Disney's current position regarding electric chargers

[BBryson]

What's everybody's guess on what will happen in the future when 20%+ of the cars are EVs?

Do we expect destinations like Walt Disney World to keep installing charging stations to keep up with all of the EVs?

Ideally yes, especially if there is a profit in it. But I'm not sure I can visualize that.

 

[Anzir]

Hollywood studios charging stations. Pictures taken in July, hopefully more progress complete but I haven’t been back to confirm.

Thanks for posting!

That is my daughter's favorite park. It would be great so we don't have to go north (to Supercharger) to go south. Next time someone is over that way, let us all know.

Hollywood Studios is not available and will not be for a while. They are revamping the whole parking lot as they get ready for the new gondola system between the parks. The EV chargers are behind a privacy fence right now. I'd give it another 4-5 months probably.

 

[Larry Chanin]

What's everybody's guess on what will happen in the future when 20%+ of the cars are EVs?

Do we expect destinations like Walt Disney World to keep installing charging stations to keep up with all of the EVs?

Ideally yes, especially if there is a profit in it. But I'm not sure I can visualize that.

Hi Bruce,

It's hard to say what Disney management will do and if they do, when they will "see the light". As the early posts on this thread show, historically they really haven't been the trail blazers for electric charging despite claiming to be environmentally conscious. They certainly haven't instituted a practice of free charging.

My prediction for the future is that relatively soon the EV driving public will view the electric charging amenity similarly to how we currently view free Wi-Fi services. That is, EV charging will be viewed as a basic and required amenity if you are going to stay at a hotel/resort. Those hotels/resorts that drag their feet will pay a price in lost revenue and Disney will have to adjust their practices sooner or later.

As I mentioned up thread, Universal Orlando management has a better grasp of the situation and their theme park is growing, so it is very likely that in the future Disney will lose market share of EV drivers to Universal. In terms of planning our Tesla club events, they've already lost tens of thousand of dollars of our business. We've already had two weekend events at Universal. One last year was our largest event ever in which we rented the conference center and had about 130 people in attendance with many staying at the Loews Royal Pacific resort for the weekend. We've never had an event at Disney and are not likely to have an event until Disney handles EV charging better.

Larry

 

[mociaf9]

What's everybody's guess on what will happen in the future when 20%+ of the cars are EVs?

Do we expect destinations like Walt Disney World to keep installing charging stations to keep up with all of the EVs?

Ideally yes, especially if there is a profit in it. But I'm not sure I can visualize that.

I expect places like Disney's parks to eventually move to installing the equivalent of block heater outlets, though maybe on 20A circuits, in wide swaths of their parking. So, in places where many people are likely to spend more than 4-6 hours parked, whole lots where each parking space has at least an L1 outlet it can plug into. It's not a perfect solution but would be a big improvement IMO without needing to break the bank on the cost to install.

 

[Larry Chanin]

I expect places like Disney's parks to eventually move to installing the equivalent of block heater outlets, though maybe on 20A circuits, in wide swaths of their parking. So, in places where many people are likely to spend more than 4-6 hours parked, whole lots where each parking space has at least an L1 outlet it can plug into. It's not a perfect solution but would be a big improvement IMO without needing to break the bank on the cost to install.

A number of years ago I spoke with the executive in charge of charging and made a similar argument regarding NEMA outlets. She was unmoved and basically said that Disney has their own way of doing things. I interpreted that to mean that they couldn't charge you for charging at at outlet.

Larry

 

[mociaf9]

A number of years ago I spoke with the executive in charge of charging and made a similar argument regarding NEMA outlets. She was unmoved and basically said that Disney has their own way of doing things. I interpreted that to mean that they couldn't charge you for charging at at outlet.

Larry

Sure, but this would be totally simple for this type of setup. They just make an entire, dedicated parking section all EV charging spaces with L1 outlets for each space. Frankly, I think trying to get 30A or 50A outlets at each one is unrealistic because the cost in infrastructure for widespread installation is going to be too high (i.e. wiring to support the higher currents is too expensive). So, in the realm of what I think is realistically achievable, the best bet would probably be NEMA 6-20 (240V/20A). Then, since people are already paying for parking when they go to the parks, Disney just charges extra for parking in the EV charging lot. Done. That recoups the infrastructure/maintenance/electricity costs and so long as they don't so overprice that they drive all the potential users to normal parking, they could even make money on it.

 

[Larry Chanin]

Sure, but this would be totally simple for this type of setup. They just make an entire, dedicated parking section all EV charging spaces with L1 outlets for each space. Frankly, I think trying to get 30A or 50A outlets at each one is unrealistic because the cost in infrastructure for widespread installation is going to be too high (i.e. wiring to support the higher currents is too expensive). So, in the realm of what I think is realistically achievable, the best bet would probably be NEMA 6-20 (240V/20A). Then, since people are already paying for parking when they go to the parks, Disney just charges extra for parking in the EV charging lot. Done. That recoups the infrastructure/maintenance/electricity costs and so long as they don't so overprice that they drive all the potential users to normal parking, they could even make money on it.

Makes sense, but based on Disney's historical position on charging, I am guessing that they are doomed to be following the leaders in this area rather than providing economical and innovative approaches.

Disney's risk management department is likely to view 240 volt outlets as more of a liability in terms of possible accidents involving children tappering, than more sophisticated and waterproof charging equipment.

Larry

 

[Anzir]

I don't understand why they wouldn't just partner with Chargepoint to do this. It would be a win-win for each company. That's who runs their (limited) charging right now.

 

[Racerx22b]

I don't understand why they wouldn't just partner with Chargepoint to do this. It would be a win-win for each company. That's who runs their (limited) charging right now.

Way to simple. Disney doesn't do simple.

They could also just call up Tesla and I am guessing they would get as many HPWCs as they wanted for all of their hotels and theme parks. But there is no money to be made on that so don't hold your breath.

 

[robaross]

Although there is money to be made that way because I no longer stay at a Disney resort, but usually book Bonnet Creek which has free J1772 in garage. The HPWC would bring me back to the resort hotels.

 

[viperboy]

Although there is money to be made that way because I no longer stay at a Disney resort, but usually book Bonnet Creek which has free J1772 in garage. The HPWC would bring me back to the resort hotels.

Bonnet Creek is a nice resort and so close. Also...way cheaper than staying on resort.

 

[Uncle Paul]

Disney might be waiting for wireless charging systems or a more standardized form of charging. With so many different EVs coming out soon and so many different plugs, it would be hard for them to predict what is needed to charge.

I would expect for Disney to change over to all electric tugs for their shuttle trains with their next replacements.

 

[DavidElg]

I don't understand why they wouldn't just partner with Chargepoint to do this. It would be a win-win for each company. That's who runs their (limited) charging right now.

It seems they have done this actually. Wilderness Lodge already has a couple of live and recently-added Chargepoint stations.

 

[brkaus]

Hi Bruce,

It's hard to say what Disney management will do and if they do, when they will "see the light". As the early posts on this thread show, historically they really haven't been the trail blazers for electric charging despite claiming to be environmentally conscious. They certainly haven't instituted a practice of free charging.

My prediction for the future is that relatively soon the EV driving public will view the electric charging amenity similarly to how we currently view free Wi-Fi services. That is, EV charging will be viewed as a basic and required amenity if you are going to stay at a hotel/resort. Those hotels/resorts that drag their feet will pay a price in lost revenue and Disney will have to adjust their practices sooner or later.

As I mentioned up thread, Universal Orlando management has a better grasp of the situation and their theme park is growing, so it is very likely that in the future Disney will lose market share of EV drivers to Universal. In terms of planning our Tesla club events, they've already lost tens of thousand of dollars of our business. We've already had two weekend events at Universal. One last year was our largest event ever in which we rented the conference center and had about 130 people in attendance with many staying at the Loews Royal Pacific resort for the weekend. We've never had an event at Disney and are not likely to have an event until Disney handles EV charging better.

Larry

I don't see a comparison between EV charging and WiFi. WiFi is relatively inexpensive to provide. There is a fixed overhead and they have pretty decent firewalls to load balance and keep one room from taking up the entire bandwidth. Lots of hotels still charge for upgraded speed. WiFi became free when hot-spots started to become affordable.

On the other hand, L2 charging would cost Disney $1-$2 per hour a car is parked and charging, depending on what electric rate they get.

Personally, I see free charging going away, except perhaps at work as a perk.

 

[jrreno]

It seems they have done this actually. Wilderness Lodge already has a couple of live and recently-added Chargepoint stations.

See #325 and #327 in this thread

 

[PJFW8]

I am willing to pay to charge. I look for convenience. What surprises me is that as I travel the country, it is easy to find resort hotels with destination chargers and even valet service. This is part of the expectation for better hotels. The Hilton properties are prime examples. Disney is simply not interested in supporting EV adoption. I have found that the staff of Disney resorts try to be helpful, but they have no charging resources available.

 

[robaross]

But are there not a ton of chargers in the parking garages at Disneyland? Why the disconnect between the two locations?

 

[Olle]

But are there not a ton of chargers in the parking garages at Disneyland? Why the disconnect between the two locations?

Because there are more EVs in CA of course, and perhaps a local incentive too?

 

[jrreno]

But are there not a ton of chargers in the parking garages at Disneyland? Why the disconnect between the two locations?

Two different management teams and surrounding environment.

 

[PJFW8]

But are there not a ton of chargers in the parking garages at Disneyland? Why the disconnect between the two locations?

True. At Disney World there are very few and often iced. (by a Prius Hybrid last time I tried) If you are at the Yacht Club, for example, the nearest are the 2 chargers at Epcot which are rarely available and not convenient. They are slow 30 amp chargers. Disney Springs is the next, but suffers from the same issues. This is a far cry from valet charging at the resort or destination charging that you reserve.