davidc18
Active Member
The cars are extremely responsive to pedal pressure and super easy to control I have never understood using 'creep' mode.
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Do you keep Creep on or off?
- Thread starter shah007
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
The cars are extremely responsive to pedal pressure and super easy to control I have never understood using 'creep' mode.
I can't believe how many people have it turned off. I turned it on from delivery and never tried anything else. I guess I'm missing out!
I've been experimenting with Off for a week or two. I'm off mixed minds. I like Off better in normal driving - regen slows you down further and you need the brakes less, though it won't completely stop the car.
My parking experience has been mixed, with a few places where I'm convinced On would have been easier/quicker, but nothing really challenging came up as a result of using Off so far.
Kipernicus
Model S Res#P1440
Creep is akin to early automobile manufacturers installing a horse-fart feature because "that's what people are used to"
Maybe it's days are numbered.
Like who wants to have a button called "Creep" anyway? That's just creepy!
Maybe when the Tesla big data machine does its fleet analysis and finds 0.01 percent using a feature... it's voted off the island for next release. There will be no lost sales because of it. Nobody will miss it. OK, maybe 5 people per year will miss it.
Use it or lose it people!
Like who wants to have a button called "Creep" anyway? That's just creepy!
Maybe when the Tesla big data machine does its fleet analysis and finds 0.01 percent using a feature... it's voted off the island for next release. There will be no lost sales because of it. Nobody will miss it. OK, maybe 5 people per year will miss it.
Use it or lose it people!
JenniferQ
Active Member
Yes, I suppose. I like the improved regen with the latest update. I suppose regen while braking is what I'd really like. I still don't understand why we can't have that...
WannabeOwner
Well-Known Member
1. It's very complex.
2. Brake feel is very poor.
3. It's far better on the accelerator.
4. It can't be a preference toggle because of the all the additional hardware required for pedal simulation which can't be turned off. Once you have it, it's there for good.
I can't see why anyone would want that. Toyota has had major recalls because of the complexity and poor brake feel.
grichard
Member De-Luxe
I'm just guessing, but I think she means:
If you push the brake pedal, the brake pads will inevitably start squeezing the rotors. This happens even when the car is slowing gently enough that it's shedding energy at < 70 kW. She wishes that pushing the pedal slowed the car by making the regeneration more aggressive (if possible) before it started to apply the physical brakes.
A system which does that is always complicated, and so far none of them deliver great pedal feel or consistent braking response.
To make a blended regeneration system, you need the computer to independently control the two kinds of braking and set levels of each that combine to match what the user pressing the pedal desires.
That means the brake pedal can't directly actuate the hydraulic brakes immediately when you press it - the computer needs some portion of the travel to use for regeneration. So you need a system that resists your pushing the pedal to make it feel like you're hitting the brakes at the same time the computer ramps up regeneration or electronically engages the brake pads. Getting this combination of two braking systems and a false feel simulator to seem natural under all types of conditions is very, very difficult.
To meet federal regulations, you also need the ability to brake the car with all the electronics failed. Most blended systems address this with an extremely long pedal travel, and a mechanical connection to the master cylinder at the bottom of the pedal.
My experience with a blended system on the Volt was that the time it takes to start regenerating made for a disturbing braking experience - you'd hit the pedal, and a quarter second later the car would start braking. That's one reason I always drove in L - the car started regenerating as soon as I lifted off the accelerator, and the brake pedal felt much more natural as a result. Because regen was only on the front wheels, going over a pothole while braking was very disturbing - the traction control would cut the regen as the wheel started spinning, and the car would seem to surge ahead.
The hydraulic booster system Tesla used before autopilot was compatible with such changes - in fact, my understanding is that it is fundamentally the same as the system on Chevrolet Volts which do have blended brakes.
Tesla switched to the iBooster for Autopilot, saying it was a necessary precondition because the system responded three times faster than any other automatic braking system to date - able to apply 100% braking effort in 125 milliseconds.
The iBooster is basically a large electric motor hooked to the brake master cylinder, and applies the brakes by pulling the pedal down/helping you push the pedal down. That makes a blended system impractical as far as I can tell.
So that's why you can't have it - Tesla would have to spend a bunch of money to redesign the whole braking system and accept both worse pedal feel and substantially longer response times in Autopilot to give it to you.
Pezpunk
Active Member
creep off. when i bought the car, i turned it on, and i assumed i would prefer the ICE-like ability to release the brake and creep forwards in situations such as the drive-through or stopped traffic.
but the reality is, controlling the Tesla with the throttle is so much more instantaneous and precise than with an ICE, that creep just makes it harder instead of easier to control at very low speeds.
plus, once you get used to it, not having to hold the brake while stopped is great.
but the reality is, controlling the Tesla with the throttle is so much more instantaneous and precise than with an ICE, that creep just makes it harder instead of easier to control at very low speeds.
plus, once you get used to it, not having to hold the brake while stopped is great.
I have tried both and now leave it on.
When I am going to be stopped for any length of time, I use hill hold and then just let off the brake. When the light turns green I just have to hit the accelerator. So this method is a little like having creep on and off.
When I am going to be stopped for any length of time, I use hill hold and then just let off the brake. When the light turns green I just have to hit the accelerator. So this method is a little like having creep on and off.
I always thought the presence of manual brakes on a Tesla was for (i) emergency braking; (ii) speeds under 7km/h and (iii) obvious regulatory requirements.
On creep: I overall prefer the feeling of using only the right pedal above 7km/h (with standard regen level) and only the left pedal under that speed. To me that is comfortable one-pedal driving. At a red light the car will not creep (thanks to the 'golf-cart-like' mechanism they invented in (I think) the 7.1 software update - simply push the brake firmly and creep will disengage until you hit the accelerator).
To creep or not to creep is not a big question though imo; I'm sure anyone would become fan of either method if forced to use it for three weeks in a row!
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