So if you are not the guy that is going to sue Tesla why did you title the thread:
"Do I just sue Tesla? ................
"Do I just sue Tesla? ................
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Do I just sue Tesla? New record for getting Powned
- Thread starter Zooomer
- Start date
Silicon Desert
Well-Known Member
Hmmmm, that is quite a stretch to say the car is faster, better regen,, and more efficient just because of a different 12v battery. Not buying that statement.
to everyone debating whether the 12v was right or not.. it's irrelevant. This service experience is atrocious. This is a new low for them. Tesla should never be delivering cars with massive issues like that, taking forever to respond, not being clear/honest about what's going on, being hard to talk to over the phone and holding peoples cars hostage. If there really is something wrong with this 12v they should be helping the owner fix it, not accuse them of wrongdoing. This is really bad for the future of Tesla
Tesla does not think so , they operate in a complete bubble with no regard for the customer experience and arrogance for future sales. As a significant shareholder their behavior is pathetic and shows how poorly they are managed. My experience with them recently makes this look like red carpet treatment. I plan to have my day with them soon and I would bet many owners have legitimate cases against them but do not take action from lack of time or the BS arbitration clause they hide behind. In many cases service people and front line CS people are being treated like puppets by Tesla management and it's pretty disgusting.
yes. Later I posted I've calmed down.
If you tell someone you shed 1000# off the car they'd *sugar* and it would be a track monster. Tell them you shed 10# and they claim it makes no difference at all. It's weird. Of course it makes a difference. It's just a math equation. I'm not here telling everyone else to do it. I'm just telling you why I did. I did lighter rims. Next are carbon brakes. Said and done I'll shed over 100#Hmmmm, that is quite a stretch to say the car is faster, better regen,, and more efficient just because of a different 12v battery. Not buying that statement.
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How does reducing weight improve regen? If anything reducing weight reduces your regen potential. (Though you also would have used less energy to get to that speed.)
P85DBeast
Side tEsLa
The OP changing out the 12V is the reason Tesla isn't fixing his car under warranty, so its not really irrelevant to converse about him changing out the 12V because that's the problem here....Do I believe that Tesla is wrong in this situation? Yes and I also believe that they should be helping OP fix his car but Tesla being Tesla that's not happening! They are also terribly wrong for delivering cars with issues but since OP changed his 12V (on his personal vehicle which he can do as he pleases with because its HIS) Tesla is denying him. I personally can see where Tesla is coming from (not fixing his car under warranty) and where the OP is coming from.
Can't really add anything to the what's being said about the OP's situation.
But, I think there are some lessons to be learned.
Always make sure you can contact the service center directly by email or by phone/txt. Don't rely on the app or the hotline.
Accept the fact that loaners are basically history, and that's been pretty common place for awhile now. They normally offer something like a
rental car. Or in my case it's usually lyft credits since I'm fairly close.
Don't modify a broken car in any shape or form. Get it back to the service center ASAP even it means just turning around on the way home, and dropping it off. You want to be able to return it within the 7 day return policy (if applicable).
When it comes to a cracked windshield or other glass RIGHT after delivery I would suggest really pushing for Tesla to replace it due to a manufacturing defect. Unless it's obvious that a rock did it.
But, I think there are some lessons to be learned.
Always make sure you can contact the service center directly by email or by phone/txt. Don't rely on the app or the hotline.
Accept the fact that loaners are basically history, and that's been pretty common place for awhile now. They normally offer something like a
rental car. Or in my case it's usually lyft credits since I'm fairly close.
Don't modify a broken car in any shape or form. Get it back to the service center ASAP even it means just turning around on the way home, and dropping it off. You want to be able to return it within the 7 day return policy (if applicable).
When it comes to a cracked windshield or other glass RIGHT after delivery I would suggest really pushing for Tesla to replace it due to a manufacturing defect. Unless it's obvious that a rock did it.
Ostrichsak
Well-Known Member
Imagine you are pulling a loaded trailer and you let off accelerator to regen. You won't be able to tell the vehicle even has regen because @ 60KW of regen the energy stored by the moving weight is so high that 60KW doesn't matter much. Now flip that example. You have a moped with 60KW of regen. It would stop instantly.
To put another way. You have 60KW of acceleration power. Does your acceleration improve or get worse when you lighten the vehicle? Regen is the same thing.
Thursday update: They have not responded. I don't know if the vehicle is fixed, they have not sent a picture of the battery from a distance where I can even tell if it's connected. I next day aired them all original parts. I do not want them installed but I don't want to drag this out either. They said they replaced the rear door seal which was not even a problem so they have ignored the issue as I pointed it out and marked the car with. IDK if they have even repaired the roof which was the majority of the problem to start with.
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Wrong, you said more regen you do not get more regen with less weight that is just false. You may stop sooner with less regen but you do not get more regen. That is the point of regen to recapture wasted energy and a moped will have less stored energy mass going down a hill than a 4000 pound EV. Sorry that makes no sense.
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Uncle Paul
Well-Known Member
Sounds like you are on a path to resolution. Your post is an alert to all of us, that we are always going to be on the hook if we replace OEM components on a highly connected car with non standard parts...even if they are an improvement in our eyes.
I used to sell surgical machines. Lots of liability on the line. If the end user decided to make "improvements" on our designs, the liability transfered instantly and fully to them. Not saying it was not done, but surgeons knew that they needed to leave things as designed and approved by FDA. They were brilliant people, and liked to tinker, but they knew where they should not venture.
I used to sell surgical machines. Lots of liability on the line. If the end user decided to make "improvements" on our designs, the liability transfered instantly and fully to them. Not saying it was not done, but surgeons knew that they needed to leave things as designed and approved by FDA. They were brilliant people, and liked to tinker, but they knew where they should not venture.
This is something known to almost anyone that routinely modifies cars particularly being in the business. An EV 12V battery can have different concerns than an ICE, on a LEAF you must connect to the battery only in a certain location. Regardless something on the electrical system is a red flag when there is an issue and many people mess up the car doing such installations and then take it to the dealer. IN this case it was not know there was an issue but may have been something done that cause an issue when the tech touched it, so the blame defaults to the modification which makes complete sense. I have been in the EV industry a long time and dealers will always point blame to am electrical modification when they don't know the issue. I have been on the phone explaining how some things could never damage a charging system unless it was designed to do so. One can not blame a dealer for this as they work off standards unless they blame your wrap for your main contactor arcing and failing.
I gave examples to illustrate what I was referring to. More regen BRAKING. That is what I meant.
What else would weight have to do with it and why would someone care about storing more energy by having a heavier vehicle? Unless you could add the weight at the top of the hill, you're always losing because you have to accelerate the mass before recapturing via regen and you only capture ~70%. So a lighter vehicle will always be more efficient, brake faster, handle better and use less energy in any accel/decel situation.
In terms of being responsible for modifying the vehicle, I think people are getting off topic. If the car's charging system blew up of course I would be responsible for it as I 'modified' the system. But in this case it appears that the tech simply disconnected the battery and claimed it was bad to charge me. The fuse isn't blown so we have possible proof they were lying about that. As things unfold we'll see. If the battery blew up mysteriously after 2 years at the exact time the tech was messing with the car then whatever. I'll eat it. Just like I did the windshield. Obviously I'm not a customer just arguing to argue because I don't want to pay. I already agreed to pay $1200 for a piece of glass that was questionably their responsibility.
I have worked on many Teslas, you do not understand how service works and you don't have the facts. You also are unclear here, you posted more regen not more regen braking. You really should be more clear and one word does not require a page of examples you simply need to use the correct words.
Technially I think he said better regen not more. (But I still don't see how a lighter 12v battery gets you better regen.)
Enlighten me. What facts don't I have?
I'm sorry me saying 'better regen' offends you. The statement is true. You get better regen performance. EVDRVN maybe you're angry because you misread the post and are arguing against something I didn't say. Go back to page one. I did not say 'more' regen. I said 'better regen'
It's physics. With the regen KW remaining fixed, a lighter car will slow down in a shorter distance.
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I think what he is trying to say is that the heavier car will have more kinetic energy, thus the time required to brake the car will necessarily be more than a lighter car. Assuming all stays the same, that **duration** of longer braking will produce more regenerative energy, again assuming the braking algorithm is the same for both heavy and lighter cars..
