seuss' Thing 1 and 2. Maybe that was the wrong message to take :D

Good point. The huge amount of publicity every satellite company gets from a SpaceX launch is worth something. Maybe a hundred grand or something. Still kinda dwarfed by the lunch costs ($65m) :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: croman

S'toon

Knows where his towel is
Apr 23, 2015
3,702
3,644
AB
Really? UPS doesn’t maintain their trucks? Amazon doesn’t maintain their warehouses, or server buildings?
That's not what I said. I said the first thing once a government company is privatized, is the new owners stop spending money on maintenance. Always. It's estimated that after the UK privatized London's water utility, now approximately 1/3 of water is lost due to leaky pipes. Blackouts due to lack of line maintenance. Railroad derailings due to lack of track maintenance.
 

Nikxice

Active Member
Oct 31, 2014
1,117
1,890
Hudson, NH
So this whole controversy came to light only because SpaceX went to the NOAA to file a licensing application for the last Iridium mission. The article states that NOAA wasn't aware of other launches that had upper stage cameras onboard, nor had SpaceX previously filed for licensing. According to the NOAA Remote Sensing Director, “Our office is extremely small, and there’s a lot of things out there that we miss.” Yup, likely missed until someone looked up from their desk and noticed photos and video of a high flying car. Appreciate that NOAA is looking out for our national security by censoring distant earth photos from Space. Instead of pixelating those Roadster/Earth images, might suggest Kerbal. Hire some kid who could probably snooker the Russians. Here's an example that has so little detail you can barely detect the missile silo on the extreme right.o_O
kerbal roadster.png
 

About Us

Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.

Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


SUPPORT TMC
Top