xilex
Model P3D
It's good because the car that's trying to race you thinks you're a slow poke but then you let it rip a second later and they're embarrassed.
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Does anyone else feel like the first 0-10mph are limited in the M3P?
- Thread starter Drizzle
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- acceleration
skitown
Member
I agree. I have an 85D and an AWD Model 3. I feel like the 85D’s launches from 0-10 are far more “violent”. (In a good way). But the Model 3 seems to shine more relatively above 20-30 mph. It’s curious how different this torque is. I didn’t expect it.
Pretty sure there's more coming for P3D. It wouldn't make sense for them to launch it all at once, since Model 3 is still the best in its class on pretty much all metrics. There are competitors coming out with cars that are wanting to match Model 3's specs. So I would expect Tesla to do something like ludicrous mode when they need to.
Right now I think Tesla's being careful about making Model 3 too good, since Model S is still their flagship moneymaker.
Right now I think Tesla's being careful about making Model 3 too good, since Model S is still their flagship moneymaker.
HeatproofGenie
Member
When is MS redesign due?
Maybe M3 will be unleashed when Porsche releases Taycan? Then Tesla could say that both M3P and M3D are faster than Taycan. Only thing Taycan will have that's better is the crazy fast charge time. Of course there needs to be infrastructure to support that charge rate and I don't see that being widely rolled out.
Maybe M3 will be unleashed when Porsche releases Taycan? Then Tesla could say that both M3P and M3D are faster than Taycan. Only thing Taycan will have that's better is the crazy fast charge time. Of course there needs to be infrastructure to support that charge rate and I don't see that being widely rolled out.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
Yep. Probably slows it down.
Need to go with 15s and a small diameter tire next time, might be cheap! Just remove the brake calipers as @Daniel in SD suggested. Best 0-60 EVER. Definitely best 0-30 at least. We need to see this result in the P3D as well as the LR!
You’ll want to do the calculations for projected acceleration, to see if you need to splurge on a summer compound - MXM4-like compound might be getting close to the traction limit for a small enough diameter!
With these small diameter tires it’ll be so low too. Will look super sweet.
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I've often wondered if less torque at 1 rpm is a drawback of the PM motor vs an induction motor.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
Hi, I have some preliminary data from my P3D+ using a VBOX. It's preliminary because I'd like to do a couple more runs and modify a few things.
Conditions:
Software 2018.46.2
Vehicle Odometer: 650 miles
Modifications: None. (P3D+ Oct 2018)
Outside temperature: 57F
Surface: San Diego asphalt, good condition, a few years old.
Slope: Downhill 3 feet according to VBOX
Winds: Calm
Tire pressure: 41PSI
90% SOC
HOLD not turned on. Just brought car to a stop before starting.
Climate control OFF.
Creep OFF.
Sport Mode
Run (excluding 1 foot rollout) was 3.36sec. The VBOX data summary removes the1 foot rollout time, but the plot of Speed vs. Time is unaffected and shows the full 0-60 including the first foot. You can see from the plot that true 0-60 was about 3.65 sec.
I was showing a few bars of "regen limited" since the battery was at 55 degrees and/or relatively high SoC.
This was allegedly downhill 3ft. Another thing I would like to take another shot at is getting rid of this. The road appeared completely flat to me. I can run the other direction at some point or find the actual flat section.
I haven't downloaded the raw data and plotted acceleration vs. time. However, acceleration is just the slope of this line which is clearly very constant until about 45mph. (I added a line to make it clear how constant the acceleration is.)
0-20: 1.14 sec
20-40: 1.12 sec
40-60: 1.39 sec
So, it appears there there is no significant limitation from 0-10mph. Specifically the peak acceleration (about 0.8-0.85G) seems to be reached before even 5mph. The 1ft rollout according to the VBOX took 0.27sec -> x = 1/2 *a *t^2 so a = 8.36m/s^2 (0.85G).
To me it did "seem" like the initial acceleration was less on this particular run, but that is NOT consistent with the data. So the way we feel must just be a psychological thing, or something about human perception of acceleration. Maybe acceleration has to be sustained for a while before it really feels like acceleration? Because there is no limitation in the first 0-10mph...
Conditions:
Software 2018.46.2
Vehicle Odometer: 650 miles
Modifications: None. (P3D+ Oct 2018)
Outside temperature: 57F
Surface: San Diego asphalt, good condition, a few years old.
Slope: Downhill 3 feet according to VBOX
Winds: Calm
Tire pressure: 41PSI
90% SOC
HOLD not turned on. Just brought car to a stop before starting.
Climate control OFF.
Creep OFF.
Sport Mode
Run (excluding 1 foot rollout) was 3.36sec. The VBOX data summary removes the1 foot rollout time, but the plot of Speed vs. Time is unaffected and shows the full 0-60 including the first foot. You can see from the plot that true 0-60 was about 3.65 sec.
I was showing a few bars of "regen limited" since the battery was at 55 degrees and/or relatively high SoC.
This was allegedly downhill 3ft. Another thing I would like to take another shot at is getting rid of this. The road appeared completely flat to me. I can run the other direction at some point or find the actual flat section.
I haven't downloaded the raw data and plotted acceleration vs. time. However, acceleration is just the slope of this line which is clearly very constant until about 45mph. (I added a line to make it clear how constant the acceleration is.)
0-20: 1.14 sec
20-40: 1.12 sec
40-60: 1.39 sec
So, it appears there there is no significant limitation from 0-10mph. Specifically the peak acceleration (about 0.8-0.85G) seems to be reached before even 5mph. The 1ft rollout according to the VBOX took 0.27sec -> x = 1/2 *a *t^2 so a = 8.36m/s^2 (0.85G).
To me it did "seem" like the initial acceleration was less on this particular run, but that is NOT consistent with the data. So the way we feel must just be a psychological thing, or something about human perception of acceleration. Maybe acceleration has to be sustained for a while before it really feels like acceleration? Because there is no limitation in the first 0-10mph...
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Mo City
Active Member
My AWD Model 3 definitely seems "nerfed" from 0-20. Above that, the car is plenty "violent" enough for me.
Surprised to read these thoughts about P3Ds.
Surprised to read these thoughts about P3Ds.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
Pretty sure the AWD is very similar (just lower acceleration/torque than P3D), and not nerfed from 0-20, in fact it has maximum acceleration from 0-20, same as P3D, but we'll try to gather similar data.
Jeff Hudson
Lovin the Tesla Life
Thanks for the data AlanSubie4Life and putting to rest the seat-of-our-pants feel vs the actual performance. I for one am very pleased the initial roll does not feel as violent as the Model S P100D although in all honesty I have never actually felt the Model S P100D Ludicrous acceleration. I did get to drive a Tesla Loaner Model X P100DL but I was in traffic most of the time and only toed the accelerator for a second a few times to get the feel and yes it felt more violent / fierce than my Model 3P+. IMO, the Model 3P+ acceleration feels much more refined and fun to tap in to.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
Apparently peak acceleration in a P100DL (probably an S though?) is closer to 1.4G rather than the weak-sauce 0.8G of the P3D.
So that would feel more refined I think!
SoccerMan94043
Member
I have a 2016 Model S 75D that has been updated with the performance software update (free thing a year or so back). I also have a Model 3 AWD (long range battery).
The performance off the line is definitely being throttled on the Model 3, when compared to the Model S; the Model S is smooth and consistent (and fast) while you can feel the pause and then the push when it finally is released in the Model 3. I assume this is to show a value difference between the two.
The performance off the line is definitely being throttled on the Model 3, when compared to the Model S; the Model S is smooth and consistent (and fast) while you can feel the pause and then the push when it finally is released in the Model 3. I assume this is to show a value difference between the two.
AlanSubie4Life
Efficiency Obsessed Member
It may feel this way, but the data shows that the acceleration is consistent for the Model 3 as well. And there is no throttling off the line.
That is not to say it could not be uncorked. More torque might be possible all the way to 40mph, until the power limit is reached. But not yet!
Great stuff, thank you! I'm not super familiar with how VBOX works, but would it be possible for you to get data with the car "cruising" at like 20-30 MPH and then you floor the accelerator up to 60? Asking because when i do this in my car, it feels more violent than the 0-60 run but not sure if it's just my imagination.
I believe what we are getting at is that there is a certain g-force threshold before we actually feel a "jerk". ICE cars have that jerk in first gear to make up for shifting, and they get more g-force off the line because of that... I believe.
Do you mind measuring the g-forces starting at 20, 30 and 40? 30-40 feels the tingliest to me after plenty of "tests".
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