Sure, but there are areas without net metering and also red tape/ delays involved in utility power agreements, A system that has the ability to not export could theoretically be commissioned in that mode much faster. When the system is allowed to export it does, when it is not it is still able to be used. Whether the cost of installing the system makes sense in that scenario is a case by case decision.
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Discussion: "Powerwall +"
- Thread starter willow_hiller
- Start date
I don't disagree that it will always be case-by-case and there might be some advantages with interconnections (though I am not entirely convinced utilities will see much of a difference.) I just think that talking about daily use minimizes the seasonal impact which is the bigger cost issue to assess when net metering is not available (whether due to the system installed or due to the utility's rules.)
... and just because Tesla can't use the Powerwall+ option in a few states doesn't mean they can't still use the Backup Gateway 2 design in those locations.
They are still going to be producing that hardware for the global market for a while at least, so it isn't just going to vanish overnight as an option were needed.
They are still going to be producing that hardware for the global market for a while at least, so it isn't just going to vanish overnight as an option were needed.
Well, that puts my theory to bed. Perhaps that just have supply constraints and are pulling from all the sources they have.
67kWh certainly seems like good production for a 12.2kW system.
PG&E and CPUC in California are incrementally chipping away at net metering anyway by moving more of the sunny hours to off-peak so it is much less beneficial than it used to be.
Tesla add softstarter device inside AC unit. Youtube video by Nature Calls shows a recent install
The PW+ spec mentions an integrated soft-start capability. Possible that there is space for breakers in the top PW+ gateway box and they can install an AC breaker there that runs from an integrated soft-start?
Can't remember if I read this or not but I asked about the new PW+ whilst dealing with some other stuff today. Was told that it is only for installs of 9.6 kW or less. Any solar install larger than that will use the Gateway + Inverters. Max stack of 2 additional batteries for a combined total of 3. Again, if you go more than that they use the Gateway not +.
Interesting, I chatted with rep this morning about install starting next week. Its a 6.55 kw solar roof with 3 PW's. This rep seemed moderately knowledgeable so who knows if everything he said is accurate. He said I'm getting the latest equipment (obviously he's going to say that in this context!), 'Powerwall 2'. When I said the previous one was called 'PW 2', he said 'no' that was just called PW and the new one is called 'PW2'. When I mentioned '+', he said that's called 'PW2' now. Clear as mud, right?
As far as capability improvements, he didn't mention increased power output, but said the new integrated set up enables much more seamless transition from grid to off grid. This makes sense based on what I understand of the new set up and does seem to address the issue I've heard about of less than seamless outages (ie resetting clocks, etc). Does this make sense to others?
If it does not allow sending back to grid, a non start for me, since I have NEM at the moment
What are you basing that on? He said it does, so one of you is mistaken. Losing that functionality would be insane on Tesla’s part, and for what reason would they design it that way? I find it hard to believe.
Not sure, but what I thought I read was the reason the new solution would install so easily, is since the solar ONLY went to the PW and NOT to the grid, lots less hassles about getting things approved and coded. But, just seems we have lots of opinions, and very little facts. Like 3 batteries? I have not seen this written on a Tesla document. And with the code changes in July, stacking any would be illegal, right Vines?
it is this quote from Elon you are thinking about I suspect:
“The difficulty of the installation will be much less. It will be much easier because the power from the solar roof, Solarglass Roof or the solar panels, will only ever go directly into the Powerwall. And the Powerwall will only ever go between the utility and the main power panel of the house, which means you never need to touch the main circuit breakers of the house.”
He is talking about the wiring rather than the energy flow I believe.
So the new system makes the electrical work easier, but he doesn't say anything about limits on grid export.
Fact: if the solar and/or battery can output power to the house and the house is connected to the grid, it can output power to the grid.*
*unless it's set up as an online UPS, which it isn't.
Thanks for clarifying. Elon (and this forum) have convoluted this issue way more than necessary it seems.
To be fair, half of what we've heard about the new Powerwalls have either come from earnings call mumblings or 140 character tweets.
Carl_Drogo
Member
Seriously. I'm literally trying to make a ~$60K+ decision about roofing and solar and all the communication is cryptic. It reminds me of ancient Chinese oracle bones where priests would divine the future by heating up the bones and interpreting the resulting cracks. I mean, would it be so hard for someone at Tesla to just write a few paragraphs on their website, or do an interview, or issue a press release. I don't need a 40 page white paper. Just some FAQs and a few paragraphs about the implications of the changes. Meanwhile I get emails and texts every few days from Tesla asking me to "accept" the contract with their price increase.
I guess I need to heat up some bones and consult a priest.
skepticcyclist
Member
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